Fulmers still in Denial

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#51
#51
(hatvol96 @ Mar 6 said:
8-4 at a program with UT's resources, if that isn't bad or terrible, you can see it from there.
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You know, there are a lot of programs with UT's resources. I can think of 8 or 9 in the SEC, and all the power conferences have several as well. 5-6 sucks. 8-4? I hope for more, but I'm realistic enough to think that the program will go through 4 year periods that look like that.

(rockytopscott @ Mar 6 said:
It's almost as bad/old as the Florida fans and "Vol fans don't have all their teeth!!"
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There is a radio commercial in my area that is designed to promote good dentistry amongst Kentucky residents. It claims that Kentucky leads the nation in adult population without all their natural teeth. If I were king of the state, that is not the image I would want to convey to the populous in a government sponsored add, but I can't seem to get my hands on the crown. As for me, I have all of my teeth in my head save four, as my wisdom teeth are in an envelope somewhere in the back of a drawer.
 
#52
#52
(cotton @ Mar 6 said:
You know, there are a lot of programs with UT's resources. I can think of 8 or 9 in the SEC, and all the power conferences have several as well. 5-6 sucks. 8-4? I hope for more, but I'm realistic enough to think that the program will go through 4 year periods that look like that.
There is a radio commercial in my area that is designed to promote good dentistry amongst Kentucky residents. It claims that Kentucky leads the nation in adult population without all their natural teeth. If I were king of the state, that is not the image I would want to convey to the populous in a government sponsored add, but I can't seem to get my hands on the crown. As for me, I have all of my teeth in my head save four, as my wisdom teeth are in an envelope somewhere in the back of a drawer.
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Look at the athletic budgets. There aren't nine teams in the SEC that come close. Florida, Alabama, UGA, and to a lesser extent LSU and Auburn. The Mississippi schools, South Carolina, Arkansas, Kentucky, and Vanderbilt aren't even in the same zip code. Texas and OU are the only programs close to our spending in the Big 12. The ACC maybe has UNC and Florida State. The PAC 10, once you factor out Phil Knight's money to the track program at Oregon, doesn't have anyone who spends on the big 2 sports like we do. The Big 10 has a bunch of schools with bad facilities losing money. Only OSU, Michigan, and possibly Penn State can really compete from a facilities and economic perspective.
 
#53
#53
(hatvol96 @ Mar 6 said:
Look at the athletic budgets. There aren't nine teams in the SEC that come close. Florida, Alabama, UGA, and to a lesser extent LSU and Auburn. The Mississippi schools, South Carolina, Arkansas, Kentucky, and Vanderbilt aren't even in the same zip code. Texas and OU are the only programs close to our spending in the Big 12. The ACC maybe has UNC and Florida State. The PAC 10, once you factor out Phil Knight's money to the track program at Oregon, doesn't have anyone who spends on the big 2 sports like we do. The Big 10 has a bunch of schools with bad facilities losing money. Only OSU, Michigan, and possibly Penn State can really compete from a facilities and economic perspective.
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and with the exception of last year penn state has been HORRIBLE but if you had it your way you would have axed Joe Pa, one of the greatest football coaches EVER several years ago, because of the rough times he went through and michigan hasn't really done much to impress anybody lately either, if my memory serves me correctly they got beat by a recovering nebraska team in their bowl game this year so just because you have the finances and facilities doesn't in any way guarantee 10+ seasons every year. i dont believe pete carroll just all of a sudden started winning nat'l championships, it took him some "down" 8 win seasons to get his program where it is at now
 
#54
#54
(IBleedOrange @ Mar 6 said:
and with the exception of last year penn state has been HORRIBLE but if you had it your way you would have axed Joe Pa, one of the greatest football coaches EVER several years ago, because of the rough times he went through and michigan hasn't really done much to impress anybody lately either, if my memory serves me correctly they got beat by a recovering nebraska team in their bowl game this year so just because you have the finances and facilities doesn't in any way guarantee 10+ seasons every year. i dont believe pete carroll just all of a sudden started winning nat'l championships, it took him some "down" 8 win seasons to get his program where it is at now
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Carroll went 6-5 his first season. Since then he's strung together 11-2, 12-1(NC),13-0(NC), and 11-1. So, if Fulmer runs off 47 or so wins in the next 4 years, he'll be in Carroll's class.
 
#55
#55
(IBleedOrange @ Mar 6 said:
and with the exception of last year penn state has been HORRIBLE but if you had it your way you would have axed Joe Pa, one of the greatest football coaches EVER several years ago, because of the rough times he went through and michigan hasn't really done much to impress anybody lately either, if my memory serves me correctly they got beat by a recovering nebraska team in their bowl game this year so just because you have the finances and facilities doesn't in any way guarantee 10+ seasons every year. i dont believe pete carroll just all of a sudden started winning nat'l championships, it took him some "down" 8 win seasons to get his program where it is at now
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I couldn't care less if Joe Paterno is fired tomorrow or if he coaches another 10 years. As a matter of fact, if Penn State drops football I really wouldn't care.
 
#57
#57
:banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

these threads hurt my head. I can see both points of views here, but I tend to side with fulmer is going to turn it around. I mean If you seriously dont like fulmer and his offensive philosophy, then how are you a vol fan. He has been here for so long now, and I mean, have you guys always hated it or is it just since we have had qb's incapable to run the offense??
 
#58
#58
(hatvol96 @ Mar 6 said:
Carroll went 6-5 his first season. Since then he's strung together 11-2, 12-1(NC),13-0(NC), and 11-1. So, if Fulmer runs off 47 or so wins in the next 4 years, he'll be in Carroll's class.
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Fulmer won 45 from 1995-1998. If Carroll sticks around long enough, he will likely experience some down years as well.

I'm not prepared to wait it out for as long as Penn St. did with Paterno, but I think Fulmer deserves at least another year to try to get things back on track.
 
#59
#59
i'll stick with my usual response, we haven't won the sec since 98 that is sad. i'm beginning to wonder along with alot of other people if fulmer is just a overated coach. i guess next year will tell. i would like to see us win another sec championship in the next couple of decades. if he can't do it he needs to step aside and let somebody else try.
 
#61
#61
Fulmer deserves another year, but quite frankly I am tired of the excuses of why we haven't won an SEC championship in 7 years and why we are going to third tier crap bowl games. 8 win seasons don't cut it. Neither do 10 win seasons where you get hammered by Georgia at home and Auburn on the road.

If we are to be satisfied with 9 and 10 win seasons where we really don't win anything that can be put in a trophy case, why are we paying out $2 million + a year?
 
#63
#63
hatvol

you better go look again at what some schools have, especially within the SEC.

UT only wishes they had the practice facilities in football that LSU has

UF has a bigger athletic budget than UT

Alabama and UGA are close to UT's budget

In the football arms race UT is barely in the top 15%
 
#64
#64
hatvol

you better go look again at what some schools have, especially within the SEC.

UT only wishes they had the practice facilities in football that LSU has

UF has a bigger athletic budget than UT

Alabama and UGA are close to UT's budget

In the football arms race UT is barely in the top 15%
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[/quote
I'd be happy if the just finished in the top 15!!
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#65
#65
(Vol67 @ Mar 7 said:
hatvol

you better go look again at what some schools have, especially within the SEC.

UT only wishes they had the practice facilities in football that LSU has

UF has a bigger athletic budget than UT

Alabama and UGA are close to UT's budget

In the football arms race UT is barely in the top 15%
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Adding those up, it comes to four. My response was to a post that said 8 or 9 schools in the SEC had the same resources UT did. Given the status of finances in the state of Louisiana, it's a good thing their facility is already built. A declining revenue stream, coupled with a reorganization of people's priorities, will almost certainly put a hurting on LSU's donor dollars. Also, if our esteemed head coach thought an upgrade in practice facilities was needed, he could talk to the AD to get the bucks for that instead of the ridiculous stadium "upgrades." I'm not surprised UF has a larger budget, I mentioned that in the post. However, I would be interested to see how much of that budget is attributable to olympic, non revenue sports. UA and UGA are "close?' That's pure Fulmerspeak for they don't spend as much. If they spend as much fine, but close is irrelevant. Also, while they may have a better practice facility, I can't say, didn't go to the game in Baton Rouge this year and I'm going to assume you're not talking about the facilities I saw when we played there in 2000, I'm certain our academic center and other facilities are better or equal to theirs. So, you have one school possibly spending more money and one with comparable facilities. Do the results on the field bear that out? The answer is a resounding no. Giving your premise credence, which is a stretch, my initial comment was that consistent 4 loss seasons are unacceptable for a program with UT's resources. Granting a loss to Florida and the occasional loss to LSU, where do the rest of the losses come from?
 
#66
#66
(Vol67 @ Mar 7 said:
hatvol

you better go look again at what some schools have, especially within the SEC.

UT only wishes they had the practice facilities in football that LSU has

UF has a bigger athletic budget than UT

Alabama and UGA are close to UT's budget

In the football arms race UT is barely in the top 15%
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All those schools you just named; Bama, UGA, LSU, and UF, who has the highest paid football coach among them? That would be Fulmer.
 
#68
#68
how much we spend or the amount of resources we have doesn't guarentee W's on the feild. it never will. It will and has helped us get our program to the point, as we are now, where we can compete with upper echilon programs. but to say because we have resources or spent this amount of money, we should beat those teams that have less each and every time is, well, a bit on the ridiculous side.

And as to who is the highest paid coach, well, it should be Fulmer imo. i don't necessarily think he should have gotten a few of those raises he got in the early 00's, but nonetheless, prior to that, he did earn his money.

Of the group of coaches Oklavol mentions, Mark Richt is the longest tenured, with 2 SEC titles. same as Fulmer. and Fulmer has the NC in his belt. and i'm not reliving anything there....it's just a statement of fact. CPF has one, none of the other guys on that list do. that's all. that should warrant some sort of pay grade above other coaches in your same league that haven't accomplished as much. CPF, with the exception of Spurrier, has accomplished more than any other current coach in the SEC.

Besides, i think most people are missing the point anyway. the one thing Fulmer has going for him, or against him depending on what camp you're in, is that the guys on this staff are "his" guys. if he succeeds with him, it will go down as some good decision making by CPF. on the same token, if we suck out loud next season, well, they're your guys Phil. what gives? This will all take care of itself.
 
#69
#69
(jakez4ut @ Mar 7 said:
Besides, i think most people are missing the point anyway. the one thing Fulmer has going for him, or against him depending on what camp you're in, is that the guys on this staff are "his" guys. if he succeeds with him, it will go down as some good decision making by CPF. on the same token, if we suck out loud next season, well, they're your guys Phil. what gives? This will all take care of itself.
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Spurrier won an NC at Florida, and Holt won one at Notre Dame. Saban also won one at LSU. I think Richt has finished the seasons ranked 6 or higher in all but 2 seasons at Ga I believe.

 
#70
#70
(JasonCajun @ Mar 6 said:
Fulmer deserves another year, but quite frankly I am tired of the excuses of why we haven't won an SEC championship in 7 years and why we are going to third tier crap bowl games. 8 win seasons don't cut it. Neither do 10 win seasons where you get hammered by Georgia at home and Auburn on the road.
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show me one coach that meets that criteria
 
#71
#71
(oklavol @ Mar 7 said:
Spurrier won an NC at Florida, and Holt won one at Notre Dame. Saban also won one at LSU. I think Richt has finished the seasons ranked 6 or higher in all but 2 seasons at Ga I believe.
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Well, like i said, BESIDES Spurrier, CPF has accomplished more than any othe coach CURRENTLY in the SEC.

Saban's was a split title, and he's not CURRENTLY in the SEC.. (and wasn't Saban making $2million a year anyway?) Holtz's wasn't while he was a coach in the SEC. He only got to two decent bowl games the entire time he was at USC and he never beat UT. And he's not CURRENTLY in the SEC.

And congrats on Richt finishing in the top 6. :biggrin2:

 
#72
#72
(jakez4ut @ Mar 7 said:
how much we spend or the amount of resources we have doesn't guarentee W's on the feild. it never will. It will and has helped us get our program to the point, as we are now, where we can compete with upper echilon programs. but to say because we have resources or spent this amount of money, we should beat those teams that have less each and every time is, well, a bit on the ridiculous side.

And as to who is the highest paid coach, well, it should be Fulmer imo. i don't necessarily think he should have gotten a few of those raises he got in the early 00's, but nonetheless, prior to that, he did earn his money.

Of the group of coaches Oklavol mentions, Mark Richt is the longest tenured, with 2 SEC titles. same as Fulmer. and Fulmer has the NC in his belt. and i'm not reliving anything there....it's just a statement of fact. CPF has one, none of the other guys on that list do. that's all. that should warrant some sort of pay grade above other coaches in your same league that haven't accomplished as much. CPF, with the exception of Spurrier, has accomplished more than any other current coach in the SEC.

Besides, i think most people are missing the point anyway. the one thing Fulmer has going for him, or against him depending on what camp you're in, is that the guys on this staff are "his" guys. if he succeeds with him, it will go down as some good decision making by CPF. on the same token, if we suck out loud next season, well, they're your guys Phil. what gives? This will all take care of itself.
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I didn't say we should beat them "each and every time", just often enough that we don't end up 8-4.
 
#73
#73
but we can't finish 8-4 at all...it's completely unacceptable...not with our resources. :victory:
 
#75
#75
(mattvols @ Mar 7 said:
show me one coach that meets that criteria
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See Carroll, Pete and Stoops, Bob. Stoops has two seasons under 10 wins, 1999(his first year), which he followed up with a National Championship, and this year. Carroll went 6-5 his first year, and has won no fewer than 11 games in any season since.
 
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