Game Thread: (11/12) Lady Vols 63 - UCLA. 80

[glv98]

This team was ranked 5th in the country..to get beaten like they have is not good. How can you not question Kjh? She can recruit....sure but I seriously question her ability to coach.

Preseason rankings mean nothing. Why anyone would rank a Tennessee team that high is comical.

I doubt they'll make the same mistake any time soon. It took a long, long time for poll voters to trust Tennesse again and obviously it was too soon. But still, on paper this team did look good to everyone.

The alarming thing to me is how the losses are occurring. They haven't been to-the-wire losses to a fired up underdog team having a game of their life and upsetting a higher ranked team. These have been systemic beatdowns by opponents who are clearly better teams than us right now. And it's happened 3 out of 5 games. Can't not be deeply concerned.

 

[GiveHim6InSC]

bring in Andy landers to run the show the rest of the season and let Kellie just be a figure head, since she can't figure out how to teach these girls anything.

I think, if we throw in a case of 40 weight motor oil for him to put in his hair, he just might do it…

 

[Volfaninfl2]

LVFL Andraya Carter is on halftime show of USC-Stanford and is calling Tennessee out. She says our current situation is concerning and it’s defense, rebounding, but most importantly, offense. She said the ball gets stuck then compared our offense to teams with great ones. So I guess it’s not just us on the board.

She left out free throw shooting.

 

[turbovol]

Saw that. She noted our offensive issues and used Stanford as example of a team with elite offense. I’m sure it was difficult for her as an alum, but kudos to her for doing her job well and calling out the obvious.

We've never had a coach who could teach good team offense. Not Summitt, not Warlick, not Harper. We haven't made the right post-PS hires: that's the bottom line.

 

[NoBackBoard]

She left out free throw shooting.

Ha!

 

[glv98]

We've never had a coach who could teach good team offense. Not Summitt, not Warlick, not Harper. We haven't made the right post-PS hires: that's the bottom line.

But why? Installing an offense should be one of the most basic functions of any coach. Doesn't mean you'll have the talent to execute it successfully, but at least you could have one.

Because I can't believe it's beyond the capabilities of everyone employed to coach basketball at UT for the last 15 years, I'm beginning to fear the problem is stubborn refusal to change. Half court O is just not what the LVs do, they depend on defense, rebounding, put backs, blah, blah, blah. We can see how well that's working out.

 

[madtownvol]

Just got back from the game and figured that the Negas would be back in full force and I wasn't disappointed. So, how many of you paid the money and watched the game? I'll bet not many. Brian Rice is great on the radio broadcast, but unless you were there or watched the game on TV, you probably don't know what you're talking about.

No, Kellie hasn't lost the team and no, they're not passive and haven't given up. It's November and they are figuring things out against different types of opponents. Yes, UCLA was fast and quick and made 50% of their threes. We played good defense, but their constant screening would eventually get someone open for three, and more often than not, they made the shot.

They fouled almost constantly, but didn't get anywhere near the foul calls that they should have - more on that later. We were 20-31 from the FT line and had a lot of empty possessions on offense - you can't win that way. Almost every time Jordy drove to the rim, she was being pushed by her defender, so she would just miss the shot on the rim and no foul was called.

IMHO, we played mostly good defense but couldn't capitalize on the offensive end.

I have no clue where these officials came from, but I'm guessing high school. Their mechanics were terrible and they missed basic things like checking in players. I have never witnessed a basketball game where one official called a foul and another official called a timeout at the same time. Of course this wiped out a foul on UCLA and a change of possession for us.

This is no time to give up - basketball is a tournament sport and there's a lot of basketball yet to be played. If it makes you feel better to wait in the wings for a loss to criticize the coaches and players, then shame on you. I just wished we had another thread for trolls so I didn't have to read their uniformed vitriol.

Good points all around.

Listened to the radio stream but it was difficult to track the more nuanced aspects of the game, such as in regard to the officiating or whether the LVs were just soft on defense or UCLA just had one of those in-the-zone games.

On the plus side, the LVs only had 14 TOs compared to UCLA's 18, which brings me back to my standard rant point. TOs are really not where this teams lives or dies. It's outside shooting. When the LVs are hitting a decent % from the 3, they generally look pretty good. Outside shots open everything up the for the offense.
When they can't, the games tend to look pretty ugly.

Compare 3 for 10 (LVs) to 16 for 30 (UCLA) = a 39 point differential. That is big hole to dig out of. The LVs were also relatively poor from the FT line but probably should have double the opportunities given how the game played out and the no calls.

Getting out rebounded again (now with Horston in the line-up) is probably the biggest single concern posed by this loss. The LVS were not a great shooting team last year but compensated by dominating the boards. They have the players do to that again and its puzzling that they keep losing out on the rebound totals. If smaller players are simply out quicking our bigs on a consistent basis, then perhaps more radical line-up changes are needed.

 

[Fatoldman]

It's too late for Key, she is a senior now. The player must have the DESIRE to fight for rebounds. Key doesn't have it. Tallest player on the court with 3 rebounds.

If Franklin can recover most of her athleticism she will start instead of Key. Pre-injury Franklin was better than Key and stats and the eye test confirmed that. Don't know that Franklin's recovery will be such that she will help us that much. If he were healthy we would not be worrying about rebounding now.

 

[ttharp]

We've never had a coach who could teach good team offense. Not Summitt, not Warlick, not Harper. We haven't made the right post-PS hires: that's the bottom line.

Agreed. If the Lady Vols had an offensive guru running the program, there would be no FF drought. What’s frustrating is despite having not made a FF in 14 years, we STILL have a roster that would easily compete for a championship with elite coaching.

 

[madtownvol]

But why? Installing an offense should be one of the most basic functions of any coach. Doesn't mean you'll have the talent to execute it successfully, but at least you could have one.

Because I can't believe it's beyond the capabilities of everyone employed to coach basketball at UT for the last 15 years, I'm beginning to fear the problem is stubborn refusal to change. Half court O is just not what the LVs do, they depend on defense, rebounding, put backs, blah, blah, blah. We can see how well that's working out.

Yeah, running a basic offense is not exactly quantum physics. As I said above, you have to put the round ball in the cylinder. At some point it is just as basic as make a damned open shot. It has been a pattern for numerous years, that games where the LVs shoot a decent percentage from outside the arc, they look pretty good. But, we have been an incredibly inconsistent shooting team. maybe its time to put the defensive drills on hold and just work on shooting. Let's start going more plus minus, if a player, say like Justine, creates more points than she loses on D, she stays on the court.

 

[Majors]

LVFL Andraya Carter is on halftime show of USC-Stanford and is calling Tennessee out. She says our current situation is concerning and it’s defense, rebounding, but most importantly, offense. She said the ball gets stuck then compared our offense to teams with great ones. So I guess it’s not just us on the board.

Would she be considered a “troll”? Or does she get a free pass for saying what others have said. Hits different when it’s one of our own.

 

[Majors]

Saw that. She noted our offensive issues and used Stanford as example of a team with elite offense. I’m sure it was difficult for her as an alum, but kudos to her for doing her job well and calling out the obvious.

nothing wrong with being honest

 

[glv98]

Yeah, running a basic offense is not exactly quantum physics. As I said above, you have too put the round ball in the cylinder. At some point it is just as basic as make a damned open shot. It has been a pattern for numerous years, that games where the LVs shoot a decent percentage from outside the arc, they look pretty good. But, we have been an incredibly inconsistent shooting team. maybe its time to put the defensive drills on hold and just work on shooting. Let's start going more plus minus, if a player, say like Justine, creates more points than she loses on D, she stays on the court.

Chicken and egg. Which came first, inconsistent shooting or lack of an offensive system to provide them with better shots? At this point, it's been so many years and so many players I have to think it's a systematic problem.

 

[ttharp]

Yeah, running a basic offense is not exactly quantum physics. As I said above, you have too put the round ball in the cylinder. At some point it is just as basic as make a damned open shot. It has been a pattern for numerous years, that games where the LVs shoot a decent percentage from outside the arc, they look pretty good. But, we have been an incredibly inconsistent shooting team. maybe its time to put the defensive drills on hold and just work on shooting. Let's start going more plus minus, if a player, say like Justine, creates more points than she loses on D, she stays on the court.

But in a recent presser, though, Kellie mentioned they spent most of preseason working on the offense — that it was only recently they started devoting most of practice working on defense and rebounding.

 

[Darth_Vol]

I'm transitioning from being a CKH supporter.

 

[Volfaninfl2]

UCLA made 16 of 30, 3 pointers, by a total of 6 players.

TN made 3 of 10, 3 pointers, by 3 players.

Horston has always been a volume shooter, I was hoping she would have a higher shooting percentage this year, but she made 5 of 17 attempts.

Rickea doesn’t look like she dribbles well, but she can shoot, although not well today.

We need better rebounding from someone. Striplin grabbed a rebound in about a minute or two of play. We need to make our free throws, and we need Horston to finish layups, or kick the ball out to a shooter away from the basket, when the layup is a no go.

This team is about to get some very tough love from Kellie.

 

[Fatoldman]

Franklin does a lot of little things really well. Love her game. That was a sweet pass to Puckett.

Before her injury she was playing above the rim and was a terror on defense. Now she has the know how but not the mobility. If we are lucky her mobility will improve significantly and we can see some glimpses of the old Franklin by maybe February.

 

[Coach Jumper]

Yeah, running a basic offense is not exactly quantum physics. As I said above, you have to put the round ball in the cylinder. At some point it is just as basic as make a damned open shot. It has been a pattern for numerous years, that games where the LVs shoot a decent percentage from outside the arc, they look pretty good. But, we have been an incredibly inconsistent shooting team. maybe its time to put the defensive drills on hold and just work on shooting. Let's start going more plus minus, if a player, say like Justine, creates more points than she loses on D, she stays on the court.

We've had a perfect group for a Utah Jazz,,Point-Forward offense with good passing fwds...this year we have the perfect set of players for running the chicago bulls triangle (Mj-Scottie-Horace) (Rickea-Jordy- any of our fwds).

But the best offense in the world will succomb mentally to a 10-0 run Q1, A 8-2 run Q2, A 9-0 run Q3...that is total 27-2 run...game over

With no timeouts taken during any of them

 

[youcancallmeAl]

Chicken and egg. Which came first, inconsistent shooting or lack of an offensive system to provide them with better shots? At this point, it's been so many years and so many players I have to think it's a systematic problem.

When, over the years, you recruit defenders and rebounders, it makes sense you don't have great offenses.

 

[glv98]

We've had a perfect group for a Utah Jazz,,Point-Forward offense with good passing fwds...this year we have the perfect set of players for running the chicago bulls triangle (Mj-Scottie-Horace) (Rickea-Jordy- any of our fwds).

But the best offense in the world will succomb mentally to a 10-0 run Q1, A 8-2 run Q2, A 9-0 run Q3...that is total 27-2 run...game over

With no timeouts taken during any of them

The best offense in the world would not be putting up those goose eggs, would not go into the prolonged scoring draughts that are the enabling aspects of those runs.

 

[Majors]

I'm transitioning from being a CKH supporter.

seems more and more this year

 

[Coach Jumper]

...This team is about to get very tough love from Kellie.

I can only hope

 

[Majors]

@gule

 

[glv98]

When, over the years, you recruit defenders and rebounders, it makes sense you don't have great offenses.

If this is still the problem 15 years and all these losses later, that we are STILL recruiting mostly athletic players who can't shoot a lick, then I need to find another team because the LVs will never be an enjoyable team to watch again. I guess it is a systematic problem where they've just decided to live on past glories no matter how outdated.

 

[madtownvol]

Would she be considered a “troll”? Or does she get a free pass for saying what others have said. Hits different when it’s one of our own.

Not at all. No one observing the LV's three loses would come away saying "all is peachy." Pointing out that the team has problems that need to get fixed is different from saying the season is over, bashing players, or proclaiming that Kellie is a failure.