GOP wants to force this girl to have the baby

[82_VOL_83]

Ok, this coming from a guy with Tennessee as his first team and Alabama as his second...

:lolabove: Yeah that coming from a KY jelly tube really hurts.

 

[dukes_of_maggard]

The platform on both sides is no more than a gimmick to appease the base of the parties.

Exactly and in the Democrats case it doesn't even do that...I hate democrats - cant get s*** done with a fillabuster-proof majority smh...

 

[DinkinFlicka]

Seriously, Glen... it's not even 4:00 yet.

 

[DinkinFlicka]

:lolabove: Yeah that coming from a KY jelly tube really hurts.

So you must be a proponent of spit lube.

 

[PKT_VOL]

I do believe that life begins at conception. After all, what is the definition of life......Bacteria are alive. The question is when do you believe a fetus becomes a child. That is a question that no one can answer and should be left up to the discretion of parent(s). However, I do believe that late stage (and how do you define this "time") abortions are killing an unborn child. They can be classified as murder if they are purely to rid the mother of the child and neither are a danger to the other. However, they can be classified as killing a fetus if there is a mortal threat to the mother. That is when it becomes a family choice and not should be left up to the family with ANY government intervention. JMO. Additionally, it is pathetic that this country has gotten to where this is even a platform issue.

When I mean "life" I am referring to "human life" not "biological life". I guess that is my fault with semantics.

The question of whether "life" being "human life" at conception is what the GOP platform is based on. They don't give a sh*t about "life" in the biological sense. Thus, you can throw that logic out of the window. That doesn't make any sense.

"Human life" unequivocally does not start at conception. To think otherwise is dumbfounding. To believe in personhood rights of a fertilized embryo is moronic.

 

[PKT_VOL]

I'll add that agree with the rest of your post Glen.

 

[OrangeYankee]

To the one that said no scripture said life begins at conception. It does not specifically but this is one of the scriptures that the heavy pro lifers pull it from:

Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations.
Jer 1:5

However, this is also in there:

And do not get drunk with wine, for that is debauchery, but be filled with the Spirit,

Eph 5:18

And most everyone agrees alcohol should not be illegal. Yes, again there are some hard liners that may, but the vast, vast majority don't. Yes an R said a very stupid and irresponisble thing about rape and abortion, and if you want to pick at semantics they dont' have wording in the plank, but I have yet to hear a republican politician that matters say anything about rape and incest. In fact even a hardliner would be dumb to not take the compromise on the day hell freezes over and the opportunity to ban abortions came up.

But again social politics come to completely ruin the day by monopolizing our attention away from the real issue at hand: our government spends money hand over fist and a guy may show some promise to at least slow that trend and boom we are talking about a non issue in hopes to smear him.

 

[PKT_VOL]

To the one that said no scripture said life begins at conception. It does not specifically but this is one of the scriptures that the heavy pro lifers pull it from:

Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations.
Jer 1:5

However, this is also in there:

And do not get drunk with wine, for that is debauchery, but be filled with the Spirit,

Eph 5:18

And most everyone agrees alcohol should not be illegal. Yes, again there are some hard liners that may, but the vast, vast majority don't. Yes an R said a very stupid and irresponisble thing about rape and abortion, and if you want to pick at semantics they dont' have wording in the plank, but I have yet to hear a republican politician that matters say anything about rape and incest. In fact even a hardliner would be dumb to not take the compromise on the day hell freezes over and the opportunity to ban abortions came up.

But again social politics come to completely ruin the day by monopolizing our attention away from the real issue at hand: our government spends money hand over fist and a guy may show some promise to at least slow that trend and boom we are talking about a non issue in hopes to smear him.

Paul Ryan cosponsored (along with Todd Akin) a federal personhood bill; the Sanctity of Human Life Act.

A BILL

To provide that human life shall be deemed to begin with fertilization.

Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled,

SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE.

This Act may be cited as the `Sanctity of Human Life Act'.

SEC. 2. DECLARATION.

In the exercise of the powers of the Congress, including Congress' power under article I, section 8 of the Constitution, to make necessary and proper laws, and Congress' power under section 5 of the 14th article of amendment to the Constitution of the United States--

(1) the Congress declares that--

(A) the right to life guaranteed by the Constitution is vested in each human being, and is the paramount and most fundamental right of a person; and

(B) the life of each human being begins with fertilization, cloning, or its functional equivalent, irrespective of sex, health, function or disability, defect, stage of biological development, or condition of dependency, at which time every human being shall have all the legal and constitutional attributes and privileges of personhood; and

(2) the Congress affirms that the Congress, each State, the District of Columbia, and all United States territories have the authority to protect the lives of all human beings residing in its respective jurisdictions.

SEC. 3. DEFINITIONS.

For purposes of this Act:

(1) FERTILIZATION- The term `fertilization' means the process of a human spermatozoan penetrating the cell membrane of a human oocyte to create a human zygote, a one-celled human embryo, which is a new unique human being.

(2) CLONING- The term `cloning' means the process called somatic cell nuclear transfer, that combines an enucleated egg and the nucleus of a somatic cell to make a human embryo.

(3) HUMAN; HUMAN BEING- The terms `human' and `human being' include each and every member of the species homo sapiens at all stages of life, beginning with the earliest stage of development, created by the process of fertilization, cloning, or its functional equivalent.

No exemptions for rape, incest, or the health of the mother.

 

[OHvol40]

Paul Ryan cosponsored (along with Todd Akin) a federal personhood bill; the Sanctity of Human Life Act.



No exemptions for rape, incest, or the health of the mother.

That bill was just to gain the vote of those extreme crazies. Please ignore the man behind the curtain.

 

[82_VOL_83]

I'll add that agree with the rest of your post Glen.

I didn't see any of it that you disagreed with....:unsure:

 

[PKT_VOL]

If you agree with my post above that, then I guess we don't disagree

 

[therealUT]

Florida deputies fatally shoot suspect wanted for sexually assaulting and impregnating an 11-year-old - NY Daily News

GOP Platform Anti-Abortion Language Includes No Exceptions For Rape, Incest : It's All Politics : NPR

Honestly, it is a logically consistent position for the GOP. The GOP usually maintains that the right to life trumps all other rights (as I understand the GOP's hierarchy of rights, I would say it goes Life, Property, Liberty; where, the DNC's hierarchy of rights goes Life, Liberty (which, according to many in the DNC, must consist of a sufficient amount of equality to exist), Property)). If one maintains that a fetus is a human life, then the logical consequent is that it possesses the right to life. If it possesses the right to life, then it is trumped by no other (lesser) rights.

The inconsistent, and seemingly absurd, position is that which calls abortion murder, yet makes exceptions for cases of incest and rape. Yet, that seems to be the position that the GOP must take, or else they come off as cold and heartless and at war with women.

 

[theFallGuy]

abortion is legal and the GOP can't do what Obama did and just ignore a law that they don't agree with

the platform may state that abortion is unacceptable, but the words mean little, if anything, without legal support

This is the ole' Dem scare tactic "Republicans are going to end abortion if they get elected" routine. You know, people will be forced to get abortions in back alleys with coat hangers.

We had 8 years of Bush and he never made any attempt to end abortion, despite the Democrats tellings us that during every campaign.

 

[MG1968]

This is the ole' Dem scare tactic "Republicans are going to end abortion if they get elected" routine. You know, people will be forced to get abortions in back alleys with coat hangers.

We had 8 years of Bush and he never made any attempt to end abortion, despite the Democrats tellings us that during every campaign.

and 6 of those years with GOP majorities in both Houses of Congress

the only time abortion ever became an issue was during an election year when both sides had to pander to their base

 

[therealUT]

This is the ole' Dem scare tactic "Republicans are going to end abortion if they get elected" routine. You know, people will be forced to get abortions in back alleys with coat hangers.

We had 8 years of Bush and he never made any attempt to end abortion, despite the Democrats tellings us that during every campaign.

and 6 of those years with GOP majorities in both Houses of Congress

the only time abortion ever became an issue was during an election year when both sides had to pander to their base

Seeing as how the SCOTUS ruled that a fetus is only a potential life with potential rights and that potential rights do not trump actual rights, no legislature can end abortion by simple fiat. The SCOTUS decision must either be overruled by SCOTUS, which means that the POTUS election does indirectly factor into the abortion debate, or by Constitutional Amendment, which means that Congressional elections actually factor into the abortion debate.

 

[DinkinFlicka]

So are we getting to a point where we, as voters, are content with candidates saying things just for the sake of nabbing the more weak-minded votes?

 

[therealUT]

So are we getting to a point where we, as voters, are content with candidates saying things just for the sake of nabbing the more weak-minded votes?

There is an interesting and thought-provoking essay regarding this phenomenon on the Stone at New York Times.

 

[Gramps]

So are we getting to a point where we, as voters, are content with candidates saying things just for the sake of nabbing the more weak-minded votes?

We may not be content with it but that is the way it is and has been for years.

 

[DinkinFlicka]

There is an interesting and thought-provoking essay regarding this phenomenon on the Stone at New York Times.

Where in the archives can I find it?

 

[therealUT]

Where in the archives can I find it?

Speech, Lies and Apathy in Political Campaigns - NYTimes.com

 

[PKT_VOL]

Honestly, it is a logically consistent position for the GOP. The GOP usually maintains that the right to life trumps all other rights (as I understand the GOP's hierarchy of rights, I would say it goes Life, Property, Liberty; where, the DNC's hierarchy of rights goes Life, Liberty (which, according to many in the DNC, must consist of a sufficient amount of equality to exist), Property)). If one maintains that a fetus is a human life, then the logical consequent is that it possesses the right to life. If it possesses the right to life, then it is trumped by no other (lesser) rights.

The inconsistent, and seemingly absurd, position is that which calls abortion murder, yet makes exceptions for cases of incest and rape. Yet, that seems to be the position that the GOP must take, or else they come off as cold and heartless and at war with women.

Yep. I stated this earlier in the thread to those who believe that human life starts at conception and thus should inherent personhood rights upon conception (official GOP platform). If one believes such a ridiculous notion (there are some on here who do) then they must also accept the belief that there should be no exceptions of abortions for rape, incest, or the health of the mother. To do otherwise would be logically invalid.

 

[DinkinFlicka]

Speech, Lies and Apathy in Political Campaigns - NYTimes.com

Much obliged. Will read after work.

 

[Vol Main]

Obviously, you haven't read the GOP platform, which states that its goal is to protect all fetuses...does not make any exceptions for rape.

Santorum has said that women who are raped and impregnated should just "accept the gift from God." So has Sarah Palin, so have several other GOP congress members/candidates.

Santorum can accept all of the gifts from God he wants from his own sexual activity, but he should not make decisions for that 11 year old girl's life.