gs, neocon, sjt, and mur now have someone to vote for!

[PKT_VOL]

God loves an inquisitive mind.

Actually, your God wouldn't love me or my inquisitive mind.

that Classical Civilization survived the fall of Rome, only to be finally destroyed by Islam in the seventh century.

Not even through with the first paragraph and his argument has a glaring problem. The "Classical Civilization" aka Roman Civilization did not continue hunky dory until the seventh century. Sorry. Strike one.

they also communicated many of their values to Christendom - values which included "holy war", slave-trading, etc.

Yes. Christians in antiquity never had slaves before those heathens from Mecca arrived. Additionally, Christians had never killed in the name of their Christian God before coming into contact with the Muslims of the seventh century. Strike two.

Furthermore, aren't Christians suppose to only adhere to the way of Jesus from the New Testament? Why would they stray away from Jesus's message in lieu of a savage culture built around a false prophet?

the Crusades, for example, were not an aggressive act against a quiet and peaceful Muslim world, but a defensive measure against a still aggressive and expanding Islam.

Yep. The Crusades were a completely defensive mechanism against the onslaught of Muslim expansion. There is a stark difference between defending oneself and blood-thirsty retribution. The Christians were attempting to do the same thing to the Muslims; except, they were unsuccessful of accomplishing their ultimate goal. Strike three. Looks like his argument is down for the count.

Look, I am not saying that the Muslim expansion did not inflict negative side effects upon the lives of the people in the middle ages. I am just saying that the Church is chiefly responsible for the misery of the dark ages.

 

[gsvol]

Actually, your God wouldn't love me or my inquisitive mind.



Not even through with the first paragraph and his argument has a glaring problem. The "Classical Civilization" aka Roman Civilization did not continue hunky dory until the seventh century. Sorry. Strike one.



Yes. Christians in antiquity never had slaves before those heathens from Mecca arrived. Additionally, Christians had never killed in the name of their Christian God before coming into contact with the Muslims of the seventh century. Strike two.

Furthermore, aren't Christians suppose to only adhere to the way of Jesus from the New Testament? Why would they stray away from Jesus's message in lieu of a savage culture built around a false prophet?



Yep. The Crusades were a completely defensive mechanism against the onslaught of Muslim expansion. There is a stark difference between defending oneself and blood-thirsty retribution. The Christians were attempting to do the same thing to the Muslims; except, they were unsuccessful of accomplishing their ultimate goal. Strike three. Looks like his argument is down for the count.

Look, I am not saying that the Muslim expansion did not inflict negative side effects upon the lives of the people in the middle ages. I am just saying that the Church is chiefly responsible for the misery of the dark ages.

The bolded part of your post illustrates you know little if anything of my God.

The rest illustrates point made in the 'black hole of history' thread.

"I summon my blue-eyed slaves anytime it pleases me. I command the Americans to send me their bravest soldiers to die for me. Anytime I clap my hands a stupid genie called the American ambassador appears to do my bidding. When the Americans die in my service their bodies are frozen in metal boxes by the US Embassy and American airplanes carry them away, as if they never existed. Truly, America is my favorite slave."

King Fahd Bin Abdul-Aziz, Jeddeh 1993

 

[gsvol]

Well...who knew that the Pope was actually Muhammad's understudy!!!!!

:crazy:

How do you jump to such an absurd conclusion??

:crazy::crazy::crazy::crazy:

Are you referring to the fact that the Vatican paid tribute to the moslems to avoid being sacked?

Do you dispute that as being factual?

Too much sense in one post for him to take.

Read my reply to his post and see what makes sense to you.

What in the hell is "cianide?"

That's how you spell "cyanide" when you've been up all night drinking moonshine.

I posted a lengthy response to Volatile's inane remark but I suppose a monitor deleted it.

At any rate I nominated him for the Volnation 'most ignorant post of the decade' award.

Not that he doesn't have stiff competition from zjc mind you.

 

[VOLatile]

That's how you spell "cyanide" when you've been up all night drinking moonshine.

This explains everything.

 

[PKT_VOL]

The bolded part of your post illustrates you know little if anything of my God.

Interesting. I'd love to hear about your God.

I am assuming you pray to some sort of Christian God. Keep in mind that I have not, nor have any current plan to accept Jesus into my heart as my Lord and Savior. I do not worship nor pray to your God. I use my inquisitive mind to question everything including his said existence. Not to mention the fact that I sin incessantly without repenting or having been baptized.

But if that is fine with your God, then as Dierks Bentley would say, "there might be hope for me yet."

The rest illustrates point made in the 'black hole of history' thread.

"I summon my blue-eyed slaves anytime it pleases me. I command the Americans to send me their bravest soldiers to die for me. Anytime I clap my hands a stupid genie called the American ambassador appears to do my bidding. When the Americans die in my service their bodies are frozen in metal boxes by the US Embassy and American airplanes carry them away, as if they never existed. Truly, America is my favorite slave."

King Fahd Bin Abdul-Aziz, Jeddeh 1993

I thought we were discussing the history of the Dark Ages. That quote has nothing to do with said subject. It has everything to do with the West's dependence on oil and King Fahd Bin Abdul-Aziz's ability to successfully exploit the West due to the massive oil reserves under his feet.

 

[gsvol]

Interesting. I'd love to hear about your God.

I am assuming you pray to some sort of Christian God. Keep in mind that I have not, nor have any current plan to accept Jesus into my heart as my Lord and Savior. I do not worship nor pray to your God. I use my inquisitive mind to question everything including his said existence. Not to mention the fact that I sin incessantly without repenting or having been baptized.

But if that is fine with your God, then as Dierks Bentley would say, "there might be hope for me yet."



I thought we were discussing the history of the Dark Ages. That quote has nothing to do with said subject. It has everything to do with the West's dependence on oil and King Fahd Bin Abdul-Aziz's ability to successfully exploit the West due to the massive oil reserves under his feet.

Indeed there is hope for you.

We started out discussing our poor education on the history of islam.

It is absolutely impossible to dicuss such a subject on this board without the inevitable comparison with Christianity, complete with an attack on most everything Christian accompanied by inane statement that all religion is bad, all of which has nothing to do with whether we have an accurate knowledge of the history of islam or not.

Someone mentioned the dark ages, blaming it on Christianity and I responded that there is a good argument that the main contributing factor was islam.

That's where you came in.

Actually the quote has everything to do with our lack of knowledge concerning islam and it has quite a bit to do with current events.

Why do you think it is that given the fact that we could recover enough of our own oil to almost if not completely eliminate importation of oil from Saudi Arabia, we do not do so?

Do you really think it is all about environmental concerns?

Also the quote gives a great deal of insight into the moslem mind.

The Saudis send quite a bit of their money to America to support imams who teach the most radical form of islam, wahibbism in the mosques, somewhete between 8 and 900 at last count.

 

[DinkinFlicka]

This explains everything.

Don't make moonshine seem so ignorant to drink.

Jeez.

 

[VOLatile]

Don't make moonshine seem so ignorant to drink.

Jeez.

I'll stick to my 1/2 Sweet Potato Ale and 1/2 Uncommon Coffee Stout. Intelligent and aware.

 

[PKT_VOL]

Indeed there is hope for you.

Care to elaborate?

We started out discussing our poor education on the history of islam.

False. We started discussing this history of the dark ages.

It is absolutely impossible to dicuss such a subject on this board without the inevitable comparison with Christianity, complete with an attack on most everything Christian accompanied by inane statement that all religion is bad, all of which has nothing to do with whether we have an accurate knowledge of the history of islam or not.

It is not inevitable. I have yet to bring Christianity or religion into the discussion outside of picking apart the Islam argument piece by piece. I have not hurled an attack on Christianity or religion in general. I am rationally and logically picking apart the Islamic argument with the known history of the dark ages and nothing more.

Someone mentioned the dark ages, blaming it on Christianity and I responded that there is a good argument that the main contributing factor was islam.

That's where you came

A contributing factor? Yes. The main factor? Not even close.

Actually the quote has everything to do with our lack of knowledge concerning islam and it has quite a bit to do with current events.

Why do you think it is that given the fact that we could recover enough of our own oil to almost if not completely eliminate importation of oil from Saudi Arabia, we do not do so?

The quote has absolutely nothing to do with Islam. At all. Nothing. Goose egg. Nada.

However, as I mentioned, and you reaffirmed, the quote is about current events with special emphasis on international economic/political relations.

Do you really think it is all about environmental concerns?

Put down the moonshine. Nobody said anything about the environment. I honestly don't know where you are pulling this crap out of.

Also the quote gives a great deal of insight into the moslem mind.

The quote actually has nothing to do with Islam. Let alone the mind of moslems in general. Do you really want to go down this road? I mean I can post horrific quotes made by "Christians" which have nothing to do with religion or Christianity and pass them off main stream Christianity.

The Saudis send quite a bit of their money to America to support imams who teach the most radical form of islam, wahibbism in the mosques, somewhete between 8 and 900 at last count.

Who cares? Oh wait, damn that pesky first amendment.

 

[gsvol]

Care to elaborate? .

No.

False. We started discussing this history of the dark ages. .

The thread started discussing the history of islam and our sadly lacking depth of knowledge of that and the affect it has had on world history.

Focusing completely on the dark ages is only a diversion.

Extrapulating from that we can find that even now we are making foolish decisions by holding onto ideas based on false assumptions.

It is not inevitable. I have yet to bring Christianity or religion into the discussion outside of picking apart the Islam argument piece by piece. I have not hurled an attack on Christianity or religion in general. I am rationally and logically picking apart the Islamic argument with the known history of the dark ages and nothing more. .

You may not have but others always do.

So do you have anything good to say about the history of islam outside of the concept of the dark ages?

What were islamic forces doing during the dark ages?

A contributing factor? Yes. The main factor? Not even close..

Perhaps we can agree to disagree on that.

What do you claim to be the main factor?

Are you familiar with the concepts of taqqiya and kitman?

The quote has absolutely nothing to do with Islam. At all. Nothing. Goose egg. Nada. .

Perhaps you can gives reason why it has nothing to do with islam.

Do you understand the meaning of the word 'islam'?

However, as I mentioned, and you reaffirmed, the quote is about current events with special emphasis on international economic/political relations. .

What was it Santana said about knowledge of history?

Put down the moonshine. Nobody said anything about the environment. I honestly don't know where you are pulling this crap out of. .

The point is that environmental issues are given as the reason not to develope our own resources, could there be other reasons?

The quote actually has nothing to do with Islam. Let alone the mind of moslems in general. Do you really want to go down this road? I mean I can post horrific quotes made by "Christians" which have nothing to do with religion or Christianity and pass them off main stream Christianity. .

And I can give a long list of quotes by islamic authorities concerning their plans for America.

Who cares? Oh wait, damn that pesky first amendment.

And just who is trying to squelch the first amendment by claiming that telling the truth is an insult to their religion.

The Saudis spend billions annually in almost every country in the world promoting the idea that 'ismamaphobia' should be criminalized and that tramples all over free speech.

Inroads were made here when the pedophile protection act was approved as an amendment in a defense spending bill.

 

[PKT_VOL]

So do you have anything good to say about the history of islam outside of the concept of the dark ages?

Honestly, I don't have an opinion either way. I think the history of Islam has both positive and negative elements; just like the history of every other religion including Christianity.

What do you claim to be the main factor?

The systematic exploitation by Church leaders and political leaders during the Dark Ages of their subjects in the name of their religion (Christianity).

Perhaps you can gives reason why it has nothing to do with islam.

Do you understand the meaning of the word 'islam'?

Perhaps you can give reasons why it does. The only one I can think of is that you are grasping at the fact that his religion is Islam.

I define "Islam" as a religion founded upon the principals of the prophet Muhammad.

And I can give a long list of quotes by islamic authorities concerning their plans for America.

Who cares?

And just who is trying to squelch the first amendment by claiming that telling the truth is an insult to their religion.

The same can be said by most religious people of all faiths. If you want proof on VN, just hop on over to the mega troll thread by Billy C "Question about Christianity."

The Saudis spend billions annually in almost every country in the world promoting the idea that 'ismamaphobia' should be criminalized and that tramples all over free speech.

Again, who cares?

 

[KiffinKiller]

So will gs stop complaining about being insulted? He told someone to swallow cyanide earlier...what a hypocrite.

 

[therealUT]

So will gs stop complaining about being insulted? He told someone to swallow cyanide earlier...what a hypocrite.

*cianide....

 

[KiffinKiller]

whoops. doesn't count then. he can continue to *****.

 

[DinkinFlicka]

I took some like he told me to. I listened to Pink Floyd's Animals on repeat for 6 hours, pissed in my room mate's sink and painted unicorns on my wall with ketchup.

Might be the soundest advice GS has imparted upon my precious noggin. It comes on paper tabs right?

 

[gsvol]

I'll stick to my 1/2 Sweet Potato Ale and 1/2 Uncommon Coffee Stout. Intelligent and aware.

That explains everything.

Honestly, I don't have an opinion either way. I think the history of Islam has both positive and negative elements; just like the history of every other religion including Christianity.

So then it is just all the same to you??

Hence the purpose of the thread.

We need to throw off our own gnorance.

The systematic exploitation by Church leaders and political leaders during the Dark Ages of their subjects in the name of their religion (Christianity).

Do you know that academia was the first to castigate Galileo and not the church leaders.

Still your analysis completely ignores the extreme pressure from islamic armies and navies and their extreme demands against European culture.

How can you ignore that and still claim to be objective?

Perhaps you can give reasons why it does. The only one I can think of is that you are grasping at the fact that his religion is Islam.

I define "Islam" as a religion founded upon the principals of the prophet Muhammad.

Whose religion is islam?

And what do you consider to be the principles of the (false) prophet muhammed?

Who cares?

You probably should but why should I care?

The same can be said by most religious people of all faiths. If you want proof on VN, just hop on over to the mega troll thread by Billy C "Question about Christianity."

Thanks but no thanks.

Again, who cares?

I would say that those who are truly interested in protecting the first amendment would care.

So will gs stop complaining about being insulted? He told someone to swallow cyanide earlier...what a hypocrite.

Did I say swallow. Who told you to swallow?

Snorting has been invented you know.

I took some like he told me to. I listened to Pink Floyd's Animals on repeat for 6 hours, pissed in my room mate's sink and painted unicorns on my wall with ketchup.

Might be the soundest advice GS has imparted upon my precious noggin. It comes on paper tabs right?

Arsenic is also an hallucinogen.

A cheap source is morning glory seeds.

Heavenly Blues and Pearly Gates are the best.

You might try some Moody Blues with that, I recommend Nights in White Satin. (Not a reference to the KKK.)

 

[DinkinFlicka]

Arsenic is also an hallucinogen.

A cheap source is morning glory seeds.

Heavenly Blues and Pearly Gates are the best.

You might try some Moody Blues with that, I recommend Nights in White Satin. (Not a reference to the KKK.)

Psh, why eat 2000 morning glories when you can eat 100 hawaiian baby woodrose seeds instead?

I was into psychoactive botany many moons ago. I'm impressed.

 

[sjt18]

The systematic exploitation by Church leaders and political leaders during the Dark Ages of their subjects in the name of their religion (Christianity).

So all of Christianity is impugned by a clear departure by the Roman Catholic Church from NT teachings more than 500 years ago?

This is a tad more recent and local: Answering Muslims: Iraqi Immigrant Alaa Alsaegh Suffers Hate Crime in St. Louis

I define "Islam" as a religion founded upon the principals of the prophet Muhammad.

You do realize that Muhammad advocated violence from the start and that a large percentage of Muslims still do, right?

You and those like you seem to want to lump Christianity in with Islam based on some obscure, much less than 1%, fringe element that is violent in the name of Christianity.... vs much more widespread use of violence by Muslims. Muslim violence toward non-Muslims is institutional in several countries.

 

[DinkinFlicka]

I wonder, sjt... how do you feel about the EDL?

 

[KiffinKiller]

probably similar to how I feel about Easter Vigil.

 

[sjt18]

I wonder, sjt... how do you feel about the EDL?

Not familiar. What are you referring to?

 

[DinkinFlicka]

probably similar to how I feel about Easter Vigil.

How do ya figure that?

 

[DinkinFlicka]

Not familiar. What are you referring to?

English Defence League... led by Tommy Robinson. He's basically a more extreme, British version of Pamela Geller.

 

[KiffinKiller]

How do ya figure that?

*troll face*

 

[sjt18]

English Defence League... led by Tommy Robinson. He's basically a more extreme, British version of Pamela Geller.

I oppose the spread of Sharia. I oppose the initiation of violence but support free speech and the right to protect one's self when exercising that right.

EDL does not look like anything I would ever want to be a part of... however there is a significant element in the Islamic community that believes they MUST spread Sharia to obey Allah. They are a legitimate concern considering the suppression of rights under that political system.