Gun control debate (merged)

#29,326
#29,326
WoodsmanVol said:
Prove it. I do know RepubLIARs manipulate information to promote this lie. So if what you say is true, prove it.

A. Republican-controlled states have higher murder rates than Democratic ones: study
B. https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/17/briefing/right-wing-mass-shootings.htm
C. Do Republican or Democratic states have more crime?
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Before we start, what would you accept as proof? Since you started off with your "RepubLIARs" motif, I am led to believe that no matter what the numbers are, you are already set in your belief and no set of numbers will sway you. See, unlike you, I did not stop at the first headline, but dug in to research the subject. Will be happy to provide the numbers, but not going to do the work of presenting it if I'm talking to brick.

The first thing that piqued my interest was something along the lines of your first bullet point, the "red states" have higher murder rates than blue ones. I dug in because if it is as the headline appears, well, maybe things I thought I knew were not true. And here is what I found out:

Yes, the headline is technically true in that the raw top line numbers do support that statement. However, what it turns out is the blue cities within those red states drive the murder rates up. As examples: Jackson, MS, Memphis, TN, St Louis, MO (the worst of the worst by the way) drive up their respective states murder rates. It's math. In case you are wondering, these examples are not congruent with the rest of their respective states in demographics, political leadership and/or murder rates.
 
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#29,327
#29,327
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#29,329
#29,329
WoodsmanVol said:
Prove it. I do know RepubLIARs manipulate information to promote this lie. So if what you say is true, prove it.

A. Republican-controlled states have higher murder rates than Democratic ones: study
B. https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/17/briefing/right-wing-mass-shootings.htm
C. Do Republican or Democratic states have more crime?
Click to expand...
From article (link 1):
The five states with the highest per capita murder rate — Mississippi, Louisiana, Kentucky, Alabama and Missouri — all lean Republican and voted for Trump

If you would like to overlay the city in each state respobsible for the murders with the voting records, you will see the ridiculousness of your claim. But since you don't particularly care for truth, accuracy or context... your care is trolling...i doubt you will look into it.
Furthermore, if you were to look at the demographic data for the areas in those cities where murders are disproportionately occurring, it will also be troubling for you.

Also from article:
"In fact, a new study from the center-left think tank Third Way..."

Sounds unbiased, no?
 
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#29,330
#29,330
GroverCleveland said:
Before we start, what would you accept as proof? Since you started off with your "RepubLIARs" motif, I am led to believe that no matter what the numbers are, you are already set in your belief and no set of numbers will sway you. See, unlike you, I did not stop at the first headline, but dug in to research the subject. Will be happy to provide the numbers, but not going to do the work of presenting it if I'm talking to brick.

The first thing that piqued my interest was something along the lines of your first bullet point, the "red states" have higher murder rates than blue ones. I dug in because if it is as the headline appears, well, maybe things I thought I knew were not true. And here is what I found out:

Yes, the headline is technically true in that the raw top line numbers do support that statement. However, what it turns out is the blue cities within those red states drive the murder rates up. As examples: Jackson, MS, Memphis, TN, St Louis, MO (the worst of the worst by the way) drive up their respective states murder rates. It's math. In case you are wondering, these examples are not congruent with the rest of their respective states in demographics, political leadership and/or murder rates.
Click to expand...
You're protectively MAGA-izing me. And based in direct and written discourse with rightists, you guys use stats to justify demonizing others and racist views. It matters not if the stats are empirically methodical or not, as long as they justify your bigotry goals. So it's not whether I accept proof, but my resentment of the underlying aim you espouse. To me, it echoes the adage: There are lies, damn lies, and then there are statistics.
 
#29,331
#29,331
WoodsmanVol said:
You're protectively MAGA-izing me. And based in direct and written discourse with rightists, you guys use stats to justify demonizing others and racist views. It matters not if the stats are empirically methodical or not, as long as they justify your bigotry goals. So it's not whether I accept proof, but my resentment of the underlying aim you espouse. To me, it echoes the adage: There are lies, damn lies, and then there are statistics.
Click to expand...
I do not even have a vague clue as to what that first sentence means. Given your post history, I think it is probably meant as an insult. Whatever.

With regards to the rest of it, thanks for the confirmation that you would not accept any "proof" as you earlier asked for it. No, just hurl some more insults. Facts be damned.
 
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#29,332
#29,332
McDad said:
From article (link 1):
The five states with the highest per capita murder rate — Mississippi, Louisiana, Kentucky, Alabama and Missouri — all lean Republican and voted for Trump

If you would like to overlay the city in each state respobsible for the murders with the voting records, you will see the ridiculousness of your claim. But since you don't particularly care for truth, accuracy or context... your care is trolling...i doubt you will look into it.
Furthermore, if you were to look at the demographic data for the areas in those cities where murders are disproportionately occurring, it will also be troubling for you.

Also from article:
"In fact, a new study from the center-left think tank Third Way..."

Sounds unbiased, no?
Click to expand...
Eh. Just waiting for him to call us Nazis again.
 
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#29,333
#29,333
GroverCleveland said:
I do not even have a vague clue as to what that first sentence means. Given your post history, I think it is probably meant as an insult. Whatever.

With regards to the rest of it, thanks for the confirmation that you would not accept any "proof" as you earlier asked for it. No, just hurl some more insults. Facts be damned.
Click to expand...
Should be easy for Zim to prove. Just take out the blue cities and recalculate. I'm sure talking out the blue cites will show the point he's trying to make.
 
#29,334
#29,334
GroverCleveland said:
I do not even have a vague clue as to what that first sentence means. Given your post history, I think it is probably meant as an insult. Whatever.

With regards to the rest of it, thanks for the confirmation that you would not accept any "proof" as you earlier asked for it. No, just hurl some more insults. Facts be damned.
Click to expand...
With regard to your posting history, we seem to be birds of a father. Except, you can dish it but not take it. Shoo fly.
 
#29,342
#29,342
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#29,346
#29,346
hndog609 said:
(cough)

wirepoints.org

Red states, blue cities: Who’s to blame for America’s homicide crisis – Wirepoints Special Report | Wirepoints

There’s a debate raging over who’s responsible for the surge in homicides and violent crime across the country, with some politicians and media blaming “red state” policies. But the problem with homicides is that it’s not a red vs. blue state debate, but rather a red vs. blue city one. And when...
wirepoints.org wirepoints.org
Click to expand...
This discussion with WoodyVol reminded me of an experience I had with the board of directors of a cotton gin I was a partner in.

First some background: it was after the season and when cottonseed prices are not high enough, the farmers may owe a balance on the ginning service for each bale. However, ginning charges are about the most secure debt in the country next to student loans as by state laws, it is automatic and the first lien on a bale of cotton. Period. So a gin could be owed $15 on a $400 bale of cotton. The gin gets its money.

This was one of those years. Mind you, my fellow board members were typical farmers, good people, but not exactly well-versed in understanding the balance sheet and income statement of a cotton gin as opposed to their farming operations. Plus, we kept the books of the gin on an accrual basis, not cash which they were far more familiar with. However, the Chairman of the Board had taken pains to understand the books and had questioned me in quite some detail about it to the point that he had a fairly good grip on it.

So we're reviewing the financials. When they saw the amount of A/R on the books, one literally left the room and got sick from purely not understanding it. The President (titular, not active mgt) got so mad about it, he made the statement that not only did he not understand the financials, but he didn't want to understand them (is this sounding familiar?).

Cut to the chase. At the end of the meeting, the Chairman resigned his position and left. Stunned everyone, especially me because he had really worked to understand the business he was now in. After the meeting I went to his home and asked him what in the world possessed him to do that?

Have never forgotten his reply. He said, "Did you not hear the President say that not only was he ignorant, but he intended to remain that way. I do not need to be in business with people like that."
 
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#29,350
#29,350
WoodsmanVol said:
Hello, hog, still wallowing in the mudhole, I see. Cause you know dayum well your MAGA-liars will block any effort to change gun laws, whether via the Constitution or anything else. Stop pulling lies out your rear southern end, they smell already. :cool:
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That is the law. Last I have seen. You lefties
love the law. Or is it lefties love the law when it suits you. I imagine you idiots will find a work around and get your way.
 
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