Heupel vs Pruitt vs Jones vs Dooley - Three Years In

#53
#53
The 2017 team was beyond terrible. Ranked last in the conference in scoring offense and fourth from last in scoring defense.

2018 and 2020 under Pruitt were terrible too. Thank goodness we have Heupel.
 
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#55
#55
BeardedVol said:
OF the 4, Heupel started off with the best roster of all of them.
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Interesting. Are you referring to the dynamic trio of Hooker, Hyatt, and Tillman? These three seemed to execute Heupels scheme perfectly.

Other than them (and a few others), it seems Heupel did not inherit much. How many transferred out, like 27 or something like that.? How many scholarships did UT surrender?

I‘m nit trying to argue or pick a fight. I‘m truly interested in your thoughts on this. Everyone else seems to think Heupel started with way less. What’s your train of thought?
 
#56
#56
Sarms58 said:
Yep...Heupel has the best second best first 3 years since Bill Battle. Only Fulmer had a better start.
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Battle inherited a very good team. Couldn’t sustain it because he was a not a cheat, even though he was a bammer.
 
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#57
#57
casual-observer said:
Maybe?

I'm not disagreeing with your statement, but also consider...

Kiffin inherited the UT brand and Fulmer's recruits. Fulmer had two rough years (out of 17) and 15 years of 8+ wins. Look what Heupel got 🤷‍♂️
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We had 2 walk-ons starting on the OL and Jonathan Crompton at QB
 
#58
#58
BernardKingGOAT said:
Dickey????🤣🤣🤣🤣 He cut from us in 1969 at least as bad as Kiffin did in 2009. Yeah, he got back here as AD and did an admirable job for fundraising and the football program. He had Pat for women's basketball, Thank God! All other programs slid into mediocrity except men's basketball, which slid into the cellar. He didn't give a damn either. We went from being nationally relevant to being a doormat while he was there, and didn't give a damn. Fuuuuk him. He was still holding a grudge for the basketball program because Mears became more popular than him while they were head coaches. Mears had coined "Big Orange Country".

If all you care about is football, then I get your post

And still the worst loss in Tennessee history was the 0 - 38 we took with him in 1969 at Ole Miss. We were 8-0, ranked no. 3 and primed to play for the national championship. It's the worst loss because we were LOADED
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That loss to Archie Manning was a complete shocker. We had destroyed them in ‘68 and they got their revenge in spades. The team pretty much fell apart after that. Ended with Tricky Dickey announcing he was leaving 2days before the gator bowl. For some odd reason we let him coach the game and he made several questionable calls during the game.
 
#61
#61
Mimi#1 said:
I agree with two of the three. I think Kevin O'Neill was the absolute worst hire in men's basketball.
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O'Neill was a solid recruiter and left Jerry Green a boat load of a talented roster that Green could not get past North Carolina in the NCAA Tournament.

That roster had Final Four potential.

It was a damn shame that Dickey could not close the deal with Roy Williams.
 
#62
#62
casual-observer said:
Interesting. Are you referring to the dynamic trio of Hooker, Hyatt, and Tillman? These three seemed to execute Heupels scheme perfectly.

Other than them (and a few others), it seems Heupel did not inherit much. How many transferred out, like 27 or something like that.? How many scholarships did UT surrender?

I‘m nit trying to argue or pick a fight. I‘m truly interested in your thoughts on this. Everyone else seems to think Heupel started with way less. What’s your train of thought?
Click to expand...

I'm talking overall talent on the roster at the time of taking over the program.

2021 Football Roster - University of Tennessee Athletics

The official 2021 Football Roster for the University of Tennessee Volunteers
utsports.com utsports.com
 
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#63
#63
casual-observer said:
Below are UT conference rankings since 2009. This is Tennessee's ranking in the SEC, only factoring SEC games. Both cupcakes and out-of-conference play are not considered. It's meant to be a comparison of how UT played against similar conference opponents. There are factors not considered such as: if UT had a weak vs strong conference matchup year. A couple of things stand out:

-> Heupel has clearly achieved more with less. Consider the state of the program he inherited, the mass exodus to the transfer portal, and the compounding twelve years of garbage before him, I would say the numbers are actually more impressive than they look.

-> 2023, while mostly a regressed year, still ranks equal to or better than CDD, CBJ, and CJP in their third year. The worst regression was on the offensive side of the ball...was it Hooker & Hyatt or Golesh or both?

-> Under Heupel, the defense has mostly been improving. Still at or below average in the conference, but the numbers are improving. Passing defense has a lot of room for improvement (Martinez?). Notice the numbers from '13-'16...Martinez was at UT then, too. Maybe it's more personnel vs coach?

-> The worst step-back this year was in both converting in the Red Zone and defending the Red Zone (near the bottom in both categories).

-> Time of possession - near the bottom of the conference every year (badge of honor)
-> Penalties - come on, guys!!! Either (a) it's hard to stay focused in the tempo offense, (b) UT lacks serious discipline, or (c) there really is an officiating conspiracy against UT
-> Turnover Margin - ugh. Always, ugh.


View attachment 598489
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Look at all the green under JH and top 5 categories with basically 2 recruiting classes in 3 years. Technically should be working on class 4 now. He is truly worked miracles with this team in less than 3 years.
 
#64
#64
casual-observer said:
Below are UT conference rankings since 2009. This is Tennessee's ranking in the SEC, only factoring SEC games. Both cupcakes and out-of-conference play are not considered. It's meant to be a comparison of how UT played against similar conference opponents. There are factors not considered such as: if UT had a weak vs strong conference matchup year. A couple of things stand out:

-> Heupel has clearly achieved more with less. Consider the state of the program he inherited, the mass exodus to the transfer portal, and the compounding twelve years of garbage before him, I would say the numbers are actually more impressive than they look.

-> 2023, while mostly a regressed year, still ranks equal to or better than CDD, CBJ, and CJP in their third year. The worst regression was on the offensive side of the ball...was it Hooker & Hyatt or Golesh or both?

-> Under Heupel, the defense has mostly been improving. Still at or below average in the conference, but the numbers are improving. Passing defense has a lot of room for improvement (Martinez?). Notice the numbers from '13-'16...Martinez was at UT then, too. Maybe it's more personnel vs coach?

-> The worst step-back this year was in both converting in the Red Zone and defending the Red Zone (near the bottom in both categories).

-> Time of possession - near the bottom of the conference every year (badge of honor)
-> Penalties - come on, guys!!! Either (a) it's hard to stay focused in the tempo offense, (b) UT lacks serious discipline, or (c) there really is an officiating conspiracy against UT
-> Turnover Margin - ugh. Always, ugh.


View attachment 598489
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BJ had it going in 15 -16 then something major happened in 17 and it went to $h!t quick! Cornbread's dumpster fire in 20 to JH in 21 was a massive turnaround on offense.
 
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#65
#65
Frozevol said:
That loss to Archie Manning was a complete shocker. We had destroyed them in ‘68 and they got their revenge in spades. The team pretty much fell apart after that. Ended with Tricky Dickey announcing he was leaving 2days before the gator bowl. For some odd reason we let him coach the game and he made several questionable calls during the game.
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Playing his next team
 
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#66
#66
turbovol said:
I don't believe any of Dooley, Jones, Pruitt or Heupel inherited much talent.

We would have been /very good/ if Kiffin had stayed. He put together a very strong staff. Look what he's done at Ole Miss, and you can
imagine what he could have done here.
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Don’t forget he got kicked off the team bus and fired at USC….. I think he had quite a bit of growing up to do when he left Knoxville.it may not have been as ideal as you think…. It could have, but I think he’ll admit he had a lot to learn
 
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#68
#68
Carl Pickens said:
Don’t forget he got kicked off the team bus and fired at USC….. I think he had quite a bit of growing up to do when he left Knoxville.it may not have been as ideal as you think…. It could have, but I think he’ll admit he had a lot to learn
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Kuck Fiffen... That said, in retrospect, he didn't get a fair shake at USC. They were hit with sanctions from the Reggie Bush stuff but he was expected to live up to the expectations that Pete Carroll left.

This is one of the reasons I cringe when people jump on the "Fahr Hypel" wagon. Those sanctions hurt really bad when the standard is to compete for conference championships.

However, I completely agree that he has grown up and learned quite a bit since then, so he's probably a much, much better coach now.
 
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#69
#69
tennesseeduke said:
BJ had it going in 15 -16 then something major happened in 17 and it went to $h!t quick! Cornbread's dumpster fire in 20 to JH in 21 was a massive turnaround on offense.
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My theory is that they both “lost the locker rooms.”

If this is true, it highlights the importance of recruiting for attitude as much as raw skill.
 
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#71
#71
Volador said:
Isn't this comparing them....??!!!!
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Sure is, in the way that matters with the agenda of showing that three should be compared and one is uncomparable. I believe it's addition by subtraction or some other podcast philosopher ****.
 
#75
#75
At the end of the day it’s about 2 things:

Wins vs losses and the Jimmie’s and Joes on the field.

He’s doing a great job with both so far!
 
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