House votes to decriminalize marijuana at federal level

[Rickyvol77]

It’s hillarious that anyone thinks there are people sitting in jail with their only crime being “simple possession.” For those that don’t know what the charge is, it’s being in possession of less than half an ounce. It’s a misdemeanor. In the overwhelming number of these cases it is a citation. In almost every case, this is plead down. Why do people end up in jail? One, they are typically connected with a list of other crimes, most often domestic. Two, failure to appear.

What’s more hilarious is that the Biden admin believes there are people in FEDERAL prisons for no other charge than simple possession. Can you guess how many federal pardons he’s going to actually have to issue? If anyone thinks our federal law agents are going after people for possession of less than 1/2 ounce of pot, you’ve lost your mind. This is nothing more than a stunt before the mid term elections. It has no substance.

You can’t explain that to the potheads. They still believe it’s 1964 and people are being put in prison for a joint

 

[hog88]

Citing simple possession is playing semantics. Possession of weed should not be illegal. It's that simple

I agree 100% but yesterdays announcement does nothing to further the push towards legalization. As soon as Biden said he was directing HHS and DOJ to "study" removing pot as a schedule 1 drug you had to know the end result.

 

[Allvols1996]

You can’t explain that to the potheads. They still believe it’s 1964 and people are being put in prison for a joint

I spoke with a prosecutor today and asked the question. How many people have you sentenced to jail time for simple possession? Answer: ZERO. And that’s in one of the most conservative counties in the state.

 

[RockyTop85]

It’s hillarious that anyone thinks there are people sitting in jail with their only crime being “simple possession.” For those that don’t know what the charge is, it’s being in possession of less than half an ounce. It’s a misdemeanor. In the overwhelming number of these cases it is a citation. In almost every case, this is plead down. Why do people end up in jail? One, they are typically connected with a list of other crimes, most often domestic. Two, failure to appear.

What’s more hilarious is that the Biden admin believes there are people in FEDERAL prisons for no other charge than simple possession. Can you guess how many federal pardons he’s going to actually have to issue? If anyone thinks our federal law agents are going after people for possession of less than 1/2 ounce of pot, you’ve lost your mind. This is nothing more than a stunt before the mid term elections. It has no substance.

I spoke with a prosecutor today and asked the question. How many people have you sentenced to jail time for simple possession? Answer: ZERO. And that’s in one of the most conservative counties in the state.

You’re probably mostly right, but you’re conflating Tennessee law, which is totally unaffected by this federal pardon, with federal law.

I’m reasonably sure Federal law doesn’t define felony possession of marijuana to include a specific quantity. (Neither does Tennessee law, if we’re being precise. See TCA 39-17-417)

But replace your references to quantity with manufacturing, delivering, selling, or possessing with intent to manufacture, sell or deliver and the whole thing is basically accurate.

There’s probably nobody in jail (although there are other benefits to a pardon than being let out of jail but for a misdemeanor like this they’re pretty minimal) and the FBI generally isn’t out looking for people who are just consuming.

Most 21 USC 844 violations are probably caught by the National Park Service and the GSA police(?) who enforce the law inside federal buildings, if I had to guess. Whether or not they arrest or cite you for it, I have no idea. That may have been another carry over from Tennessee law.

 

[Allvols1996]

You’re probably mostly right, but you’re conflating Tennessee law, which is totally unaffected by this federal pardon, with federal law.

I’m reasonably sure Federal law doesn’t define felony possession of marijuana to include a specific quantity. (Neither does Tennessee law, if we’re being precise. See TCA 39-17-417)

But replace your references to quantity with manufacturing, delivering, selling, or possessing with intent to manufacture, sell or deliver and the whole thing is basically accurate.

There’s probably nobody in jail (although there are other benefits to a pardon than being let out of jail but for a misdemeanor like this they’re pretty minimal) and the FBI generally isn’t out looking for people who are just consuming.

Most 21 USC 844 violations are probably caught by the National Park Service and the GSA police(?) who enforce the law inside federal buildings, if I had to guess. Whether or not they arrest or cite you for it, I have no idea. That may have been another carry over from Tennessee law.

Let me first restate, that I’m for the decriminalization of pot. It wastes incredible finances and resources pursuing trivial crime.
The feds don’t waste their time citing people for simple possession, the only exception being if it is attached to a list of more serious crimes.

The overwhelming number of people involved in sale and distribution are likely involved in a myriad of illegal activities such as money laundering, illegal firearms, and more serious drugs.

Most states offer diversion and you can have the charge wiped off your record in 1 year if you Stay out of trouble going forward.

 

[hUTch2002]

It’s hillarious that anyone thinks there are people sitting in jail with their only crime being “simple possession.” For those that don’t know what the charge is, it’s being in possession of less than half an ounce. It’s a misdemeanor. In the overwhelming number of these cases it is a citation. In almost every case, this is plead down. Why do people end up in jail? One, they are typically connected with a list of other crimes, most often domestic. Two, failure to appear.

What’s more hilarious is that the Biden admin believes there are people in FEDERAL prisons for no other charge than simple possession. Can you guess how many federal pardons he’s going to actually have to issue? If anyone thinks our federal law agents are going after people for possession of less than 1/2 ounce of pot, you’ve lost your mind. This is nothing more than a stunt before the mid term elections. It has no substance.

Hey, I actually know someone who has a Federal possession misdemeanor. If I hadn’t seen it with my own eyes I wouldn’t believe it. Of course, that’s not where the charges started. That’s just where it ended up.

 

[hUTch2002]

Let me first restate, that I’m for the decriminalization of pot. It wastes incredible finances and resources pursuing trivial crime.
The feds don’t waste their time citing people for simple possession, the only exception being if it is attached to a list of more serious crimes.

The overwhelming number of people involved in sale and distribution are likely involved in a myriad of illegal activities such as money laundering, illegal firearms, and more serious drugs.

Most states offer diversion and you can have the charge wiped off your record in 1 year if you Stay out of trouble going forward.

You’re mixing again. You say the Feds don’t waste their time with simple possession and then say the state offers diversion. Those are 2 different things. The state wouldn’t be giving diversion off of Fed charges. The Feds might. That’s what happened in the situation I saw where the conviction was Federal possession. 1 year if probation since there were no prior crimes. Had the Feds dropped the charges, which was an option, the state then could’ve filed charges and the process would’ve started over.

 

[RockyTop85]

Let me first restate, that I’m for the decriminalization of pot. It wastes incredible finances and resources pursuing trivial crime.
The feds don’t waste their time citing people for simple possession, the only exception being if it is attached to a list of more serious crimes.

The overwhelming number of people involved in sale and distribution are likely involved in a myriad of illegal activities such as money laundering, illegal firearms, and more serious drugs.

Most states offer diversion and you can have the charge wiped off your record in 1 year if you Stay out of trouble going forward.

The national park service will literally pull you over and ticket you for speeding. Yes, they will enforce simple possession of marijuana, when it comes to their attention. Same with GSA and probably some other agencies that are involved in securing federal property.

Again, it’s such a small number of people that you’re essentially correct, but you’re drawing on a lot of incorrect generalizations to get there.

 

[RockyTop85]

You’re mixing again. You say the Feds don’t waste their time with simple possession and then say the state offers diversion. Those are 2 different things. The state wouldn’t be giving diversion off of Fed charges. The Feds might. That’s what happened in the situation I saw where the conviction was Federal possession. 1 year if probation since there were no prior crimes. Had the Feds dropped the charges, which was an option, the state then could’ve filed charges and the process would’ve started over.

Again, just being nit picky, but: The state and federal governments can actually have concurrent prosecutions for the same criminal activity. It came before the Supreme Court again a few years ago and they reiterated that it wasn’t a double jeopardy issue because it’s two different governments.

It’s not something that would happen in that situation, usually, but if you’re known to the system they will absolutely jam you up that way.

 

[Allvols1996]

The national park service will literally pull you over and ticket you for speeding. Yes, they will enforce simple possession of marijuana, when it comes to their attention. Same with GSA and probably some other agencies that are involved in securing federal property.

Again, it’s such a small number of people that you’re essentially correct, but you’re drawing on a lot of incorrect generalizations to get there.

Lots of inner city people speeding through the national park?? It’s an absurdly small number, and still results in little more than citation, reduction, diversion or dismissal.

 

[Allvols1996]

Again, just being nit picky, but: The state and federal governments can actually have concurrent prosecutions for the same criminal activity. It came before the Supreme Court again a few years ago and they reiterated that it wasn’t a double jeopardy issue because it’s two different governments.

It’s not something that would happen in that situation, usually, but if you’re known to the system they will absolutely jam you up that way.

Having some connections to this, I’ve had many a discussion with prosecutors. They cannot recall any case where an individual received any time for simple possession.

 

[hUTch2002]

Again, just being nit picky, but: The state and federal governments can actually have concurrent prosecutions for the same criminal activity. It came before the Supreme Court again a few years ago and they reiterated that it wasn’t a double jeopardy issue because it’s two different governments.

It’s not something that would happen in that situation, usually, but if you’re known to the system they will absolutely jam you up that way.

Yep. And that’s how the situation I know about resulted in pleading guilty to Federal misdemeanor possession. The Feds were willing to drop it but the lawyer said the state could then pick it up and it wasn’t worth the risk when probation with no time served was almost a guarantee.

 

[Allvols1996]

You’re mixing again. You say the Feds don’t waste their time with simple possession and then say the state offers diversion. Those are 2 different things. The state wouldn’t be giving diversion off of Fed charges. The Feds might. That’s what happened in the situation I saw where the conviction was Federal possession. 1 year if probation since there were no prior crimes. Had the Feds dropped the charges, which was an option, the state then could’ve filed charges and the process would’ve started over.

I’m not mixing. The fed doesn’t police simple possession. I think the one case example was if you got pulled over by a ranger. I can assure you park rangers have little interest in traffic stops and pot possession. And then, you’d have to be in federal lands.
The cases where someone is charged with simple possession at federal level is attached to a list of more serious charges. The fed doesn’t pull people over or waste their time with petty crime. It’s a bogeyman.

 

[IluvdoubleD's]

The fed dies not make pardons for the states. American gov. does that. The thing is state laws have been based on fed law:

 

[IluvdoubleD's]

When fed law changes, it gives states the right to change.

 

[RockyTop85]

Having some connections to this, I’ve had many a discussion with prosecutors. They cannot recall any case where an individual received any time for simple possession.

I agreed with that several posts ago.

But replace your references to quantity with manufacturing, delivering, selling, or possessing with intent to manufacture, sell or deliver and the whole thing is basically accurate.

There’s probably nobody in jail (although there are other benefits to a pardon than being let out of jail but for a misdemeanor like this they’re pretty minimal) and the FBI generally isn’t out looking for people who are just consuming.

But nearly everything else you’re saying is based on State law, incorrect homogenization of federal law enforcement agencies, and broad brush generalizations about drug use. Most of that stuff is incorrect.

 

[RockyTop85]

Yep. And that’s how the situation I know about resulted in pleading guilty to Federal misdemeanor possession. The Feds were willing to drop it but the lawyer said the state could then pick it up and it wasn’t worth the risk when probation with no time served was almost a guarantee.

Yeah, generally you’d want to try to get the state prosecutor (or US Attorney, if the situation were reversed) to put something in writing saying they’ll decline charges if you plead to the other but unless you’re Jeffrey Epstein or Bill Cosby, good luck.

If it’s your first rodeo, it’s usually not that big of a threat. Unless you’re like a known gang member that they’ve been after for a while or something. Usually the state just waits until the feds get done with you and then let’s 330 million people pay for your food and housing instead of 6 million, or whatever Tennessee’s population is. I can only remember one person I’ve ever heard of getting convicted concurrently for the same criminal behavior in both state and federal courts and he really worked hard to earn that distinction.

 

[Allvols1996]

I agreed with that several posts ago.



But nearly everything else you’re saying is based on State law, incorrect homogenization of federal law enforcement agencies, and broad brush generalizations about drug use. Most of that stuff is incorrect.

Wrong. The point is that federal agents aren’t “policing,” simple possession. Biden’s wording specifies simple possession. They are looking for dealers, traffickers and people who are operating on large scale.

 

[RockyTop85]

Wrong. The point is that federal agents aren’t “policing,” simple possession. Biden’s wording specifies simple possession. They are looking for dealers, traffickers and people who are operating on large scale.

You’re still homogenizing “federal agents.” For FBI and some others this is correct. Others have an daily agenda that’s similar to local cops. TSA, border and customs, etc would be another example.

 

[Allvols1996]

You’re still homogenizing “federal agents.” For FBI and some others this is correct. Others have an daily agenda that’s similar to local cops. TSA, border and customs, etc would be another example.

Similar? Border is dealing with non-citizens. TSA? You’re reaching. My point is that Biden’s pardon is a symbolic bunch of hogwash and a Mid-term election stunt. It has no real substance.

 

[RockyTop85]

Similar? Border is dealing with non-citizens. TSA? You’re reaching. My point is that Biden’s pardon is a symbolic bunch of hogwash and a Mid-term election stunt. It has no real substance.

Yes, similar in that those agencies essentially patrol a specific jurisdiction and enforce federal law when a violation becomes apparent, especially possessory or status crimes.

That is the same basic function as local beat cop as opposed to DEA or FBI who have more of an investigatory mandate.

Border and customs do not deal exclusively with non-citizens. Also what significant difference would that make? It’s still a federal crime if a non-citizen tries to come across the border with a small amount of marijuana.

And if you think TSA is a reach, go try to hop on a flight with a blunt in your carry on.

 

[Allvols1996]

Yes, similar in that those agencies essentially patrol a specific jurisdiction and enforce federal law when a violation becomes apparent, especially possessory or status crimes.

That is the same basic function as local beat cop as opposed to DEA or FBI who have more of an investigatory mandate.

Border and customs do not deal exclusively with non-citizens. Also what significant difference would that make? It’s still a federal crime if a non-citizen tries to come across the border with a small amount of marijuana.

People funneling through a specific narrow check point is completely different. No comparison.

 

[RockyTop85]

People funneling through a specific narrow check point is completely different. No comparison.

In the ways that are relevant to this discussion it is essentially identical.

 

[DrRosenRosen]

And if you think TSA is a reach, go try to hop on a flight with a blunt in your carry on.

FWIW, I've never had a problem flying with bud.

 

[Allvols1996]

I agreed with that several posts ago.



But nearly everything else you’re saying is based on State law, incorrect homogenization of federal law enforcement agencies, and broad brush generalizations about drug use. Most of that stuff is incorrect.

A nice little summary!
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