House votes to decriminalize marijuana at federal level

[LouderVol]

My church would be happy to take that challenge. Don't focus on the bad players. There is a lot of good being done.

its the government, they should be hitting everyone equally, good, bad, or neutral.

I don't know about dink, but my stance is if you claim to be a charitable organization you have to prove some set level actually goes to charity. I don't care if you are a church, planned parenthood, or some private university. you hit that bar that is the same across any "type" of charity and you get/keep the 501c benefits, you fall below it, get ready for the IRS.

 

[McDad]

its the government, they should be hitting everyone equally, good, bad, or neutral.

I don't know about dink, but my stance is if you claim to be a charitable organization you have to prove some set level actually goes to charity. I don't care if you are a church, planned parenthood, or some private university. you hit that bar that is the same across any "type" of charity and you get/keep the 501c benefits, you fall below it, get ready for the IRS.

Do you tax it as earned income, unearned income, capital gains, or some new special classification?

 

[Thunder Good-Oil]

you have need to establish how equality equals hate.

Equality isn’t relevant. The 1st Amendment protects the right and the IRS code is specific that donations to churches qualify under 501(c)(3).

Singling out churches while giving PP a pass is lazy and hateful.

 

[82_VOL_83]

The Devil's lettuce continues to divide us....

meh, I'd say the divide anymore is about 80/20 or greater for. Plenty of parishioners toke up occasionally.

 

[Thunder Good-Oil]

Oh, I'm an aspiring poet now? Is that your dig?

Maybe you should have studied literature at your community college. You may have learned how to write a decent joke in the process.

It’s not a joke, it’s an analogy. The minutia of church finances need to be examined and judged by the government in order to qualify as exempt but the educational institutions that award you liberals social studies degrees get automatic passes?

Not surprised that you’re taking the dig at community colleges now. You relish spreading the hate. Those students are from the basket of deplorables, right?

 

[82_VOL_83]

Am I expected to give to St. Judes? Am I expected to tithe at your typical Southern Baptist church?

I know you know those aren't the same.

No, it's not a requirement. I would say it's way less prevalent than it was.

 

[LouderVol]

Equality isn’t relevant. The 1st Amendment protects the right and the IRS code is specific that donations to churches qualify under 501(c)(3).

Singling out churches while giving PP a pass is lazy and hateful.

Dude you are being lazy or dishonest. Even in that quote I said that PP wouldn't be any different than a church. said as much in multiple posts.

"under my proposal the answer would be zero. there would be no unique religious target or tax. everyone who can't prove X level of charity gets taxed. period. don't care if you are a non-charity, PP, the local Catholic church, the small baptist church down the road, or Joel Osteen."

The 1st doesn't equate to a protection from taxes. they have the right to be a church regardless of them being taxed or not. they aren't being targeted for being a church, they are being targeted for the income they generate. being a church doesn't grant them any protection from any other criminal charges, not sure why they are given a special tax exemption if they are still subject to all the other laws which would be constraints on the 1A in your book.

they still have to obey building codes, zoning codes, safety/OSHA codes, employment requirements, etc etc etc etc. none of it is considered an attack on the 1A. why is taxes suddenly a 1A issue?

 

[MercyPercy]

Small churches and charities don’t have the expensive lawyers and accountants to interpret costs and creatively categorize them as expenses to suit the government’s rules. Churches specifically meet the criteria by simply having services. When they also serve communities that’s added value. Abortions are quite a stretch to label as charitable use of donations.

Churches relieve a great deal of the burden that would fall to governments, so their tax status is very well deserved. A group of nuns started the national network of food banks. Locally a coalition of churches started the ones (Knoxville, Chattanooga, Tri-cities) in East Tennessee from the ground up.

Even the wealthy churches generate massive revenue for governments. The preachers and others on their payrolls are taxed. The construction companies that have built a half million churches in this country have contributed huge revenues to the government.

It’s just hateful rhetoric to call for churches to be taxed. The government doesn’t have the resources or the good and fair judgement to determine which churches are using their funds appropriately. Plus they’d also spend a fortune losing court battles over which 1st Amendment rights they’ve trampled.

To be clear, you're defending the tax exempt status of, let's see, which random charlatan stealing money from the elderly should I pick... Joel Osteen or Ken Copeland's church? That's your sacred cow?

 

[LouderVol]

Do you tax it as earned income, unearned income, capital gains, or some new special classification?

how does any business consider their income? I would assume earned income, but not familiar with everything that would equal.

Two scenarios:
a business that generates 1 million dollars in income, and spends 50% on charitable activities.
a church that generates 1 million dollars in income(donations), and spends 5% on charitable activities.

under the current laws that church gets a pass as a 501c, while the business does not. doesn't seem like an equitable situation, and is dodging the purpose of a 501c. I don't want to get bogged down with the specifics because I can't imagine if that scenario existed that the business is paying too much in taxes with that much deduction, but its the general point.

if things were equal the business would be the 501c in that scenario, while the church isn't. I don't see how that as wrong or hateful.

 

[LouderVol]

To be clear, you're defending the tax exempt status of, let's see, which random charlatan stealing money from the elderly should I pick... Joel Osteen or Ken Copeland's church? That's your sacred cow?

Joel shouldn't have to pay in their world because The First Southern Baptist church on Route 34 does good work.

 

[Thunder Good-Oil]

Dude you are being lazy or dishonest. Even in that quote I said that PP wouldn't be any different than a church. said as much in multiple posts.

"under my proposal the answer would be zero. there would be no unique religious target or tax. everyone who can't prove X level of charity gets taxed. period. don't care if you are a non-charity, PP, the local Catholic church, the small baptist church down the road, or Joel Osteen."

The 1st doesn't equate to a protection from taxes. they have the right to be a church regardless of them being taxed or not. they aren't being targeted for being a church, they are being targeted for the income they generate. being a church doesn't grant them any protection from any other criminal charges, not sure why they are given a special tax exemption if they are still subject to all the other laws which would be constraints on the 1A in your book.

they still have to obey building codes, zoning codes, safety/OSHA codes, employment requirements, etc etc etc etc. none of it is considered an attack on the 1A. why is taxes suddenly a 1A issue?

The 4A would come into play when churches also have specific language in the 1A.

Churches don’t have to prove level X. Charitable organizations actually do have that burden. Case in point - Google Cancer Fund of America. But their lawyers are better than the IRS’s.

 

[Thunder Good-Oil]

To be clear, you're defending the tax exempt status of, let's see, which random charlatan stealing money from the elderly should I pick... Joel Osteen or Ken Copeland's church? That's your sacred cow?

My stance is that it’s not the government’s business and the leftists embrace weaponizing the IRS to attack those organizations that they have issues with. And it’s hypocritical of them to accept PP’s exempt status as well as things like social studies degrees and the arts.

If Olsteen’s church brings enlightenment to elderly followers then what’s the problem? Why should the government be involved?

 

[Vol8188]

It was more directly responding to his point.

I'm saying tithing isn't the same as donating. Apples and oranges. Expected versus appreciated.

As far as moving goalposts, that was directed towards his argument. "Well, then don't donate" isn't always realistic. Therefore, the next logical step would be "well, don't go there" which, I will add, he immediately said after that post.

That’s not moving the goal post. That’s just basic logic. Your claim seems to be that these organizations aren’t using enough of their proceeds for charitable causes.

When I see a charity that doesn’t donate the percent I consider to be acceptable, I don’t advocate for changes to any law.

I simply don’t donate. That’s not moving a goal post.

 

[Thunder Good-Oil]

Can we now go burn a doob in Dinkey’s bar?

 

[Vol8188]

Nope. Simply stated that I'd tax a church before a casino and the Jesus harpies started squawking.

You believe taxes to be voluntary? If not, then yes, you’re advocating for force. As opposed to simply not attending/donating to organizations you disapprove of

 

[Vol8188]

to what level though? 1%, 5%, 15%, 30%, 50%, 75% of operating budget? at some point they should be taxed like the rest of us, and I don't see a problem creating that threshold.

My office organizes and funds several charitable events and projects. my understanding of the tax code says we can take some deductions for that; but we don't get close to a 501c status.

Why does the level matter? If you disapprove with the level, don’t donate to them.

Why do you believe you need to bring armed government thugs into this equation?

 

[DinkinFlicka]

My stance is that it’s not the government’s business and the leftists embrace weaponizing the IRS to attack those organizations that they have issues with. And it’s hypocritical of them to accept PP’s exempt status as well as things like social studies degrees and the arts.

If Olsteen’s church brings enlightenment to elderly followers then what’s the problem? Why should the government be involved?

You're defending Osteen.

Full R word.

 

[DinkinFlicka]

Joel shouldn't have to pay in their world because The First Southern Baptist church on Route 34 does good work.

****ing thank you.

 

[DinkinFlicka]

It’s not a joke, it’s an analogy. The minutia of church finances need to be examined and judged by the government in order to qualify as exempt but the educational institutions that award you liberals social studies degrees get automatic passes?

Not surprised that you’re taking the dig at community colleges now. You relish spreading the hate. Those students are from the basket of deplorables, right?

Nah I'm just saying you aren't that smart.

 

[Thunder Good-Oil]

That’s not moving the goal post. That’s just basic logic. Your claim seems to be that these organizations aren’t using enough of their proceeds for charitable causes.

When I see a charity that doesn’t donate the percent I consider to be acceptable, I don’t advocate for changes to any law.

I simply don’t donate. That’s not moving a goal post.

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But shouldn’t we grow a bigger government to police the churches and charities? There are already too many churches full of deplorables in the flyover states.

 

[DinkinFlicka]

You believe taxes to be voluntary? If not, then yes, you’re advocating for force. As opposed to simply not attending/donating to organizations you disapprove of

Lol.

You found the notion of taxing a church before a casino to be laughable, and now you're saying I want to sic the tax man on Christisnity because I 'disapprove' of it.

What a ****in' joke.

 

[Thunder Good-Oil]

You're defending Osteen.

Full R word.

Do you realize that he’s made his fortune by selling books? Doesn’t he know that he’s not allowed to be successful? So the government should step in because he isn’t in the poverty class like Jesus? Envy tax.

 

[LouderVol]

The 4A would come into play when churches also have specific language in the 1A.

Churches don’t have to prove level X. Charitable organizations actually do have that burden. Case in point - Google Cancer Fund of America. But their lawyers are better than the IRS’s.

No it doesn't. At least not under the operation of entire tax code as it is. if a church won a case saying that taxation was unlawful search and seizure that would apply to far more than churches.

Freedom of religion, speech, assembly doesn't come with ANY explicit, or implied, tax exemptions.

again they aren't being taxed because they are churches. everyone is taxed because they have an income, and under my rules, aren't meeting a charitable threshold.

 

[MercyPercy]

I'm looking for Walmart to rebrand as Jesus mart, and indicate their charitable donations (which I'm sure already exist) are part of their religious beliefs.

Tax free baby!

 

[Thunder Good-Oil]

Nah I'm just saying you aren't that smart.

Now why would you say that other than to be even more hateful? You’re quite the toxic hipster.

When did I claim to be smart?