How in the world..

#26
#26
Every culture had slaves.. Irish, Chinese, Latino, etc... All of them live in the melting pot of the USA and I'm just saying how long does this discussion last?
 
#27
#27
vader said:
I can't wait to read the "slavery was not so bad" argument.
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Rasputin_Vol said:
Your first sentence is about as ridiculous as your second sentence is irrelevant.
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GAVol said:
Glad I'm not the only one thinking that. I read that post and had visions of a guy in a field chopping cotton thinking "This really sucks . . . but my ancestors got me into this, so it's all good."
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emainvol said:
Wow, I mean, I have said some dumb things in this forum, but jesus.
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I can't believe you guys are picking on the sweetest girl on Volnation, shame! What I mean is there are people in bondage to their religions and doctrines, etc. That was all I meant by the relative term.

Vader, Funny. Sure it was horrible and awful, I'm just sick of paying for it when I had nothing to do with it. I am a former social worker (and I lived in ATL for a while) and I've been the unfortunate victim to a LOAD of racial BS just b/c I was white trying to help poor whites AND minorities. My big fat crime is being white and educated in the ghetto or barrios. Oddly enough that is when I became a Republican :)

Ras, we never agree on anything, seriously, I'm not sure we have ever agreed so I'm not gonna lose any sleep hoping that we will start seeing eye to eye anytime soon. My opinions come from my experiences, they are not ridiculous. From what I've witnessed in my short time on the nation, you are very passionate about racial issues and I can respect that. And I look forward to more friendly banter. I'm smiling...

GAVol, that is hiliarious! :birgits_giggle:

Emainvol, you got something with any kind of substance to say or are you just gonna ride on the aforementioned coat tails? What? Are you gonna cry now? I could of out Lib'd you any day of the week!

Smoochies Boys, I'm always right, get used to it...

Y'all -0
Volnissniss-4
:peace2:
 
#28
#28
tim said:
Every culture had slaves.. Irish, Chinese, Latino, etc... All of them live in the melting pot of the USA and I'm just saying how long does this discussion last?
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The African Slave Trade was similar only to the enslavement of the Hebrew peoples by the ancient Egyptians.

All the other slave practices in between involved single generations and rarely lasted a lifetime.
 
#30
#30
There are probably those on the board that would argue your ability to out Lib me. :)
 
#31
#31
Volnissniss said:
I can't believe you guys are picking on the sweetest girl on Volnation, shame! What I mean is there are people in bondage to their religions and doctrines, etc. That was all I meant by the relative term.
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I have to respectfully disagree that a person being trapped by a drug addiction or their religion or the culture around them is equal to African slavery in America. You can always denounce your religion, move to California where they have no doctrines, or quit drinking. Pretty hard for an African slave to give up slavery. :ermm:

Not even in the same ballpark.
 
#32
#32
Rasputin_Vol said:
I have to respectfully disagree that a person being trapped by a drug addiction or their religion or the culture around them is equal to African slavery in America. You can always denounce your religion, move to California where they have no doctrines, or quit drinking. Pretty hard for an African slave to give up slavery. :ermm:

Not even in the same ballpark.
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Look Ras, what is your deal? I explained what I meant. I wasn't drawing comparisons I was saying the word itself is RELATIVE, meaning it can mean different things in different contexts.

Slavery sucked and I wish it never ever happened but it did and a load of WHITE and black people died to ensure it was abolished. And now what does it matter? Blacks and whites in the south for some stupid reason still can't get along. I'm sick of the race crap. I like nice people, I could care less the color of their skin. However, I have experienced a lot of racism from AA. It was probably largely due to the fact that I worked in that environment and was an easy target. But you have to agree that is sad.

It is still so uncomfortable meeting a person of color b/c God forbid you describe Usher as being black when they perfer you to use the term African American or if you use the term AA they might prefer black, it's all messed up. Even my mother had her tires slashed (when I was a kid) by a group of black girls b/c her lab partner in one of her nursing school classes was a black guy and she is third generation upstate New York and before that England.

I got tired of fighting a fight I could never win. And I really like to win. :) Peace between whites and blacks in the south is just never going to happen, never. I don't agree with it but you have to admit even when there is a "friendship" if there is a racial issue that comes up there is that elephant in the room. So it's almost like the only way to get passed it is to stop reminding young AA that they were once beat and put down and were all these horrible things by the white man. It automatically creates this Black Vs White. Each generation keeps getting more and more angry. It should be put to rest and never talked about again, it's doing nobody an ounce of good.

And I'm saying this respectfully as well.
 
#33
#33
At the risk of setting off a firestorm, I have to point out one simple fact. I'm not defending slavery, because it is evil, but the fact is that every descendant of a slave from Africa who was brought to the US should thank their lucky stars that their ancestor was a slave in the good ol' USofA. Where would Oprah Winfrey be if her ancestors had not been sold as slaves to some American? She'd probably be living in squalor somewhere in sub-Saharan Africa trying to fend off the Aids virus. Comparatively speaking, America has been damn good to the descendants of the slaves. It took some rough years, yes, but I would bet there aren't many descendants of slaves who would prefer that their ancestors remained in third-world Africa.
 
#34
#34
GAVol said:
We'll have to agree to disagree. I'm diametrically opposed to Obama on just about every single issue and think he would be a disaster as President, but despite his Pastor's rhetoric, I can't buy that he somehow hates white people.
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self hate isn't that unusual. looking at his rhetoric i think there is a very good chance he is a racist (maybe 1 in 3) or at the very least extremely delusional. do we really want to risk electing someone like that as president?

GAVol said:
Not sure where you are going with that. My point is that it's no wonder that African Americans aren't so quick to place their trust given their history of having politicians do nothing for them.
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true for the first 200 years in america. the last 30 i'd say the politicians have done plenty for african americans. arguably more than they have done for white people. i.e. affirmitive action, directing most large govt contracts to minority firms, etc.
 
#35
#35
jamesd1628 said:
the fact is that every descendant of a slave from Africa who was brought to the US should thank their lucky stars that their ancestor was a slave in the good ol' USofA. ...I would bet there aren't many descendants of slaves who would prefer that their ancestors remained in third-world Africa.
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Wow! "Yes'm massa, you so kind and genteel to be bringin po' negro folk to ya cotton filds."

So, had the slave trade as well as European colonialism not have absolutely raped Western Africa and subsaharan Africa, who is to say that they would not have developed a more decent civilization than what remains there today?

I guess the Native Americans are also indebted to us for our benevolence in providing them with reservations...???
 
#36
#36
droski said:
self hate isn't that unusual. looking at his rhetoric i think there is a very good chance he is a racist (maybe 1 in 3) or at the very least extremely delusional. do we really want to risk electing someone like that as president?



true for the first 200 years in america. the last 30 i'd say the politicians have done plenty for african americans. arguably more than they have done for white people. i.e. affirmitive action, directing most large govt contracts to minority firms, etc.
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The effects of the Federal Housing Administration (red-lining) will still be felt for the next two generations.
 
#37
#37
droski said:
self hate isn't that unusual. looking at his rhetoric i think there is a very good chance he is a racist (maybe 1 in 3) or at the very least extremely delusional. do we really want to risk electing someone like that as president?
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Are you really laying odds on whether or not someone is a racist? I would love for you to be my bookie.
 
#38
#38
therealUT said:
Wow! "Yes'm massa, you so kind and genteel to be bringin po' negro folk to ya cotton filds."

So, had the slave trade as well as European colonialism not have absolutely raped Western Africa and subsaharan Africa, who is to say that they would not have developed a more decent civilization than what remains there today?

I guess the Native Americans are also indebted to us for our benevolence in providing them with reservations...???
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Nailed it. It's a good thing too, because a lot of this thread looks like people trying to out-ignorant each other.
 
#39
#39
emainvol said:
Are you really laying odds on whether or not someone is a racist? I would love for you to be my bookie.
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Racist in the sense that he believes one race is superior to another? Probably not. Racist in the sense that he makes decisions based solely on the color of a person's skin...probably so.
 
#40
#40
Volnissniss said:
I got tired of fighting a fight I could never win. And I really like to win. :) Peace between whites and blacks in the south is just never going to happen, never. I don't agree with it but you have to admit even when there is a "friendship" if there is a racial issue that comes up there is that elephant in the room. So it's almost like the only way to get passed it is to stop reminding young AA that they were once beat and put down and were all these horrible things by the white man. It automatically creates this Black Vs White. Each generation keeps getting more and more angry. It should be put to rest and never talked about again, it's doing nobody an ounce of good.
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I have never had any kind of problem discussing race issues with my African American friends, and I also don't really know what you mean by "peace will never happen." I guess I missed the start of the race war.
 
#41
#41
emainvol said:
Nailed it. It's a good thing to, because a lot of this thread looks like people trying to out-ignorant each other.
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I am just waiting for someone to say, "The Jews should be grateful for the Holocaust and the Pogroms, if not for 2,000 years of routine slaughter, they would not have the state of Israel today..."
 
#42
#42
allvol123 said:
Racist in the sense that he believes one race is superior to another? Probably not. Racist in the sense that he makes decisions based solely on the color of a person's skin...probably so.
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I don't understand what you guys have to base that on.
 
#43
#43
therealUT said:
I am just waiting for someone to say, "The Jews should be grateful for the Holocaust and the Pogroms, if not for 2,000 years of routine slaughter, they would not have the state of Israel today..."
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I think we should lock this thread before we make the white man blush :)
 
#44
#44
therealUT said:
The effects of the Federal Housing Administration (red-lining) will still be felt for the next two generations.
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i don't really see the connection? the FHA allowed the flow of free money that directly led to the highest minority ownership of homes in american history.
 
#45
#45
allvol123 said:
Racist in the sense that he believes one race is superior to another? Probably not. Racist in the sense that he makes decisions based solely on the color of a person's skin...probably so.
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bingo. the man has an agenda and it's one that benefits a very small portion of this country. edit: just look at his supposed "race uniting" speach where he compared white people's anger over affirmative action to the anger of his racist preacher. or how about when he talked about how his grandmother was afraid of black people. classy guy.
 
#46
#46
droski said:
i don't really see the connection? the FHA allowed the flow of free money that directly led to the highest minority ownership of homes in american history.
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When the FHA was established (an FDR program, then bolstered by the Truman Admin with VA Loans), red lining was not only allowed it was encouraged. Combined with "urban renewal" this led to the situation today in which we have mostly white suburban areas and mostly African-American inner cities.

The effects of the change in renting to owning, for most white Americans, meant that they were acquiring equity while African-Americans were not. This also led to higher tax revenue basis in the suburbs, in turn to better public schooling, public works projects, etc.

The situation is exacerbated as wealth and net worth, along with better education, was passed down to follow generations of whites, while most African-Americans had to continually start over again, basically on their own.

The "problem" has largely been corrected, as it pertains to red-lining and lending. However, the effects of underfunded school systems and city districts will continue to plague many for a couple more generations.
 
#47
#47
therealUT said:
When the FHA was established (an FDR program, then bolstered by the Truman Admin with VA Loans), red lining was not only allowed it was encouraged. Combined with "urban renewal" this led to the situation today in which we have mostly white suburban areas and mostly African-American inner cities.

The effects of the change in renting to owning, for most white Americans, meant that they were acquiring equity while African-Americans were not. This also led to higher tax revenue basis in the suburbs, in turn to better public schooling, public works projects, etc.

The situation is exacerbated as wealth and net worth, along with better education, was passed down to follow generations of whites, while most African-Americans had to continually start over again, basically on their own.

The "problem" has largely been corrected, as it pertains to red-lining and lending. However, the effects of underfunded school systems and city districts will continue to plague many for a couple more generations.
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Wow, UT, I see your points but think you give the government too much credit in keeping people down. I can say first hand I had no wealth passed down to me. I grew up in rural SC and my public schools sucked. While it is no doubt they had a bigger hill to climb than most whites, it should not be used as an excuse.
 
#48
#48
allvol123 said:
Wow, UT, I see your points but think you give the government too much credit in keeping people down. I can say first hand I had no wealth passed down to me. I grew up in rural SC and my public schools sucked. While it is no doubt they had a bigger hill to climb than most whites, it should not be used as an excuse.
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I am not saying it is impossible to pull yourself up by the bootstraps, at all. I am simply saying that for the majority of people, the drive is not there to pull themselves out of such a situation.
 
#49
#49
emainvol said:
I don't understand what you guys have to base that on.
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He believes in leveling the playing fields via government intervention. My belief is that he thinks minorities are still not on level playing field in this country and will thus make decisons based on this belief.
 
#50
#50
therealUT said:
I am not saying it is impossible to pull yourself up by the bootstraps, at all. I am simply saying that for the majority of people, the drive is not there to pull themselves out of such a situation.
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Strong point made there. It is harded when they have been pacified for so long too. It compounds the problem and developes an "entitlement" attitude. What has happened, to a degree, is that this country has made these groups "enablers", willing to take without helping themselves. It amazes me still to see personal luxary items abound, but overdue rent notices and forclosure signs in front of a house.

And by the way, that is not a BLACK thing. It's a not a WHITE TRASH thing either. It just is what it is and poverty stretches far across racial lines of segregation. Poverty does not discriminate.
 
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