How long?

#51
#51
I started this just to give us something to discuss rather than we suck. I think more than ever it's settling in that we are on a long term plan. One thing that sticks out to me is that a mobile QB or superstar is the one wild card that can immediately inpact reults. Tebow, Cam and Johnny Football all exemplify what a mobile QB can immediately do for a program. I do think that's one reason why you see people clamoring to see one of the Freshman start.
 
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#52
#52
Best case scenario in my eyes:

1) He keeps current class in tact or improves it slightly
2) He has similar class next year
3) Minimal coaching turnover

2013 (This year) - 5-6 wins
2014 - 7-8 wins
2015 - 8-10 wins


If he can get these WRs dancing a bit and a quality QB in there, I see us being pretty decent next year. UGA and USC will drop off a bit after losing a lot of talent. Both upsettable games.
 
#54
#54
The only upside to the injuries and Couch situation this year is that guys that will be needed next year are getting reps. Toss Maggit into that as well.
 
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#55
#55
Boca Vol said:
I still find it hard to believe that this place has done a 180 from a week ago. Was it the way UT lost to Oregon? Was it the final score? Was your "UT" pride hurt that much?

Butch has been saying Brick By Brick. I said after the WKU game that the slogan was meant as much for the fans as the team. I got ridiculed for that but this is the exact point Butch was trying to make.

The "Rise to the Top" and "Brick by Brick" are slogans to remind us "the fans" that UT isn't on top any more and the program needs to be re-built.

99.999999999999% of the posters on here were all behind Butch & Co. less than a week ago. It doesn't need to unravel this quickly.

The same 99.999999999999% would also tell you how UT has the best traditions and fans in the country. Stop whining and get behind the team. The question wasn't whether UT could beat Oregon. The question is, "How does UT respond?"
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No, the question was "How competitive would UT look against Oregon" and we saw the answer was "not competitive at all" and people realized we looked as bad and unprepared in that game as we ever did during the Dooley era and suddenly meaningless platitudes about whether someone "gets it" or not aren't enough for most fans to bury their heads right back in the sand.
 
#56
#56
Boca Vol said:
I still find it hard to believe that this place has done a 180 from a week ago. Was it the way UT lost to Oregon? Was it the final score? Was your "UT" pride hurt that much?

Butch has been saying Brick By Brick. I said after the WKU game that the slogan was meant as much for the fans as the team. I got ridiculed for that but this is the exact point Butch was trying to make.

The "Rise to the Top" and "Brick by Brick" are slogans to remind us "the fans" that UT isn't on top any more and the program needs to be re-built.

99.999999999999% of the posters on here were all behind Butch & Co. less than a week ago. It doesn't need to unravel this quickly.

The same 99.999999999999% would also tell you how UT has the best traditions and fans in the country. Stop whining and get behind the team. The question wasn't whether UT could beat Oregon. The question is, "How does UT respond?"
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I think it was how we got beat. It was a glorified scrimmage for them. I think their second team would have fared better against them than we did. So much fundamental breakdowns that should not be that difficult to correct that have been occurring really since Dooley arrived. I think many fans, including myself, realized that the talent gap between the two teams was ridiculously wide but thought that the team would be better coached from a fundamental stand point.
 
#57
#57
DD4ME said:
If this year is really a "throw away" and assuming "Butch gets it" then reasonably how long before we are a 10 win relevant team? Depth is a primary concern, this year and next. Some have said losing the lines will be too difficult to overcome next year as well.

Does that mean 3, 4, 5 or more years to 10 wins?
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IMHO it will be at least 4-5 years. Sure would like to be wrong on this one.:whatever:
GO VOLS!
 
#58
#58
i would say butch's 4th year. we should be competing for a championship. that is when this incoming class will be in their junior years and the one after will be sophomores with most likely a lot of experience from freshman year. my prediction would be something like
2013: 7-6
2014: 5-7
2015: 8-5
2016: 14-0 (lol) but really i think like in the 11-2 range
 
#59
#59
It depends on several factors, #1 is recruiting #2 is developement of skills #3 is team depth and #4 is hard to quantify but is how many of the recruits turn out to be top SEC players. Tennessee has fallen to the bottom of most catagories in the SEC. I will venture to say it will take the Vols between 3-5 years to be a top notch team, provided everything falls into place. We will have to have a low percentage of attrition of major injuries and players leaving early as well.
 
#60
#60
zreeves said:
i would say butch's 4th year. we should be competing for a championship. that is when this incoming class will be in their junior years and the one after will be sophomores with most likely a lot of experience from freshman year. my prediction would be something like
2013: 7-6
2014: 5-7
2015: 8-5
2016: 14-0 (lol) but really i think like in the 11-2 range
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Why would you expect the 2015 signing class to be any good after 2 years of losing (well, actually 5 straight years of losing, but 2 with the current coach)?
 
#61
#61
oregonvol said:
Why would you expect the 2015 signing class to be any good after 2 years of losing (well, actually 5 straight years of losing, but 2 with the current coach)?
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optimism that i will have something to look forward to
 
#62
#62
I'm absolutely astounded that so many on here think that Tennessee's days of winning double digit games are over in "today's football". What a pack of freaking losers. Why?? Because we lost to Oregon?? Holy Moses, and to think I'm the one that gets called a negavol. Petrino had back to back double digit win seasons in the toughest division in football while recruiting from the worst state in the league for D1 talent. The right leadership is EVERYTHING. It is absolutely possible for UT to return to elite status in our league and with the right leadership its not just possible, its guaranteed. I seriously don't know how some of you are making it through life with that kind of "throw in the towel" attitude. I already knew we had the dumbest fanbase in America, just didn't know we also have the weakest.
 
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#63
#63
fade route said:
I'm absolutely astounded that so many on here think that Tennessee's days of winning double digit games are over in "today's football". What a pack of freaking losers. Why?? Because we lost to Oregon?? Holy Moses, and to think I'm the one that gets called a negavol. Petrino had back to back double digit win seasons in the toughest division in football while recruiting from the worst state in the league for D1 talent. The right leadership is EVERYTHING. It is absolutely possible for UT to return to elite status in our league and with the right leadership its not just possible, its guaranteed. I seriously don't know how some of you are making it through life with that kind of "throw in the towel" attitude. I already knew we had the dumbest fanbase in America, just didn't know we also have the weakest.
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I'm with you man. Saturday after the game, Tim Priest said it is going to take, and I quote, "seasons" to get things back on track. Note that is plural, with an "s". Seasons, not "lets get through this year and then everything will be lovely." I'm not crazy about it either, but things will be okay. And, hell fire, what do some of these jack legs want to do? Get another coach? Good gosh a mighty, folks. Kick back a little bit, maybe get a good buzz going Saturday afternoon, and enjoy life. Peace, Wood
 
#64
#64
I've been asking this same question for the last 8 years and still don't have an answer? How Long? As long as it takes, that's how long!
 
#65
#65
There is the possibility however small that we simply don't get back into the top 10 or top 20 polls this decade. The last decade seemed to fly by and the future just isn't what it used to be.
 
#66
#66
fade route said:
I'm absolutely astounded that so many on here think that Tennessee's days of winning double digit games are over in "today's football". What a pack of freaking losers. Why?? Because we lost to Oregon?? Holy Moses, and to think I'm the one that gets called a negavol. Petrino had back to back double digit win seasons in the toughest division in football while recruiting from the worst state in the league for D1 talent. The right leadership is EVERYTHING. It is absolutely possible for UT to return to elite status in our league and with the right leadership its not just possible, its guaranteed. I seriously don't know how some of you are making it through life with that kind of "throw in the towel" attitude. I already knew we had the dumbest fanbase in America, just didn't know we also have the weakest.
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We don't have the dumbest fan base in America. If you had ever been to Alabama you would know better.

But I have to agree. The UT fanbase (at least as represented on this board and on local talk radio) is the most simpering, weak-willed, excuse-making, head-in-the-sand, poor mouthed, pathetic fanbases I have ever seen for a major college program. I've lived all over and I've never seen another, equal-sized fanbase not only expect to lose, but go to such great lengths to excuse the losses and pretend that they are perfectly acceptable things that every fan should be happy about.

I mean, Hugh Freeze took over a horrible program, but I don't think most of their fan base was saying, "Hey, let's all expect it to take him 4 years before he shows any progress." But that's become the company line at UT and, judging by the response here, everyone just keeps swallowing it.
 
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#67
#67
IMO you only need a couple of elite players to make the breakthrough. We could use one or two of them in the next year or two.
 
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#68
#68
oregonvol said:
We don't have the dumbest fan base in America. If you had ever been to Alabama you would know better.

But I have to agree. The UT fanbase (at least as represented on this board and on local talk radio) is the most simpering, weak-willed, excuse-making, head-in-the-sand, poor mouthed, pathetic fanbases I have ever seen for a major college program. I've lived all over and I've never seen another, equal-sized fanbase not only expect to lose, but go to such great lengths to excuse the losses and pretend that they are perfectly acceptable things that every fan should be happy about.

I mean, Hugh Freeze took over a horrible program, but I don't think most of their fan base was saying, "Hey, let's all expect it to take him 4 years before he shows any progress." But that's become the company line at UT and, judging by the response here, everyone just keeps swallowing it.
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I disagree we have one of the more delusional though. Bad choices set you back and we've made a number of them.
 
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#69
#69
DD4ME said:
Sounds like the people who've posted think either "never ever" or 3-4 years minimum. I question if Butch really is the guy if it really takes 4+ years. Most great coaches don't take that long.
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I don't know if Butch is a "GREAT" coach or not. Most coaching hires are not great coaches. Just assess the hires made across college football each year. more fail than succeed.

I really like what he has done but will he become a great coach or improve the program some for the next guy? that question is still to be determined. We will know answer in about 5 or 6 years
 
#70
#70
LWSVOL said:
I don't know if Butch is a "GREAT" coach or not. Most coaching hires are not great coaches. Just assess the hires made across college football each year. more fail than succeed.

I really like what he has done but will he become a great coach or improve the program some for the next guy? that question is still to be determined. We will know answer in about 5 or 6 years
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I look across the landscape and usually if a coach is going to make a difference it's noticeable by year 3. That's my benchmark anyhow. All things have to be viewed as a whole but if the roster isn't better and the win column isn't better by that time I question it ever occuring.
 
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#71
#71
I may be blasted but right now I'd be content with UGA and USCe style results in year 4-5. That is make it to the SECCG every 1-3 years. Which is hilarious because that's what we left nearly a decade ago now. We've been wandering in the desert kicking sand.
 
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#72
#72
When it goes bad, it really goes bad, doesn't it. We have one freakin' issue after another. Talent issues, coaching issues, injury issues, bad luck. When we have a good offense, we have one of the worst defenses in UT history. On a team with a severe shortage of playmakers, we lose the only two offensive guys with quickness before the third game. One thing we truly need is a frickin' dynamic QB. It's hard to be good on offense with mediocre QBs. Even Bray, for all his talent winging the ball, was deficient--no running ability, no leadership. We're so damn out of balance. This year we have experience linemen and inexperienced skill talent. Next year it will be the opposite. Hard to see how our OL will be even halfway good next year--and could be bad. Jones and his staff will have to recruit and recruit well--there's nothing else.
 
#73
#73
armchair said:
When it goes bad, it really goes bad, doesn't it. We have one freakin' issue after another. Talent issues, coaching issues, injury issues, bad luck. When we have a good offense, we have one of the worst defenses in UT history. On a team with a severe shortage of playmakers, we lose the only two offensive guys with quickness before the third game. One thing we truly need is a frickin' dynamic QB. It's hard to be good on offense with mediocre QBs. Even Bray, for all his talent winging the ball, was deficient--no running ability, no leadership. We're so damn out of balance. This year we have experience linemen and inexperienced skill talent. Next year it will be the opposite. Hard to see how our OL will be even halfway good next year--and could be bad. Jones and his staff will have to recruit and recruit well--there's nothing else.
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I completely agree. Some of that is attributable to lack of stability, some just dumb luck like JH's ACL, some is just poor or short sided choices.
 
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#74
#74
fade route said:
I think it depends on the situation the coach walks into. If you just need better players, a couple of good recruiting classes can fix that pretty quickly and you can win sooner rather than later. However, if you have to go in and change the culture, that takes longer. In Butch's case, I think its the latter. There's a whole roster full of guys who expect to lose and that has to change. Just hope everyone can be patient enough.
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oregonvol said:
We don't have the dumbest fan base in America. If you had ever been to Alabama you would know better.

But I have to agree. The UT fanbase (at least as represented on this board and on local talk radio) is the most simpering, weak-willed, excuse-making, head-in-the-sand, poor mouthed, pathetic fanbases I have ever seen for a major college program. I've lived all over and I've never seen another, equal-sized fanbase not only expect to lose, but go to such great lengths to excuse the losses and pretend that they are perfectly acceptable things that every fan should be happy about.

I mean, Hugh Freeze took over a horrible program, but I don't think most of their fan base was saying, "Hey, let's all expect it to take him 4 years before he shows any progress." But that's become the company line at UT and, judging by the response here, everyone just keeps swallowing it.
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Not only that, but LSU was very mediocre in the 90s, and Bama had their DuBose, Coach Fran/Price, and Shula days too. You think those fanbases sat around, sighed, and said this is the best we'll ever do? No, they went out and got the right leader for their programs and look where they are today.
 
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