Hurd can help immediately...

#51
#51
Maybe one of our resident coaches who runs this system can chime in,

Welp, I'll give it a go Freak.

I'll try to stay away from the misperceptions involved with the generic and undefined terms like "Spread", Inside Zone Read, Outside Zone Read, No Huddle, etc..

The history of how those terms have evolved over time would be a very large book.

What you think you see and what actually happens can be quite different.

Neal, lined up 3-5 yards behind and to one side of the QB suggests an inside zone read play. Much has to happen to make it so, however.

First, any "READ" play suggests that a defender will be UNBLOCKED, this unblocked defender would be READ to determine who gets the ball.

Second the term "ZONE", refers to the blocking scheme of the offensive line, TE/HB/Sniffer and for most inside zone plays, it would be hard to tell the difference between what the offensive line looks like on, say, an ISO or a power. Teams use this to their advantage all the time. So does Tennessee.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9iStinVYkw[/youtube]

Go to the 3 minute mark in the above video.

Based on the RB's alignment, it looks like a run play to the left, probably inside. The AU safety agrees, especially once our TE goes from being split out to "in the box," and the SS (#9) comes down into the box, pre snap.

Once the ball is snapped, let's look for the unblocked defender, usually (not always) the EMLOS(end man on line of scrimmage). As you can see, everyone is blocked so this is not a READ play, though the alignment and the exchange/mesh certainly look like it.

Further, our TE. He goes across the formation and the AU LB (#43?) reads him as a key and goes with him, probably looking for a counter, he runs himself out of the play but nearly gets back to make the tackle.

The safety for Auburn did everything right except make the tackle. Great run by Neal on what was essentially a dive play that he bounces outside....made to look like something else.

It looked like a read, maybe it should have been a read, I think Dobbs walks in...but it was a straight give.



In terms of the discussion Freak and oregonvol are having...

I don't see us being slow on our "reads", maybe a better term would be slower on the exchange.

When I look at the mesh of Oregon for instance, it does seem very "smooth" compared to ours. We seem to have a point in the exchange that looks like both guys are grabbing, pulling, at times... I dunno...There's quite a bit of footwork involved in making it seem effortless, while also being deceptive...maybe we just don't have it down, maybe we coach it a certain way for a reason, but I can see why oregonvol feels the way he does.

However, imo, most of the time, we're not taking longer than anyone else to make the decision, because I'd guess at least 80% of the time, probably more like 90% of the time, we know where we are going presnap.

The very next play at 3:45 on the video is a Marlin Lane run and it seems like a read play as AU DE #55 is unblocked, stays home, in other words, he's got Dobbs, Dobbs gives. The mesh is quick and if they had the read "on", then Dobbs made it quickly and correctly and it seems on par with what AU did all day, in terms of quickness.
 
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#52
#52
I think Hurd is going to be a great RB for us but I do feel he would thrive more in a power run offense. I miss seeing the I formation.
 
#54
#54
If we land Derrell Scott though, him and Hurd would be a great change of pace combo at RB. Scott could really thrive in this spread offense IMO.
 
#55
#55
I always thought zone reads were somewhat slow developing by nature. Maybe if I get bored I'll pull some film and put a timer to it.

Yeah, honestly, I want to do this too. I just haven't had time to do it. I know I can't time every play of each team for the whole season, but I would like to look at one of our games and what Auburn was doing in their last couple of games and maybe a Texas A&M game too. I know to my eyes, Auburn was taking very little time to start running forward, but I'd like to put a number with it. One day soon.
 
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#56
#56
Other than being a little lighter, Hurds size is similar to Derrick Henry at Bama. Henry really looked good in the lost to Oklahoma in the Sugar Bowl. He's gonna be a beast next year. If Hurd turns out like that, I'll be happy.
 
#57
#57
I think Hurd is going to be a great RB for us but I do feel he would thrive more in a power run offense. I miss seeing the I formation.

I've always been an "I" guy too, I liked it as a tailback and for the first few years as a coach.

I was forced to move to the hurry up, no huddle spread and I was nervous about it. I had the horses to run the I this year, but those kids are going to be in a read option offense next year, so I learned it.

I still don't like being in the shotgun on the goal line but other than that, those RB's were running in space and probably more productive, with less wear and tear. Obviously, it's not as "down hill" as coming out of the I, but a simple and effective compromise is running the pistol, with the RB lined up 4-7 yds. directly behind the QB.
 
#58
#58
The level of butthurt in virtually every post of yours is astonishing.

He has the objective unbiased stance of a-schoolmate-of-Butch's-who-got-an-atomic-wedgie-from-Butch-and-lost-his-fantasy-girl-to-Butch.
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Actually, he was just pointing out what anyone watching saw last year.

Our offense looked like it was being executed in molasses in January, even when Worley was running it at its most efficient.

Everyone should absolutely expect a substantial increase in the speed of execution from the offense despite a new O-line and / or QB shuffling.

To the OP - I'm nervous about Hurd's injury. This Orange and White Game already has some great storylines building: will Hurd play, starting two QBs, EE performance, new O-line, etc.
 
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#59
#59
I didn't read the entire thread before responding. I'm enjoying the Freak / Oregon discussion here.

From my perspective, and I said this throughout the season, our offensive execution was slooooooow. It felt like I could read a chapter of War and Peace while a play developed. I was willing to chalk it up to football gods of "the new system".

I can honestly say, even if Butch, Hurd, Malone, et al, are hugely successful, if it really develops that slowly, I'm never really going to like our offense. But I truly expect it to be much faster and crisper in 2014 no matter what.
 
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#61
#61
Sorry, I've just been reading all these posts about not to expect too much next year, and I know that Hurd is the kinda back that could take it to the house every play. It's been awhile since I've seen one of our backs break 50plus td run. I think he can do it quite often next year if his shoulder can hold up to sec contact.
Post more often, your avatar is TITILLATING!!!
 
#62
#62
The biggest worry with him will be injuries. He really runs upright and that relates to more injuries especially with the hard hitters in college football. I think he will be an immediate star if he can stay on the field. I am really excited about our offense. Although young our skill level players are as good as anyone in the league. They may have some growing pains but I think were gonna score a lot of points.

Yeah that upright running style sure limited Eric Dickerson in college and the pro's. No telling how many 2,000 yard seasons he could have had if he had run lower,lmfao!!! Show me some data that even remotely suggests what you claim. Besides he hurt himself knocking the s--- out of a guy while playing safety not running upright!!!
 
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#64
#64
He has the objective unbiased stance of a-schoolmate-of-Butch's-who-got-an-atomic-wedgie-from-Butch-and-lost-his-fantasy-girl-to-Butch.
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If he lost all that to butch in high school he deserved it. Picture of butch in band uni goes here
 
#65
#65
I just wish this fan base would just stop setting itself up for disappointment, and just let things happen. This kid on paper has potential to be a really great player, so we should just be happy he's going to be in Orange and White (hope not grey). Let him develop if he needs to, and if turns out to be the freak talent that gets tons of yards by just touching the ball great...an added bonus.

The kid didn't play his Sr year, and has had shoulder surgery. Don't care if he's in top shape still gonna have to get the rust knocked off of him. Sitting here, and trying to put pressure on him to be our savior in the run game is just to premature and ridiculous. And why players end up getting bashed if they aren't. Not because they don't try or want to do well, but b/c this fanbase is loco. Sets expectations up to high, and if not met it's not the fans fault but the teenage kids fault. Smh

It just baffles me that people hang there hat on a kid that is jumping from playing his Jr in HS in the TN HS system to The SEC, and are expecting him to be our savior. Just like the people that were so up on Peterman, and he gets thrown out to the wolves by CBJ obviously horribly coached and developed by this coaching staff, and now people bash him as if he's the worse ever.

The Legion of the Miserable would screw up a wet dream.
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#66
#66
Wow, ya reckon? No, Bo or Hershel come around every 10-20 years. I'll believe this stuff when I see it.

So you think the only great backs in college were Bo and Hershel since the 80s? I'm not gonna put Hurd in their category just yet but he will be special from what I've seen. I just meant he could easily make an impact such as sanders, Tomlinson, Ricky Williams, Peterson, Jamal Lewis, etc. those backs come around about every decade or so.
 
#67
#67
So you think the only great backs in college were Bo and Hershel since the 80s? I'm not gonna put Hurd in their category just yet but he will be special from what I've seen. I just meant he could easily make an impact such as sanders, Tomlinson, Ricky Williams, Peterson, Jamal Lewis, etc. those backs come around about every decade or so.

Many players could easily turn out to be a lot of things. Most of the type of players u mentioned did what they did playing vs really good talent in HS too. Didnt skip their Sr year due to injury either. Putting him up with those even, even even just hoping, is just so premature, and setting him up for a harder longer fall if he just doesn't turn out that way from day 1. That's a recipe for a kid being washed out early due to his confidence being beat down.
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#69
#69
Many players could easily turn out to be a lot of things. Most of the type of players u mentioned did what they did playing vs really good talent in HS too. Didnt skip their Sr year due to injury either. Putting him up with those even, even even just hoping, is just so premature, and setting him up for a harder longer fall if he just doesn't turn out that way from day 1. That's a recipe for a kid being washed out early due to his confidence being beat down.
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I think you are selling tennessee hs football very short. 20 years ago maybe you'd be right but the last several years tennessee hs has been competitive with most schools in the surrounding states. Hurd was a man among boys his jr year. He obliterated offensive numbers. He was like a video game. I don't recall his final numbers that undefeated season but they beat some great hs teams that competed well against other teams in Mississippi and Georgia teams.
 
#70
#70
I think you are selling tennessee hs football very short. 20 years ago maybe you'd be right but the last several years tennessee hs has been competitive with most schools in the surrounding states. Hurd was a man among boys his jr year. He obliterated offensive numbers. He was like a video game. I don't recall his final numbers that undefeated season but they beat some great hs teams that competed well against other teams in Mississippi and Georgia teams.

He ran for 3,300+ yds and 43 tds despite sitting about several quarters/2nd halves of games. Ran for 350+ yds and 7 tds in state championship game.
 
#71
#71
Hurd has the potential to be a special back in any system. However, the shoulder injury is cause for concern. Once a player, especially a back or LB starts having shoulder problems, they tend to be chronic.
 
#72
#72
I just wish this fan base would just stop setting itself up for disappointment, and just let things happen. This kid on paper has potential to be a really great player, so we should just be happy he's going to be in Orange and White (hope not grey). Let him develop if he needs to, and if turns out to be the freak talent that gets tons of yards by just touching the ball great...an added bonus.

The kid didn't play his Sr year, and has had shoulder surgery. Don't care if he's in top shape still gonna have to get the rust knocked off of him. Sitting here, and trying to put pressure on him to be our savior in the run game is just to premature and ridiculous. And why players end up getting bashed if they aren't. Not because they don't try or want to do well, but b/c this fanbase is loco. Sets expectations up to high, and if not met it's not the fans fault but the teenage kids fault. Smh

It just baffles me that people hang there hat on a kid that is jumping from playing his Jr in HS in the TN HS system to The SEC, and are expecting him to be our savior. Just like the people that were so up on Peterman, and he gets thrown out to the wolves by CBJ obviously horribly coached and developed by this coaching staff, and now people bash him as if he's the worse ever.

The Legion of the Miserable would screw up a wet dream.
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This makes way too much sense. It's more fun to build him up, then take him down if he doesn't pan out.
 
#73
#73
I think you are selling tennessee hs football very short. 20 years ago maybe you'd be right but the last several years tennessee hs has been competitive with most schools in the surrounding states. Hurd was a man among boys his jr year. He obliterated offensive numbers. He was like a video game. I don't recall his final numbers that undefeated season but they beat some great hs teams that competed well against other teams in Mississippi and Georgia teams.

I understand it's gotten better and progressing, but it's nowhere near TX, GA, or FLA or many other states. Will it eventually...sure/maybe but not yet or maybe anytime soon. Heck I'd be confident to put TX 3A against TNs top level. Look at how Mizzou did with talent that was overlooked. IMO an SEC team could field a team full of TX talent with a nice mixture of ranked/non-ranked players and succeed with good coaching. Can't be so confident about that with a team full of TN players.

Ur comment alone stating that he was men amongst boys in a sense proves my point. He put up great #s against that level of competition, and now people are expecting him to come into the SEC after a year off and shoulder surgery and blow people away. Can it happen...yes. But let's be realistic and not put unnecessary expectations on him so earlier. That's all I'm saying.
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#75
#75
Man, that is the truth. I do not like this offense at all. It blows actually. There needs to be play action to fool LB and S, but not scanning defenses during a play. That needs to be done before the snap. Bottom line is, it takes to long for plays to develop in this offense. It's not pro ready. Nobody does that crap in the NFL.

Yes, they do....the Carolina Panthers, the Seattle Seahawks, San Francisco 49ers, Philadelphia Eagles, just to name a few...let's not say anything unless you know what you're talking about.
 

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