Ineligible Players from Sanctions

#26
#26
SayUWantAreVOLution said:
I don't think the NCAA does it that way at all. They tell the school who it was and the school vacates the wins. They told the Heisman Trust about Bush and the Heisman Trust has rules that a player must not be cheating and they took the award back.

The NCAA has never gotten involved in naming players names publicly probably to avoid being sued AND to avoid players really blowing the whistle on schools.

I'm not saying it's not a mess and the NCAA isn't useless. It is and they are...... but they don't name names so it's impossible to expect a school picking up a kid as a transfer to know if they're the kid who broke the rules.
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Well, clearly Mark Emmert did cite Reggie Bush's name to the Heisman Trust. That is clearly what Bush thinks too.
 
#27
#27
BowlBrother85 said:
Well, clearly Mark Emmert did cite Reggie Bush's name to the Heisman Trust ... you just said so yourself? That is clearly what Bush thinks too.
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Of course he did, PRIVATELY. The Trust may have revealed why but that's not the NCAA.

The point of all this is that schools cannot possibly know when a kid is transferring from a school that is or might later be under investigation if that kid is one of the ones who cheated.

That's the original premise of this thread: schools who picked up "dirty" kids should be forced to vacate wins too. How the hell could they know who was dirty and who was clean if the NCAA never names them?
 
#28
#28
SayUWantAreVOLution said:
Of course he did, PRIVATELY. The Trust may have revealed why but that's not the NCAA.

The point of all this is that schools cannot possibly know when a kid is transferring from a school that is or might later be under investigation if that kid is one of the ones who cheated.

That's the original premise of this thread: schools who picked up "dirty" kids should be forced to vacate wins too. How the hell could they know who was dirty and who was clean if the NCAA never names them?
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My only point was that Reggie Bush was clearly penalized for accepting impermissible benefits from USC boosters, and he obviously blames Mark Emmert directly for that. Now, it wasn't the NCAA who penalized Bush ... but the Heisman Trust could not have had the information to act without the NCAA.

So ... in an indirect way, the NCAA saw to it that Bush was stripped of his Heisman.
 
#29
#29
Unknown Vol said:
Does anybody know when/if the names of the 16 ineligible players who's wins we will vacate will be named? I'm wondering if we're just going to get a list of games or if the players will be named. I'll hang up and listen
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Not sure they’ll be named as some were likely minors when they accepted benefits. But it raises the question: why are these prospects (and, in some cases, their families) who received illegal or unallowable benefits evidently completely immune from any kind of accountability?

Some hot prospect being courted by a school puts himself up for sale to the highest bidder. He knows the game and plays the game and benefits from the game. It’s all documented and the NCAA knows the prospects who played the game and received benefits. And this kid not only walks away from any kind of responsibility or accountability and is still on scholarship or playing college football? I don’t get it. There is a buyer and a seller here in each illegal recruitment transaction. It takes both to cheat, it seems.

I know the new NIL era kinda makes this question moot now. But how about a new rule or two that says any prospect who receives any illegal benefits during his recruitment as a college athlete risks his entire college football career? Or a one- or two-year suspension from all team activities? Or a loss of his scholarship? Would that maybe make these kids think twice before playing the game and accepting illegal benefits during their recruitment?

Regarding our own players who evidently received illegal benefits and then high-tailed it once Pruitt’s scheme was exposed, would such harsh penalties have changed their individual calculus as the seller of their services?

Again, NIL probably makes this moot…just thinking out loud here, guys…
 
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#30
#30
BowlBrother85 said:
My only point was that Reggie Bush was clearly penalized for accepting impermissible benefits from USC boosters, and he obviously blames Mark Emmert directly for that. Now, it wasn't the NCAA who penalized Bush ... but the Heisman Trust could not have had the information to act without the NCAA.

So ... in an indirect way, the NCAA saw to it that Bush was stripped of his Heisman.
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I'm not denying Reggie Bush got screwed.

It's just not how the NCAA operates to name players who break the rules publicly. There's only one winner of the Heisman. If that guy cheated and the Trust decides to withdraw the award, yeah..... it's obvious.

Should Emmert have told the Heisman Trust? Well, since it was pretty obvious USC was being investigated for Bush and if the NCAA didn't let the Heisman Trust know they'd be screwing the Trust.

They screwed Reggie instead. Life's not fair.
 
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#31
#31
SayUWantAreVOLution said:
I'm not denying Reggie Bush got screwed.

It's just not how the NCAA operates to name players who break the rules publicly. There's only one winner of the Heisman. If that guy cheated and the Trust decides to withdraw the award, yeah..... it's obvious.

Should Emmert have told the Heisman Trust? Well, since it was pretty obvious USC was being investigated for Bush and if the NCAA didn't let the Heisman Trust know they'd be screwing the Trust.

They screwed Reggie instead. Life's not fair.
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Emmert was the worst.
 
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#32
#32
Could someone require UT to disclose names from the internal investigation through open records laws? After all they would be professionals based on the laws at that time. If the money was in fact filtered off department funds and not out of pocket money provided to Pruitt through other channels.
 
#36
#36
LWSVOL said:
Per the report, Tennessee has two weeks to notify the NCAA of the vacated games. NCAA knows the players, they just don't publicly identify them.

Hope that helps
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It did. On my way to the bathroom.
 
#37
#37
IMO vacating games is a useless penalty. If you went and watched that game, say UT win over Auburn. Everyone there knows who won and can’t un-see it. It’s so technical for about 1% of the general public. Rest of ppl cold care less after the fact.
 
#38
#38
sechamp2012 said:
IMO vacating games is a useless penalty. If you went and watched that game, say UT win over Auburn. Everyone there knows who won and can’t un-see it. It’s so technical for about 1% of the general public. Rest of ppl cold care less after the fact.
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Removes the win from record books…not reality.
 
#39
#39
VolInNW said:
Hmmmmmm. I'm sure it was just the overwhelming awesome awesomeness of all things uga.....but just MAYBE this is a loose thread the NCAA could pull a bit???

Kirby and Slingblade both learned at Bammer under lil Nickie. The difference is that Kirby wins. So any uga fans or apologists should tread lightly here.
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Slingblade... I'm still laughing at that one...
 
#40
#40
DenmarkVol said:
Not sure they’ll be named as some were likely minors when they accepted benefits. But it raises the question: why are these prospects (and, in some cases, their families) who received illegal or unallowable benefits evidently completely immune from any kind of accountability?

Some hot prospect being courted by a school puts himself up for sale to the highest bidder. He knows the game and plays the game and benefits from the game. It’s all documented and the NCAA knows the prospects who played the game and received benefits. And this kid not only walks away from any kind of responsibility or accountability and is still on scholarship or playing college football? I don’t get it. There is a buyer and a seller here in each illegal recruitment transaction. It takes both to cheat, it seems.

I know the new NIL era kinda makes this question moot now. But how about a new rule or two that says any prospect who receives any illegal benefits during his recruitment as a college athlete risks his entire college football career? Or a one- or two-year suspension from all team activities? Or a loss of his scholarship? Would that maybe make these kids think twice before playing the game and accepting illegal benefits during their recruitment?

Regarding our own players who evidently received illegal benefits and then high-tailed it once Pruitt’s scheme was exposed, would such harsh penalties have changed their individual calculus as the seller of their services?

Again, NIL probably makes this moot…just thinking out loud here, guys…
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In the past, NCAA temporarily suspended active NCAA athletes, and they had to repay $/graft before they were reinstated. By “repay”, the athlete was supposed to give the amount he received back to a charity/NCAA fund. NCAA probably canned this temp. sanction against the athlete by now, though.
 
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#41
#41
The NCAA releases a redacted report of their investigation to the media/general public. They “redact” (conceal/strike through) all the names of the players, coaches, boosters, etc. involved.

The NCAA report appeared to me to accidentally INCLUDE the name of at least one player/recruit: a former Vol DB who transferred out when Pruitt was fired. Kinda surprised I didn’t see his name publicized further.
 
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#42
#42
According to a story in the News Sentinel, the players stats will be wiped from the school's records along with the wins. So if anyone wants to do some detective work, you might be able figure some out this out by checking the changes in the stats.

"Ineligible players appeared in all those vacated victories, a UT spokesperson confirmed. In addition to the vacated wins, those players' statistics will also be removed from the books. "

Here are Tennessee football wins vacated under Jeremy Pruitt
 
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#45
#45
Looks like they were granted immunity for cooperating in the investigation.

Sources told ESPN that some of the players who were declared ineligible, including those who transferred to other schools, were later able to regain their eligibility by being granted immunity and cooperating with the NCAA in its investigation of Tennessee.

Tennessee must vacate all 11 wins from '19, '20
 
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#47
#47
BowlBrother85 said:
I think this is correct ... and do we really need their names? The guys who transferred to Oklahoma, plus the guy who went to Alabama.
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I mean......Yeah. We do need their names. They get off scott free and are likely the ones brokering for the better deals through their 'handlers'. The only way to clean this thing up is to name ALL of the names and then the chips fall where they may. Why are we protecting the ones that are offering their services for $$$? I get arresting the Johns to eliminate their desire for prostitutes, but every now and then the prostitutes have to be on the hook too. Especially if their parents are the pimps.
 
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#48
#48
VolsSince78 said:
In the past, NCAA temporarily suspended active NCAA athletes, and they had to repay $/graft before they were reinstated. By “repay”, the athlete was supposed to give the amount he received back to a charity/NCAA fund. NCAA probably canned this temp. sanction against the athlete by now, though.
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Really? Wow. Did not know that. Thanks.
 
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#49
#49
VolDaddy61 said:
Sins ?! Playing for Pruitt was punishment enough.
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I don't think so. They moved on to pimp their wares at other NCAA institutions. The players should be named. That is the only way to curb their actions. If they don't suffer any embarrassment, the ones that follow will continue with similar behavior. List parents/handlers asking price and NIL value. I mean, that's what we're talking about isn't it? They aren't playing ball for an education any more. They're playing for the highest bidder. Everything on the table.
 
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