Iowa...

#226
#226
KB5252 said:
If gay marriage is allowed in a particular state and a preacher refuses to marry a gay couple can the institution be sued in court? this is a question that I have not been able to get a clear answer to.
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A church and/or preacher can decline to marry whomever they choose.

There are several pastors that will not marry a couple if one or both has been divorced.
Some churches will not allow anyone that has been divorced to be married in their church.
 
#227
#227
DinkinFlicka said:
What if it's bothersome to non-believers?
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It typically is to some degree.

I have had different responses just on this board.
Some shut it out without discussion, some make fun of it, some take it and ask more questions.

It can be discussed in a civil manor, and should be in every case.
 
#228
#228
Vols378 said:
A church and/or preacher can decline to marry whomever they choose.

There are several pastors that will not marry a couple if one or both has been divorced.
Some churches will not allow anyone that has been divorced to be married in their church.
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most priests wont marry someone unless they agree that all children will be raised in the catholic church. this is pretty normal. no doubt in my mind tehy can turn down gays and not get sued.
 
#229
#229
droski said:
if you actually believe in adam and eve then why are you against incest? how do you think adam and eve's children populated the world?
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Are you sure Adam and Eve are the only humans God created ?

Is it not possible Adam and Eve were the first humans God created and he created many more after them ?
 
#230
#230
Vols378 said:
Are you sure Adam and Eve are the only humans God created ?

Is it not possible Adam and Eve were the first humans God created and he created many more after them ?
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the bible never mentions this. and actually they directly connect adam and eve to abraham right?
 
#231
#231
droski said:
most priests wont marry someone unless they agree that all children will be raised in the catholic church. this is pretty normal. no doubt in my mind tehy can turn down gays and not get sued.
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I have heard this before.

My grandaddy was catholic.
 
#232
#232
DinkinFlicka said:
You don't think a portion of religious folks would get all pissy if same sex marriage was legislated?

I gotta hear this.
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I am a "born again christian" and I do not approve of Gay marriage but I would think it will be legal in a few years.

It would be just be something we would all have to live with.

I am sure there are things now that we all have to live with that we don't approve of, both believiers and non believers.
 
#233
#233
droski said:
the bible never mentions this. and actually they directly connect adam and eve to abraham right?
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Yes , Abraham is connected to Adam and Eve.

The Bible does not say one way or the other if Adam and Eve were the only humans God created.
 
#234
#234
Vols378 said:
Yes , Abraham is connected to Adam and Eve.

The Bible does not say one way or the other if Adam and Eve were the only humans God created.
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then how do we know all the humans were handed down god's law if the bible doesn't say it?
 
#235
#235
droski said:
then how do we know all the humans were handed down god's law if the bible doesn't say it?
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The Bible does give examples where his law was given to the people.

If you read the OT, there are several instances where God communicated with people.
 
#236
#236
droski said:
then how do we know all the humans were handed down god's law if the bible doesn't say it?
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If you look at it this way

Adam=Man
Eve=Woman

Therefore if you read the text that way then

“And the Lord FORMED MAN of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being.” (Genesis 2:7)

Neither man or woman are meant in singular terms, but as a multitude. Adam and Eve were just the first of the two that he created.
 
#237
#237
Modern attitudes toward aberrant sexual behavior and the opinion that homoseluality is to be considered normal behavior sexual behavior can be layed at the feet of the pseudo-scientific Kinsey report.

About Alfred Kinsey and his other baby raping pedophiles who compiled the report:

"For his wholly unscientific sex experiments on at least 317 children, Kinsey’s pederast team used stopwatches to record their little victims,’ “convulsions” and “hysterical weeping (especially among the younger children)” and “striking” the [adult] “partner” who was violently sodomizing the child.

Kinsey testified these torturous cries of terror were “orgasms” that the babies enjoyed."

(He was one sick pos sob, was he not?)

More:

Orgasm was defined as follows:

"Extreme tension with violent convulsions: ...sudden heaving and jerking of the whole body... gasping... hands grasping, mouth distorted, sometimes with tongue protruding; whole body or parts of it spasmodically twitching...violent jerking of the penis...groaning, sobbing, or more violent cries, sometimes with an abundance of tears (especially among younger children).... hysterical laughing, talking, sadistic or masochistic reactions... extreme trembling, collapse, loss of color, and sometimes fainting of subject.... some...suffer excruciating pain and may scream ...if the penis is even touched....some...before the arrival of orgasm, will fight away from the partner and may make violent attempts to avoid climax although they derive definite pleasure from the situation."

(would be defined as rape in any court of law.)

Much of his data was retrieved from the diaries of convicted child molesters

Much of his data was retrieved from a Nazi's experiments on Jewish children during WWII

25-48% of his subjects were in prison and/or deviant males, of which 1400 were classified as sex offenders.

Married' women included prostitutes (as long as they lived with a pimp)

Much of his 'scientific' data came from pedophiles, not 'technically trained' experts as he claimed.

Gebhard revealed that of the 18,000 interviews,

5,300 white males accounted for the research base in the Male Volume; of that 5,300,

2,446 were designated as convicts,

1,003 homosexuals,

50 transvestites,

117 mentally ill,

342 “Other,”

650 sexually abused boys.

This yielded 4,628 n=Aberrant and
873 n=“Normal” Male subjects.
 
#238
#238
"May they bear in mind that it is neither gold nor even a multitude of arms that sustains a state but its morals."

Denis Diderot
 
#243
#243
DinkinFlicka said:
How is homosexuality immoral? Better yet, how is homosexuality immoral in secular terms?
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Nobody you are having a discussion with views the world in secular terms.

I've since grown up and become part of the "let God sort them out crowd" on just about every issue, not just gay marriage, but I was raised with a parent who was against it because it was immoral. Therefore it was another sign of the ruin of society, which was another step down the road to the "end times".

I realized that I disagreed with that take on things but I also knew that that was the prism through which he viewed things and accepted it.
 
#245
#245
MG1968 said:
it's immoral in religious terms, it's unnatural in scientific terms
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This doesn't answer my question at all. I guess the better way to phrase it would be to ask why anyone opposed to same sex marriage feels that way outside of their religious belief.
 
#246
#246
DinkinFlicka said:
This doesn't answer my question at all. I guess the better way to phrase it would be to ask why anyone opposed to same sex marriage feels that way outside of their religious belief.
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Are you really asking people to separate the two?
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#248
#248
DinkinFlicka said:
Just trying to see if certain people require the Bible to rationalize a certain belief or not. I think it's valid.
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It probably is, but asking people to separate their values from their religion doesn't work for me. That religion is part and parcel to their value set one begot the other.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
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