Iran

[VolinMichigan]

We will definitely respond. We have to.

I think we should focus on helping those here in America that need our help. What about all the struggling people here in our own country. Why should we care what happens to another country?

(If this argument is going to be used to prevent giving military aid to Ukraine, I don’t see why it doesn’t apply to Israel as well)

 

[PKT_VOL]

Bit you're ok with Iran funding terrorist groups that attack Isreal? Are you ok with Iran playing stupid games and winning stupid prizes? Like having their diplomatic building bombed?

I would have had zero problems if the Israel blew up the IRGC generals once they left the diplomatic compound.

We have diplomatic immunity for a reason and ought to keep it sacrosanct within international affairs.

 

[kiddiedoc]

I think Iran embarrassing themselves the way they did is retaliation enough.

But does Israel agree?

 

[PKT_VOL]

My mistake. I thought you might be referring to what could happen should Israel retaliate.

That's what the world fears at the moment.

The West + Middle East allies put their necks out to defend Israel hoping that it allowed Iran to save face while not escalating the conflict into a regional war.

If Israel retaliates in any significant way, it will further isolate them internationally and erode whatever goodwill is left on behalf of the West + Middle East allies.

 

[volbound1700]

That's what the world fears at the moment.

The West + Middle East allies put their necks out to defend Israel hoping that it allowed Iran to save face while not escalating the conflict into a regional war.

If Israel retaliates in any significant way, it will further isolate them internationally and erode whatever goodwill is left on behalf of the West + Middle East allies.

It depends on what the Saudis are up to as well. I get the vibe the Saudis are making noise in all of this as well.

 

[Orangeslice13]

No, we did not. We didn't intentionally bomb Iran's diplomatic building.

If Israel wants to play stupid games, they can win whatever stupid prizes come their way.

Like I said, let’s absolutely turn them lose.
Don’t cry and bitch about what happens next.

 

[LouderVol]

I just miss the days where these strikes were not announced on social media days or weeks in advance to where you could plan your day around the impending 24/7 news coverage.

If June 6th 1944 were to happen today we’d be parsing the actual battle plan leaked 6 months in advance on social media and there would be 1000 reporters waiting on them on the beach with about half of those being German propagandists

the unfortunate thing is the same mechanism that we used to confuse the Germans about where the attack was going, or which was the real attack has been turned against the public.

people knew a DDay was coming. they didn't know where or the exact date, but everyone knew we were going to land significant numbers of troops in northern france.

part of the lack of knowledge back then was simply the medium of information exchange. its a lot easier to keep things secret back then. and back then there was no way for one person to spread the word to the world like there is today.

 

[Orangeslice13]

That the best operational assumption thus far and the justification for the West + Middle East allies to defend Israel.

Let Iran save face and deescalate the situations verse letting it escalate to a regional war.

The problem is, Israel's vowing to retaliate in a significate way. If this happens, the West + Middle East allies will regret getting involved.

Pick a side.
Either you want the US in on having an opinion or you don’t.

I’ve been clear from the beginning. We never should have been involved from the beginning. But we made this mess so it’s ours to live with

 

[PKT_VOL]

It depends on what the Saudis are up to as well. I get the vibe the Saudis are making noise in all of this as well.

To the extent that they value regional peace and stability, yes. I don't think the Saudis want an all-out regional war.

 

[hog88]

But does Israel agree?

I doubt that they do.

 

[hog88]

That's what the world fears at the moment.

The West + Middle East allies put their necks out to defend Israel hoping that it allowed Iran to save face while not escalating the conflict into a regional war.

If Israel retaliates in any significant way, it will further isolate them internationally and erode whatever goodwill is left on behalf of the West + Middle East allies.

I think you are overestimating how much western good-will would erode.

 

[volbound1700]

To the extent that they value regional peace and stability, yes. I don't think the Saudis want an all-out regional war.

Saudi Arabia and Iran are in a proxy war right now with Yemen. Basically Yemen is Saudi Arabia's Gaza with Iran. Iran isn't that well liked in the Middle East either. I think that is why you saw Jordan helping Israel (something that would never have happened in the past).

 

[PKT_VOL]

Like I said, let’s absolutely turn them lose.
Don’t cry and bitch about what happens next.

I'm fine with that.

I would have been even more fine with that if we didn't defend them against Iran's counterattack. We got involved when we shouldn't have trying to deescalate the situation. If Israel turns around and reescalates the situation, it would be a slap in the face.

 

[NorthDallas40]

the unfortunate thing is the same mechanism that we used to confuse the Germans about where the attack was going, or which was the real attack has been turned against the public.

people knew a DDay was coming. they didn't know where or the exact date, but everyone knew we were going to land significant numbers of troops in northern france.

part of the lack of knowledge back then was simply the medium of information exchange. its a lot easier to keep things secret back then. and back then there was no way for one person to spread the word to the world like there is today.

Even then we were more wiley than now. Not only did we keep the actual battle plan secret we stood up Patton’s fake army to throw the Germans off. And they bought it hook, line, and sinker. Additionally you had the OSS planted corpse with the fake identity and a completely different battle plan. We, everyone honestly, just didn’t seem to have that trade craft anymore.

 

[PKT_VOL]

Pick a side.
Either you want the US in on having an opinion or you don’t.

I’ve been clear from the beginning. We never should have been involved from the beginning. But we made this mess so it’s ours to live with

Look, we agree on the fact that we should have never been involved.

However, since we did get involved defending them from the consequences their nonsense and still give them lots of aid, we ought to have a very, very weighty opinion on them not escalating the situation.

 

[hog88]

Look, we agree on the fact that we should have never been involved.

However, since we did get involved defending them from the consequences their nonsense and still give them lots of aid, we ought to have a very, very weighty opinion on them not escalating the situation.

I agree with you on this. If we fund/aid you, you need to do WTF we tell you to do.

 

[PKT_VOL]

I think you are overestimating how much western good-will would erode.

Just look at the collapse in polling, particularly among young people in the West. Israel has never been on thinner ice with the West and its getting thinner every day.

Anti-Zionism has increased. Pro-Palestinian views have increased. Verbal support for Israel among pro-Israel Westerners and Western politicians is more careful and measured than ever.

 

[PKT_VOL]

Saudi Arabia and Iran are in a proxy war right now with Yemen. Basically Yemen is Saudi Arabia's Gaza with Iran. Iran isn't that well liked in the Middle East either. I think that is why you saw Jordan helping Israel (something that would never have happened in the past).

Sure, those proxy wars and low-key operations is where the Middle East leaders want the temperature to stay at.

Tribal monarchies and religious autocracies have been locked in a cold war for a long time. Israel has been a useful ally to the tribal monarchies (and vise versa) but they would very much prefer the cold war to stay cold.

 

[Orangeslice13]

I'm fine with that.

I would have been even more fine with that if we didn't defend them against Iran's counterattack. We got involved when we shouldn't have trying to deescalate the situation. If Israel turns around and reescalates the situation, it would be a slap in the face.

I don’t think you understand how my people are thinking right now and it’s not good.
Trust me, you are not fine with what Israel is currently capable of.

 

[Orangeslice13]

Look, we agree on the fact that we should have never been involved.

However, since we did get involved defending them from the consequences their nonsense and still give them lots of aid, we ought to have a very, very weighty opinion on them not escalating the situation.

This stupidity has our name all over it. And it far exceeds Israel’s retaliatory shot on an embassy. We put this thing in motion and now it’s our problem to live with.

We shouldn’t be giving anyone aid. We sure as **** should not have given money to Iran.

Screwing up the world is kinda our thing. It’s a little disingenuous to pick a spot in the late stages and say “this is where we bow out of the **** storm we created “

 

[norrislakevol]

I don’t think you understand how my people are thinking right now and it’s not good.
Trust me, you are not fine with what Israel is currently capable of.

Agree. Israel is perfectly capable of destroying Iran's navy and air force very quickly. Then, destroying their nuclear facilities, missile facilities, and drone facilities. This won't take long. The other thing is though is what does Hezbollah to the north do? I would say that Iran would turn them loose then, and that would be the end of Hezbollah eventually.

 

[Orangeburst]

What if Israel just said **** you and nuked em? Anyone think if roles were reversed that Iran would not do the same?

toungue in cheek..kinda

 

[Orangeslice13]

What if Israel just said **** you and nuked em? Anyone think if roles were reversed that Iran would not do the same?

toungue in cheek..kinda

People have not been paying attention.
The group leading Israel right now have had enough of the attacks from tribal terrorist groups. They are making bold moves in plain sight and nobody is noticing what it adds up to.

 

[hog88]

What if Israel just said **** you and nuked em? Anyone think if roles were reversed that Iran would not do the same?

toungue in cheek..kinda

I think it would be WWIII.

 

[Orangeburst]

People have not been paying attention.
The group leading Israel right now have had enough of the attacks from tribal terrorist groups. They are making bold moves in plain sight and nobody is noticing what it adds up to.

kinda leads me to believe that this is the move that removes any international support including USA..will be considered a pariah nation by the World..all alone.