Is Butch actually recruiting players..

[knoxvol16]

must win and might win is two different things. they killed us last year. and will continue to do so if our recruiting and speed doesnt improve, that coach has that program moving in the right direction and as tennessee, georgia, and Florida perform below their programs expectations and Vandy is on the rise they will steal enough recruits to become more and more competitive in the SEC

I agree. "Must Win" was the same terminology used by the UT coaching staff.

 

[knoxvol16]

I agree with a lot of what you said. But the primary reason for this loss was the QB position. We were one dimensional all night long. I do think that our play calling was suspect at times. But let's be honest, if our QB play wouldn't have been absolutely pathetic, we win that game.

Good points - QB could never really get into a rhythm on the long passes. Noticed that within the 1st quarter of play. Franklin was covering well, and stacked up against the run. He did a great job of exploiting our weaknesses, which is what good coaches do.

 

[KBVol]

This needs speed..... desperately. Speed definitely fits Jones' system so let's see....
Here's a quick look though not a complete list....

Vic Wharton - very, very fast
Rashaan Gaulden - very, very fast
Todd Kelly- very fast
D'Andre Payne - very fast
Cortez McDowell - very fast
Emmanuel Moseley - incredibly fast
Berry twins- both very very fast
Jalen Hurd- incredibly fast
LaVon Pearson - very fast
Dillon Bates- very fast
Chris Weatherd - very fast
Trayvon Paulk - very fast

 

[BigTCountry]

I 'liked' you're post because you actually made some of the same points about Vandy's "belief" in their program and their coach that I've made in other threads. However, I can't respond to your other comments any better than others already have, as I agree with those who've stated that I'd be glad to have UA's first year record with Saban.

However, by your other comments, I can only assume that you apparently like conjecture - because you've assumed I'd be qualified to be the AD, and you've extrapolated my original comments into something I never said. In any case, I will not cover my eyes and blindly follow. Show me leadership, deliver on self-imposed goals, give me something that I haven't seen in those 5 years you spoke of above. Then, I will believe. Right now, things look good for a #2 signing class, but I'll believe it February, when the ink hits the paper - that will certainly be a welcomed first step in the right direction.

By the way, during those 5 years you mention, I have poured thousands of dollars into this program - so don't think I'm some spoiled kid sitting in my room crying because my team didn't win. So many on here get their panties in wad whenever someone questions performance. I honestly don't understand it. Maybe it's because I from an age when accountability was still taught in schools. It's an interesting thing "accountability;" I guarantee you'll run into one day.

I give you props for making it difficult to respond in a somewhat respectable and hopefully accuruate manner which i dont worry about on the forum too much. Sure we all make some mistakenly wrong comments (including me) that may not pan out to be true or weren't entirely true due to ignorance. And we all have the right since its just a forum, but at the same time, this game relies on hope as a fan, unless your a player, coach, or sports analyst. Even as some decide they want to gve to the program for whatever reason, the answer is still hope and support, other than that what is a fans role besides being a UT supporter/fan. I do spend little time on here and probably check the forums I post to if I get time once a week, and when I do its mostly straight negativity, its hard to swallow a loss, but as a fan and a former athlete the roles change as you change from an active participant in a sport to a spectator. For me I see an abundance of the comments on here (not targeting yours) pose such a bad attitude towards the program and to me it just seems worse then the loss to begin with. Recently being involved in sports, it was drilled my head over and over again til practically brainwashed one play at a time, one game at time, and one season at a time. If one play,game, or season, doesn't go right forget it and move forward. thats my mentality so lots of times I say to the ones that are anti vols mode to go ahead abort the mission and find another team. So if I offended anyone sorry, but the truth of the matter is, none of us knows what the next five years are going to be like with coach jones, we can try to give a good reason on wwhy we will think its a certain way but its just not reasonable to say ones right and ones wrong. Accountability is an important; I wouldnt say being 100% accountable is required of me on a forum though, so I do jump to conclusions to reach my point. I want say that if fans do have hope or continue to support their team, you would think their "talk" would be more accountable as a fan if they choose to continue supporting what they see sometimes as a lost cause. But I guess some on here think their responsibility is to bash their team and tell others how they should've made better decisions in all areas of the program as their team continues to lose. If your choosing to challenge my credibility as to being accountable, go ahead, this is sports talk. :whistling:

 

[VolFan4Life87]

Would you prefer we go back to the single wing? Maybe the veer or wishbone would be more to your liking.

What SYSTEM or SCHEME do you have that makes a
TRUE freshman quarterback throw the ball away, rather than throwing a desperation interception or running backwards for 18 yards and taking a sack.

That isn't the coach's fault. That is a kid being a kid.

Also we've known all season that our receivers were still learning how to run PRECISE routes and they bobble too many passes.

We've played a schedule that would have made Eisenhower cancel D Day and you people think a coach can magically turn around four years of crap.

Seriously?

The scheme where this overrated offensive line actually blocked somebody and prevented that kind of pressure from getting to Dobbs. They're the upperclassmen, it was their responsibility to lead this team and they flat out failed.

 

[JonGrudensAgent]

Explain Vandy blew them out last season and this season we have the same D and and lost 3 skill players to the NFL. So when you say most do you mean the ones who ignored that fact.

Dooley's team quit on him.

Next.

 

[berry4heisman77]

to fit his system? Has anyone looked into that?

If so, I'm not too concerned about the recruiting class. Not all the best players fit your system.

Pretty sure we have a consensus top 5 class, I don't know what expectations everyone has around here, but I don't know anybody that should be concerned about recruiting right now. Top 5 is pretty good in my book, when coming off a losing season.

 

[JonGrudensAgent]

Still a freshman, on most good teams in the SEC a freshman should never start, bc its silly to think your going to get senior like play or anything close to it out of him when playing physical SEC opponents.

Aaron Murray disagrees.

Tyler Bray disagrees.

Peyton Manning disagrees.

Johnny Manziel disagrees.

AJ McCarron disagrees.

Eric Ainge and Brent Schaeffer disagrees with you.

Jeremy Johnson at Auburn has a package to play this weekend in the Iron Bowl. That's Auburn's biggest game of the year and Malzahn isn't scared to roll the dice and give him some snaps.

Tebow came in as a true freshman and split time with Leak.

You've got guys all over the country like Mariota, Hundley, Bridgewater, O Brien at Maryland etc who started and did well as freshmen.

Playing a freshman quarterback isn't ideal, but it isn't the kiss of death for most teams like it is for the Vols. You can at least get something positive out of them.

All of those guys I mentioned cut their teeth under difficult circumstances and offered positives for their teams. We've seen absolutely nothing out of Dobbs so far.

Either way, it's on Jones and his staff.

They are either slow at getting Dobbs up to speed, who everyone was touting as knowing the playbook backwards and forwards already.

Or it's that Dobbs just ins't very good which means Jones and his staff have trouble spotting talent in recruiting.

He has shown he has good game speed and a strong arm already so I think the talent is there. That leaves one other part of the equation that must be missing.

 

[terrypedigo]

to fit his system? Has anyone looked into that?

If so, I'm not too concerned about the recruiting class. Not all the best players fit your system.

ost-4-1090547912: No he is recruiting players to fit bamas system.ost-4-1090547912:but to be serious I believe he is recruiting best player instead of need, and in the end it will work.

 

[terrypedigo]

This needs speed..... desperately. Speed definitely fits Jones' system so let's see....
Here's a quick look though not a complete list....

Vic Wharton - very, very fast
Rashaan Gaulden - very, very fast
Todd Kelly- very fast
D'Andre Payne - very fast
Cortez McDowell - very fast
Emmanuel Moseley - incredibly fast
Berry twins- both very very fast
Jalen Hurd- incredibly fast
LaVon Pearson - very fast
Dillon Bates- very fast
Chris Weatherd - very fast
Trayvon Paulk - very fast

Its like that song I cant drive 55.And that what we need SPEED SPEED SPEED AND MORE SPEED.

 

[volfan411]

Aaron Murray disagrees.

Tyler Bray disagrees.

Peyton Manning disagrees.

Johnny Manziel disagrees.

AJ McCarron disagrees.

Eric Ainge and Brent Schaeffer disagrees with you.

Jeremy Johnson at Auburn has a package to play this weekend in the Iron Bowl. That's Auburn's biggest game of the year and Malzahn isn't scared to roll the dice and give him some snaps.

Tebow came in as a true freshman and split time with Leak.

You've got guys all over the country like Mariota, Hundley, Bridgewater, O Brien at Maryland etc who started and did well as freshmen.

Playing a freshman quarterback isn't ideal, but it isn't the kiss of death for most teams like it is for the Vols. You can at least get something positive out of them.

All of those guys I mentioned cut their teeth under difficult circumstances and offered positives for their teams. We've seen absolutely nothing out of Dobbs so far.

Either way, it's on Jones and his staff.

They are either slow at getting Dobbs up to speed, who everyone was touting as knowing the playbook backwards and forwards already.

Or it's that Dobbs just ins't very good which means Jones and his staff have trouble spotting talent in recruiting.

He has shown he has good game speed and a strong arm already so I think the talent is there. That leaves one other part of the equation that must be missing.

All redshirted so that is not a fair comparison to Dobbs.

 

[JonGrudensAgent]

Explain Vandy blew them out last season and this season we have the same D and and lost 3 skill players to the NFL. So when you say most do you mean the ones who ignored that fact.

And by the way, the odds makers must have ignored last year as well.

 

[volfan411]

Aaron Murray disagrees.

Tyler Bray disagrees.

Peyton Manning disagrees.

Johnny Manziel disagrees.

AJ McCarron disagrees.

Eric Ainge and Brent Schaeffer disagrees with you.

Jeremy Johnson at Auburn has a package to play this weekend in the Iron Bowl. That's Auburn's biggest game of the year and Malzahn isn't scared to roll the dice and give him some snaps.

Tebow came in as a true freshman and split time with Leak.

You've got guys all over the country like Mariota, Hundley, Bridgewater, O Brien at Maryland etc who started and did well as freshmen.

Playing a freshman quarterback isn't ideal, but it isn't the kiss of death for most teams like it is for the Vols. You can at least get something positive out of them.

All of those guys I mentioned cut their teeth under difficult circumstances and offered positives for their teams. We've seen absolutely nothing out of Dobbs so far.

Either way, it's on Jones and his staff.

They are either slow at getting Dobbs up to speed, who everyone was touting as knowing the playbook backwards and forwards already.

Or it's that Dobbs just ins't very good which means Jones and his staff have trouble spotting talent in recruiting.

He has shown he has good game speed and a strong arm already so I think the talent is there. That leaves one other part of the equation that must be missing.

Mariota and Hunley both redshirted as well so not relevant.

As you would say next.

 

[JonGrudensAgent]

All redshirted so that is not a fair comparison to Dobbs.

You really got me there.

Three out of how many I mentioned ? LOL

 

[JonGrudensAgent]

Mariota and Hunley both redshirted as well so not relevant.

As you would say next.

How did Butch do with Peterman, a redshirt freshman whom he recruited at Cincinatti this year?

 

[volfan411]

How did Butch do with Peterman, a redshirt freshman whom he recruited at Cincinatti this year?

I am not saying he did a good job with either just that the better QB's you mentioned had a full season under their coach to learn the system. There are currently more questions than answer for the QB spot.

I believe Jones was unfair to Peterman by starting him on the road in the Swamp. I was never a Petermen fan and believe he is odd man out.

 

[volfan411]

How did Butch do with Peterman, a redshirt freshman whom he recruited at Cincinatti this year?

I did not mean to come across as being ugly and apologize if I did. The point I was trying to make is the more successful freshmen are the ones that have RS and had that year to adjust. That is why I believe this staff will need another year to get their players in here and instill a winning attitude in the ones currently on staff. I responded to you in another thread that Franlin has his kids believing they can win and our kids have been taught to believe they are going to lose.

 

[JonGrudensAgent]

I am not saying he did a good job with either just that all the QB's you mentioned had a full season under their coach to learn the system. There are currently more questions than answer for the QB spot.

I believe Jones was unfair to Peterman by starting him on the road in the Swamp. I was never a Petermen fan and believe he is odd man out.

I agree that he put Peterman in a tough spot but that Florida loss looks much worse now after GA Southern as well.

My point on listing those QB's is this, having a true freshman or first year starter since you mentioned the redshirts shouldn't necessarily be the end of the season for a team like it was for the Vols this year.

I have no idea what to expect out of any of these QB's next season.

 

[volfan411]

I agree that he put Peterman in a tough spot but that Florida loss looks much worse now after GA Southern as well.

My point on listing those QB's is this, having a true freshman or first year starter since you mentioned the redshirts shouldn't necessarily be the end of the season for a team like it was for the Vols this year.

I have no idea what to expect out of any of these QB's next season.

That is what I hate the most about the Vandy game we have to enter another off season with more quetions than answers.

 

[volfan411]

I agree that he put Peterman in a tough spot but that Florida loss looks much worse now after GA Southern as well.

My point on listing those QB's is this, having a true freshman or first year starter since you mentioned the redshirts shouldn't necessarily be the end of the season for a team like it was for the Vols this year.

I have no idea what to expect out of any of these QB's next season.

No I agree Dobbs could have been better prepared and looked totally unprepared vs Vandy.

 

[JonGrudensAgent]

I did not mean to come across as being ugly and apologize if I did. The point I was trying to make is the more successful freshmen are the ones that have RS and had that year to adjust. That is why I believe this staff will need another year to get their players in here and instill a winning attitude in the ones currently on staff. I responded to you in another thread that Franlin has his kids believing they can win and our kids have been taught to believe they are going to lose.

Oh it's all good. I come across pretty abrasive on here at times as well so I extend an apology back to you.

I firmly believe Jones should get several years to show what he can do with improved athletes. No way do I want to see him fired based on what we are seeing in recruiting.

I am just tired of the excuses we saw pile up for previous staffs starting to trickle in for Jones as well and I don't have a great deal of confidence in his staff on either side of the ball.

I am just severely disappointed that the team we saw against USC doesn't seem to be close to the team we have gotten for the last month.

I can understand the Worley injury impacting the offense but the defense and special teams is another matter.

The loss to Vandy just really boiled down to losing to a comparably talented team IMO and that falls on the coaches.

 

[JonGrudensAgent]

That is what I hate the most about the Vandy game we have to enter another off season with more quetions than answers.

One thing that really worries me for next season is the turnover on the O line and D line.

I know they weren't great and were overrated or what not, but I don't think you overcome the kind of attrition we will see in both of those experienced units easily.

A good, dependable left tackle is sometimes as difficult to replace as a QB. That's why you always see O line always going early in the draft.

 

[volfan411]

One thing that really worries me for next season is the turnover on the O line and D line.

I know they weren't great and were overrated or what not, but I don't think you overcome the kind of attrition we will see in both of those experienced units easily.

A good, dependable left tackle is sometimes as difficult to replace as a QB. That's why you always see O line always going early in the draft.

Those two positons are my biggest concern as well. If I remember correctly we had a recruiting class a couple of years ago that did not include any O linemen which will become a problem at some point. The d-line has been my concern for a couple of years and next year does not look any better unless some players are developed. I do believe the D as a whole will be better with a healthy Maggit and Reeves-Maybin on the field and if AJ comes back the LB could bethe strenght of the D. The DB's and Safeties should improve and if they do not a couple of the incoming freshmen will be taking their spots.

My biggest concern with this staff at this point is player development as they have not proved this season that they could develop any players to help in the 2 deep. I think there is some good athletes that never seen the field this year that if developed could have helped in a few games.

 

[SlipKidVol]

And coach themselves up... and draw up effective schemes in the dirt while huddling.

My god. He hasn't even been on the job a year yet

 

[17Vols]

Would you prefer we go back to the single wing? Maybe the veer or wishbone would be more to your liking.

What SYSTEM or SCHEME do you have that makes a
TRUE freshman quarterback throw the ball away, rather than throwing a desperation interception or running backwards for 18 yards and taking a sack.

That isn't the coach's fault. That is a kid being a kid.

Also we've known all season that our receivers were still learning how to run PRECISE routes and they bobble too many passes.

We've played a schedule that would have made Eisenhower cancel D Day and you people think a coach can magically turn around four years of crap.

Seriously?

I'll break it down Barney style for you. I don't like the spread option. I never said anything about the coach, the season or the situation the team is in. I will say this though, you should be angry at your parents, not me. I'm not the one who raised a moron incapable of reading comprehension. Now choke yourself for being stupid.