Israel vs Palestinians

If you are always looking to expand and then decline to do so one time because the cost is prohibitive, I don’t think that makes it unfair to say you’re always looking to expand. Doesn’t have to mean that literally nothing (not even prohibitively high costs) will ever stop you
Your judgement depends on how much weight or leniency you put on the word "always". When McRib and I got couples counseling many years ago, we were taught how to communicate clearly. One of the ways to communicate clearly is to not say words like "always" when it isn't accurate.

If my reputation is I steal property, but I don't do it always, at what point does "i steal property" change from a statement of fact to a statement of exaggeration?

Reading through the exchanges, it seems like this is where the contention is between the posters.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Vol8188
If you're economic man you're looking for property with utility. You won't spend on land you can't use.
That is true. But two challenges are now in the mix...number 1, the judgement of utility is mine, not yours. So anytime I opt not to steal you can simply say it wasn't worth it so it doesn't count. Unless you know my numbers and my decision tree, i don't know how you can accurately arrive at that conclusion. number 2, when I opt to not do it then saying it is in my nature but we're only talking about when it benefits me (based on a subjective-ignorant-of-the-metrics judgement by you) isn't accurate or demonstrable.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Vol8188
So Israel is annexing the land into Israeli control but not evicting the legal (individual owners), so again how is this theft of land? If a neighboring city annexes the part of the county I live in did they "steal" it even though I still own it?
Annexing is a good example. The article used the term "confiscating". I didn't read the article but that word should only mean 'taking possession from' even if temporarily.
 
The real land „theft“ in the region occurred in 587 BC during the Babylonian Exile and again in both 70 and 132 AD as the Romans exiled the resident Jews. When the rightful owner of a property regains possession, that is restoration, not „theft“
I have found information about the land ownership going back to a biblical timeline aren't part of the conversation. I don't think people can either agree on the accuracy or don't want to go back that far.
 
That is true. But two challenges are now in the mix...number 1, the judgement of utility is mine, not yours. So anytime I opt not to steal you can simply say it wasn't worth it so it doesn't count. Unless you know my numbers and my decision tree, i don't know how you can accurately arrive at that conclusion. number 2, when I opt to not do it then saying it is in my nature but we're only talking about when it benefits me (based on a subjective-ignorant-of-the-metrics judgement by you) isn't accurate or demonstrable.
Israel tried to put settlers there and found it cost too much to maintain them. They made the judgement that it wasn't worth it.
 
Israel tried to put settlers there and found it cost too much to maintain them. They made the judgement that it wasn't worth it.
I've tried to help elucidate why "those with a nature to steal land" would not be motivated or dissuaded based on arguments of utility. I have further tried to shed light on why it is challenging to assess motivation as a third party. Additionally, I think the terms being used aren't conducive to understanding the points everyone is making.

I did my best. I may have failed miserably. But I've done all I know to do at this point.
 
If you are always looking to expand and then decline to do so one time because the cost is prohibitive, I don’t think that makes it unfair to say you’re always looking to expand. Doesn’t have to mean that literally nothing (not even prohibitively high costs) will ever stop you

Except that the same person making the claim that it was too expensive has also called the current war in Gaza a land grab.
 
I've tried to help elucidate why "those with a nature to steal land" would not be motivated or dissuaded based on arguments of utility. I have further tried to shed light on why it is challenging to assess motivation as a third party. Additionally, I think the terms being used aren't conducive to understanding the points everyone is making.

I did my best. I may have failed miserably. But I've done all I know to do at this point.
I can't agree that a thief by nature would steal anything and everything they possibly could. They'd be prone to theft, and they'd steal what was useful to them. I've known a couple of people like that. Putting it differently, if it's your nature to steal cars would you steal a rusted out 90 Caprice missing the engine and up on blocks?
 
I can't agree that a thief by nature would steal anything and everything they possibly could. They'd be prone to theft, and they'd steal what was useful to them. I've known a couple of people like that. Putting it differently, if it's your nature to steal cars would you steal a rusted out 90 Caprice missing the engine and up on blocks?
If it meant my bitter "lifelong" enemy is harmed or irritated and I was "evil" in that way, yes of course.

My experience is when emotion is involved, logic and reason are absent. So, if the battling governments hate each other and practice evil against each other, there is no reason for utility to be a stop from doing what is in their nature.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 85SugarVol
I have found information about the land ownership going back to a biblical timeline aren't part of the conversation. I don't think people can either agree on the accuracy or don't want to go back that far.
Even if one ignores the Bible, contemporaneous Assyrian and Roman records show exactly the same thing. Archeological evidence also concurs. No serious historian doubts historical Jewish ownership of the region
 
If it meant my bitter "lifelong" enemy is harmed or irritated and I was "evil" in that way, yes of course.

My experience is when emotion is involved, logic and reason are absent. So, if the battling governments hate each other and practice evil against each other, there is no reason for utility to be a stop from doing what is in their nature.
You keep ignoring that they tried and found it to be too high cost. Why is that?
 
You keep ignoring that they tried and found it to be too high cost. Why is that?
I don't think I am. You mentioned utility and I have referenced it many times since.

If I could harm you by stealing your rusted Caprice, would I? Especially if theft is in my nature and I am evil???

I think the answer is self evident. So, utility isn't part of the decision in my act of theft.
 
I don't think I am. You mentioned utility and I have referenced it many times since.

If I could harm you by stealing your rusted Caprice, would I? Especially if theft is in my nature and I am evil???

I think the answer is self evident. So, utility isn't part of the decision in my act of theft.
I wouldn't, since I started to steal it once and found out that it's not worth it.
 
I've tried to help elucidate why "those with a nature to steal land" would not be motivated or dissuaded based on arguments of utility. I have further tried to shed light on why it is challenging to assess motivation as a third party. Additionally, I think the terms being used aren't conducive to understanding the points everyone is making.

I did my best. I may have failed miserably. But I've done all I know to do at this point.
If they still took the land in the first place that would be "stealing". whatever is meant by that.

just because they found out after the fact the land wasn't usable, or they tried to give it to a third party doesn't make it not "stealing".

I steal something from the store, go home, try to use, find out it doesn't work, and then go back to the store to return it; I still stole it originally.

I steal something, then try to give it to someone else beyond the rightful owner, its still stealing.

you don't have to maintain possession of an object in order to have stolen it in the first place. a change of heart later doesn't undo the original action.

all that gets a lot more tricky if the usage of "stolen" means "annexed" or something else, but it could still apply as well.

if an HOA annexes my neighborhood, I may still own my house, but that HOA is now dictating the terms and conditions of my usage of my own house.

and this all assumes Israel nor Palestine/Gaza had a property tax that worked similar to over here. Maybe the land/building owner outright owned their property, Israel comes in, assesses property tax, and then can later take the land or building? I would call that stealing, regardless of how Israel claimed that land.
 
I've tried to help elucidate why "those with a nature to steal land" would not be motivated or dissuaded based on arguments of utility. I have further tried to shed light on why it is challenging to assess motivation as a third party. Additionally, I think the terms being used aren't conducive to understanding the points everyone is making.

I did my best. I may have failed miserably. But I've done all I know to do at this point.
Willful ignorance can not be overcome with logic
 
  • Like
Reactions: hog88 and Vol8188
Now we are back to being evasive and pretending you don’t understanding. You’re speaking of economics and utility. Gaza is very usable land and could be of great economic benefit.
You're hopeless. No evasion. No lack of understanding of your duplicity.
 
Last edited:

VN Store



Back
Top