Jalen Hurd's version

#76
#76
The hatred and ignorance in this topic is still enormous. Hurd is gone because Butch Jones was a lying Piece of crap and nothing more.

Calling a 20 year old stupid for "believing" a lie that a grown man with more years lying to recruits than he has been alive isn't really a good judgement of intelligence.

Calling Hurd "not as good as we thought" when he is 6th all time rushing at UT, despite having a system terrible for his style, a bad offensive line, and only playing 2.5 seasons, is a level of idiocy and lack of unerstanding of the game as you can get.

The kid would have, without question, been our all time leading rusher (barring a career ending injury) even with the terrible coaching and system and offensive line.

We've seen him run over players of all positions, turn 4th downs into multiple broken tackles and touchdowns, and put up video game numbers against "elite" defenses, multiple times.

Is he as Good as Kamara? Probably not. But considering not just Butch Jones, but Nick Saban and every single NFL team in the first few rounds, missed on just how good Kamara was, that's not really a fair comparison.

There is no question he is an elite college Running Back. His numbers in the best conference in the country on a terrible to above average team, in a system not designed for him, prove that much.

Did he make a dumb decision? To fans? Yes. Because he betrayed fans and they will ignore him turning down elite schools to come to a rebuilding job at TN where he got the hell beat out of him for three years.

Did he make a dumb decision for himself? No. Because he was lied to by his coaches multiple times, lied about with injuries to the press, and he was reviled by the fan base for leaving a toxic situation for ANYONE, let alone a kid.

Call him a quitter if you want, but I see a guy who knew he was in a losing situation no matter what he did, and he took the one with the lowest chance of getting hurt. But I can't view someone who turns down free championship games on elite teams with guaranteed play time still for a rebuild job only to get lied to and finally fed up after getting the hell beat out of him for years and putting up ridiculous numbers anyway as "not a team guy" or "too arrogant."

Vol fans will continue hating him, especially the more successful he is, not because he did anything wrong, but because Unlike them, he walked away on his own terms tired of being treated like a tool and scapegoat.

Legions of the miserable is what many Vol fans are. Hate on kids if they don't come here, hate on them if they do and don't produce, hate on them if they do come here AND produce but don't do exactly what they want when they want it.

We are a great fan base and one of the most passionate in the world. But our stupid, arrogant, ignorant, hateful fans don't deserve our team or the rest of us who appreciate those who put on the jersey.

I look forward to seeing Hurd play on Sundays. He certainly has the talent, physical ability, size, and yes speed (but no, not quickness.) Anyone who truly believes he doesn't have the characteristics to play on Sunday are the same who think Kiffin is a bad OC or that Bray or Rogers were bad college players or don't have the talent for Sundays either.

Fact is, if he were still here and about to enter the draft those same losers would be pissed he wasn't drafted high enough (and he would have been drafted here, 100%. most likely in the first few rounds, probably before Kamara even based on tape)
 
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#77
#77
05_never_again said:
Kamara and John Kelly played on those same bad teams/offensive lines, and they put up better numbers and were both better backs than Hurd. That's why he's overrated. John Kelly somehow averaged almost 5 yards from scrimmage per touch in 2017 with an absolutely atrocious and injury-ravaged offensive line. Hurd in 2016? 4.0, including a whopping 3.7 YPC. Kelly average 4.1 YPC in 2017.

I'm not saying Hurd was overrated just because he quit mid-season. Hurd was overrated because he did not perform like a highly-rated 4 or 5-star recruit while here, even when accounting for a bad offensive line, and it was frustrating as a fan because he consistently got playing time over another RB on the roster who not only was a better RB for the offense they were running, but was a better RB period.
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You really don't seem to understand the difference in styles of play for an offense or defense do you?

Peyton Manning, in Butch Jones offense, would not look that good because it requires a mobile QB to even have a chance.

Albert Haynsworth, in a defense that doesn't utilize him taking up multiple lineman with good/great linebackers to make the plays, doesn't look like that elite of a lineman.

Kamara and Kelly, however, are the "scat back" prototype that absolutely thrive in offenses like Jones. They need very little build up time, are best at making players miss, and are good at playing wing/slot positions. We got EXTREMELY fortunate in the fact that Kamara and Kelly both also had the ability to break tackles at a ridiculous pace for their size. if you think that is common you need to watch more football at all levels. Hell, just watch Kamara in the NFL the last year and you'll see his tackle breaking is otherworldy for THAT level.

Hurd is the prototypical Pro style running back. The Eddie George offenses that get two tight ends and run it down your throat and get 4-5 yards a carry and make you wish you never played against them. They do not accelerate quickly, they aren't shifty behind the line of scrimmage, and they are rarely put in reciever positions because they take such beatings already and usually they aren't fast enough or good enough recievers to do it.

The fact Hurd was able to put up such good numbers despite being in an offense that actually hinders his play style is proof to how good he was. The fact he was so good at recieving out of the backfield and in non RB positions despite his size shows his versatility.

To call him overrated shows a complete lack of understanding of basic football strategy, playing to your players strengths.

Hurd put up top 10 all time numbers at one of the sports most historic schools (home to some of college and NFL's best RBs ever) from the time he set foot on campus as a kid, and did it in only 2 and a half seasons, all while effectively having one arm tied behind his back counting Jones and the style of offense.

If you think THAT guy is overrated, especially by comparing him to one of the best NFL running backs in recent memory in a system designed for his strengths (who was also 2 years older when he first played here), then you need to stop giving takes on players. You don't understand what words like overrated mean.
 
#78
#78
He was severely overrated and only put up top 10 total yards because he got way more carries than the rest of the list. Yes, he is not built to play in space in the kind of offense Butch runs. But by his own admission he wanted to play in space even more. For all this talk about being promised more I-formation, by the end he was wanting fewer carries between the tackles.

It's fine for the guy to look at his future and decide that he doesn't want the wear and tear that comes with playing RB. But, in making that call he let his team down. Wanna say that Butch lied to him? Fine. But that isn't a glass house from which Hurd should be throwing stones.
 
#79
#79
bamawriter said:
It's fine for the guy to look at his future and decide that he doesn't want the wear and tear that comes with playing RB. But, in making that call he let his team down. Wanna say that Butch lied to him? Fine. But that isn't a glass house from which Hurd should be throwing stones.
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It was a poor decision to do it the way he did it.

Had he wanted to throw stones given the load fell completely on him (even tho the SS Jones had hit an iceberg already) he would have aired out his grievances at the time.

What he just did is a far cry from throwing rocks.
 
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#80
#80
I think legal charges should be filed for having Hurd and Kamara on the roster and not having them on the field at the same time. Its criminal.
 
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#81
#81
Daloth said:
Hurd is the prototypical Pro style running back. The Eddie George offenses that get two tight ends and run it down your throat and get 4-5 yards a carry and make you wish you never played against them. They do not accelerate quickly, they aren't shifty behind the line of scrimmage, and they are rarely put in reciever positions because they take such beatings already and usually they aren't fast enough or good enough recievers to do it.

The fact Hurd was able to put up such good numbers despite being in an offense that actually hinders his play style is proof to how good he was. The fact he was so good at recieving out of the backfield and in non RB positions despite his size shows his versatility.
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Hurd is not a prototypical pro-style running back, especially the way the game is played today. He might have been in 1960 in a true "3 yards and a cloud of dust" offense. He's 6'4'', 240 lbs. Eddie George is not a prototypical running back either.

Also, I assume you're looking at the counting stats (particularly rushing yards) in isolation when you say he had "good numbers." He did play in an offense that hindered his playing style and on a team with a bad offensive line. I'll concede that and have said as much in previous posts. However, even taking that into consideration, he simply did not put up good numbers, especially for such a highly touted player. He only averaged 4.5 YPC during his career, including 3.7 his junior year.

He's 6th all-time in rushing yards purely because of the volume of carries he got. Travis Henry, our career rushing leader, rushed for 440 more yards than Hurd on 33 fewer carries. Jamal Lewis, 5th on the career rushing list, rushed for 39 more yards on 102 fewer carries. Hurd would've rushed for more yards than those guys if he stayed, but he would have done it on significantly more carries. If that doesn't prove my point, I don't know what will. Hell, Cedric Houston rushed for 4 fewer yards than Hurd on 88 fewer carries.

He wasn't an efficient runner, and he would've been even worse if Butch used him the way he allegedly asked Butch to use him, because he has no speed, no quickness, or ability to make anyone miss in space.
 
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#83
#83
Captain Obvious here but the one thing which stands out is that Jones (unlike CJP) had no intention of putting the best guys on the field that gave us the best chance to win. Or he didn't know how.
 
#85
#85
Follows the old adage that there are “two sides to every story”.

More often than not, the truth is somewhere in the middle.
 
#86
#86
I think Hurd was a much better receiver than he received credit for and they didn't work that into the gameplan enough. He was getting hit way too much and we all know he wasn't elusive or overly powerful. He had 4.4 combine speed but we never saw that come game time. The kid shouldn't have been a running back. He lacked the burst and the vision and couldn't break tackles at all. He has a bunch of yards due to volume work and having the threat of Josh Dobbs giving him space. Butch Jones is an idiot. He recruited players based off stars and not who fit his system. Kamara should have been a headman candidate.
 
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