Justin Hunter and the morality behind post-injury play

#51
#51
ntxVOL said:
I think it makes a good argument for the NFL to draft kids sooner, even out of high school. Those few are not in it (CFB) for the right reasons anyway and are a stain on the game we all love.
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What are the "right" reasons? Isn't the point of college to prepare yourself for a career?
 
#53
#53
ntxVOL said:
I think it makes a good argument for the NFL to draft kids sooner, even out of high school. Those few are not in it (CFB) for the right reasons anyway and are a stain on the game we all love.
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No, they're in it for the right reasons until they see their career flash before their eyes in the form of an ACL injury
 
#55
#55
GAVol said:
What are the "right" reasons? Isn't the point of college to prepare yourself for a career?
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Clowney didn't do anything to improve his draft status last year. So because of an NFL requirement he took a roster spot and playing time from someone else.
 
#56
#56
ntxVOL said:
Clowney didn't do anything to improve his draft status last year. So because of an NFL requirement he took a roster spot and playing time from someone else.
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True, but there are maybe 5 guys a year that are legitimate NFL prospects by the end of their 2nd year.
 
#57
#57
ntxVOL said:
Clowney didn't do anything to improve his draft status last year. So because of an NFL requirement he took a roster spot and playing time from someone else.
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all while helping his team to an 11-2 record and a top-5 finish AND not getting a career-threatening injury

sounds like a successful season to me
 
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#59
#59
Change the sign in the locker room:

"I will give my ALL for Tennessee today (unless i am in line to be drafted by the NFL)"
 
#61
#61
crusse10 said:
happens to baseless arguments from time to time
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You made a left-handed argument to a right-handed opinion. No middle ground there so no reason to waste any time.

That's all. :peace2:
 
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#62
#62
ntxVOL said:
You made a left-handed argument to a right-handed opinion. No middle ground there so no reason to waste any time.

That's all. :peace2:
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the 2013 team was better because he was on it, so why does it matter if he protects himself as well
 
#63
#63
fade route said:
As a fan, I don't like it. As a player though, I would do the same thing. Can't lie.
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This. I'd like to say in the same situation I would go all out, but if millions of dollars were waiting on me I'd probably think differently.
 
#64
#64
chatt-townVOL said:
Just some off-season discussion, but all the talk about this receiving corp has got me thinking about some of our more recent players, including Hunter.

I think most would agree 2010-2011 Hunter was a different player than "post-ACL" 2012 Hunter. Hunter still had a great year in 2012, but before he went down it seemed like he was shaping up to be one of the best receivers in UT history. He was fast, tall, athletic, and would sacrifice himself to make the catch. The truth is pre-injury Hunter would go through a defender or over a defender to make the catch, especially if it was for 6. 2012 Hunter seemed to spend a great portion of his year avoiding contact. Often times he would catch the ball and go down when he could have picked up 10 more, and I'm pretty sure at least once a game he would step backwards after the catch to avoid contact instead of just diving forward. Don't get me wrong, I was a huge Hunter fan, but it's hard to deny what we all saw in 2012.

This brings me to the morality issue. Granted, gun-shyness is a real thing. I have no doubt he was scared of landing wrong or taking a bad hit, but I think it's also safe to assume he had his pro career in mind. So my question is, is it wrong to play "softer" to try to avoid injury if your pro career is right around the corner?

At first glance the answer would seem to be "yes", but then again, a player like Hunter has probably had pro football on his mind ever since he was told he has the potential to get there. Kids all the time are told "don't base your decisions in school around the assumption you can make it in the pros" but let's be honest, they still do. So how many of us would sacrifice our future career for the good of Tennessee football? I love Tennessee, but I sure wouldn't. On the other hand the argument can be made that UT was essentially "paying" him (via scholarship) to come play. My wife and I will be paying for the rest of our lives on her student loans from UT, meanwhile Hunter was going for free, and UT was letting him go for free under the assumption that he would give his all to help advance the football program. From that perspective, playing soft to avoid injury is essentially not holding up your end of the deal.

Anyways like I said, just some offseason discussion, but is it morally wrong to play soft after injury to assure a lucrative career in the pros, or is it justifiable?
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If Hunter had injured himself again making a heroic catch while being hit in the knees by, oh say, a Gator DB. Or worse yet, took a hit that induced permanent brain damage. Then end up not being drafted and living on the streets, what would you have done for him? After he had given his all to Tennessee? What would do for him?

I'm not advocating anything he did. But I am trying point out to you the self-centered, self righteousness fans like you exhibit.
 
#65
#65
chatt-townVOL said:
Yes it is. Is it morally right to take scholarship money from your university, and in turn not put full effort into your play in order to benefit yourself in your future?
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if 2012 Justin Hunter was even him at 40 percent, he earned his scholarship $.
 
#66
#66
WoodsmanVol said:
If Hunter had injured himself again making a heroic catch while being hit in the knees by, oh say, a Gator DB. Or worse yet, took a hit that induced permanent brain damage. Then end up not being drafted and living on the streets, what would you have done for him? After he had given his all to Tennessee? What would do for him?

I'm not advocating anything he did. But I am trying point out to you the self-centered, self righteousness fans like you exhibit.
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Why are you throwing a hissy fit at me? I didn't say my thoughts one way or the other. I asked a question to guage general responses.

If you'll notice in my OP I didn't answer my own question. You should make an attempt at reading things thoroughly before you lash out at them.
 
#67
#67
I don't think it is ever a conscious decision to take a play off or even a season. While never being remotely blessed with Hunter's raw talent, I have experienced that sharp,burning tearing feeling of a serious injury. No matter how well it heals physically, there is doubt, and hesitation. You just don't forget something tearing inside your body and go balls to the wall, without seeing it hold up game after game.

Why play a player who is only giving 75% ? If his 75% is head and shoulders above your next option he plays and you hope he steps up in critical moments.

For one I am sure glad Justin Hunter wore the Orange for UT before and after his injury. Was he the same post injury ? No, but I always held my breath when the ball was thrown his way, knowing something special could happen.
 
#69
#69
I don't blame Hunter for what he did, and many players do the same thing. Personally I think Poole and Neal did it too.

My issue is how this fan base doesn't see how this type of behavior hurts a coaches ability to win games. Except for that one guy who says he doesn't blame Dooley for the Mizzou loss but Hunter. He get its! I've been using this type of thing in my arguments for why Dooley wasn't as incompetent as most on here like to think. He had a team full of players like this he never had the ability to fully purge before getting fired.

I know I'm going to get the "get over it Dooley is gone" and the "Geez give it up already" msgs, but my deal isn't Dooley as much as this fanbases inability to truly see how these little things trickle through and affect a coaches ability to succeed. We are going to see the same thing with CBJ if we aren't careful, and The Legion of the Miserable will bring him down too. That's my real concern cause it hurts UT which is what I care about. I reference Dooley so much cause frankly he is the only coach we can point back to in our recent history cause this next era of UT football imo started when Kiffin left. He blew up the popsicale stand, and all the years of mismanagement and dept just started coming out. And no this isn't a Dooley love deal he just happened to be the coach hired. My opinion would be the same if it were someone else.
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#70
#70
I don't blame Hunter for what he did, and many players do the same thing. Personally I think Poole and Neal did it too.

My issue is how this fan base doesn't see how this type of behavior hurts a coaches ability to win games. Except for that one guy who says he doesn't blame Dooley for the Mizzou loss but Hunter. He get its! I've been using this type of thing in my arguments for why Dooley wasn't as incompetent as most on here like to think. He had a team full of players like this he never had the ability to fully purge before getting fired.

I know I'm going to get the "get over it Dooley is gone" and the "Geez give it up already" msgs, but my deal isn't Dooley as much as this fanbases inability to truly see how these little things trickle through and affect a coaches ability to succeed. We are going to see the same thing with CBJ if we aren't careful, and The Legion of the Miserable will bring him down too. That's my real concern cause it hurts UT which is what I care about. I reference Dooley so much cause frankly he is the only coach we can point back to in our recent history cause this next era of UT football imo started when Kiffin left. He blew up the popsicle stand, and all the years of mismanagement and debt just started flying everywhere fall all to see. And no this isn't a Dooley love deal he just happened to be the coach hired. My opinion would be the same if it were someone else.
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#72
#72
I blame Bray for Dools downfall and the furthering emplosion of the program. I remember laughing and saying that's what he gets when Dools pulled him in that last game.
 
#73
#73
if justin hunter were my son, i would have advised him to leave it all on the field.

and i say that because i truly believe you are less likely to get hurt by playing hard and the way one should than playing tentative and trying to avoid injury.

i think playing not to get hurt is actually one of the quickest ways to get hurt.

i have no scientific evidence of this, but i believe that. so, i would have advised him to go out there and be himself and do the things he's been doing since he began playing football.
 
#74
#74
I bet most of you have never gone through a knee surgery and rehab. I have, and it is not something I would look forward to again. My point is even when you feel physically fine trying to play sports, you don't mentally forget the months it took getting back.

So, unless you have walked that road, give Hunter a break. He still played good enough his final season to get drafted at the top of the 2nd round.
 
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