Kim Caldwell comparisons to Heupel

#78
#78
knoxvol52 said:
I assume some are concerned because Marshall had a stacked roster vs a Power 5 school and lost badly.🤦🤦🤦🤦
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I wouldn’t give them that much credit 😎!
It’s ironic how certain UT fans have all these concerns now as if they didn’t exist in the past five seasons or so…..
 
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#79
#79
Lucy said:
Hate to point it out but Heupel has not been able to adjust enough against the top of the SEC. That is my worry about the new system. Works against the lesser teams but can we beat SC, Tx and LSU with it. Time will tell.
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As the talent level and depth get better, I expect Tennessee will be competitive with, and beat the upper level teams. But a question; why is SC included in that list?
 
#81
#81
bigorangepoppa said:
As the talent level and depth get better, I expect Tennessee will be competitive with, and beat the upper level teams. But a question; why is SC included in that list?
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This was about the Lady Vols whose big competition is SC, LSU and Texas. The mention of Heupel is that he also has a nontraditional system that so far has not worked against Georgia. You have to read earlier posts for context there.
 
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#83
#83
Lucy said:
This was about the Lady Vols whose big competition is SC, LSU and Texas. The mention of Heupel is that he also has a nontraditional system that so far has not worked against Georgia. You have to read earlier posts for context there.
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You’re gaslighting. Somehow trying to draw parallels to discredit Caldwell and Heupel and lay blame on DW. We know, you wanted Kellie to have 1-2 more years.
 
#85
#85
I am a MARSHALL graduate and a fan of the Thundering Herd. I just joined your TENNESSEE Forums. I am happy to know that KIM is now your Lady Vols HC. God how I hated to see us lose her to you guys!. I cried when I heard the news. This is the second time MARSHALL has lost a HC to an SEC school. A few years back, we lost BILLY DONOVAN to FLORIDA and you know how that turned out. I have no doubt that this will be the same.
One of the things you are going to find out about KIM'S teams is that the game is never ever over. I can't tell you how often her teams came back from huge deficits, and it didn't seem to matter what the other team did. For those who are worried, don't be. If she can get players who can make threes, then you won't have to worry about a thing. No opponent, no matter how good they are, will be too much to handle. Also, Kim's teams will get a lot of turnovers, offensive rebounds, and they will get more shots off than their opponents. Remember, MARSHALL beat FLORIDA this year. So much for MARSHALL being undermanned against the SEC. And MARSHALL beat several SUN BELT teams that beat other SEC teams. There is no question that if KIM gets players who are about as good as the players on other SEC teams they will compete for the championship.
I just wanted to put my two cents in about whether CALDWELL is going to get the job done. God I hate that we lost KIM!! Now pardon me while I dry my tears again.
 
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#86
#86
greenwolfe@gmail.com Ran said:
I am a MARSHALL graduate and a fan of the Thundering Herd. I just joined your TENNESSEE Forums. I am happy to know that KIM is now your Lady Vols HC. God how I hated to see us lose her to you guys!. I cried when I heard the news. This is the second time MARSHALL has lost a HC to an SEC school. A few years back, we lost BILLY DONOVAN to FLORIDA and you know how that turned out. I have no doubt that this will be the same.
One of the things you are going to find out about KIM'S teams is that the game is never ever over. I can't tell you how often her teams came back from huge deficits, and it didn't seem to matter what the other team did. For those who are worried, don't be. If she can get players who can make threes, then you won't have to worry about a thing. No opponent, no matter how good they are, will be too much to handle. Also, Kim's teams will get a lot of turnovers, offensive rebounds, and they will get more shots off than their opponents. Remember, MARSHALL beat FLORIDA this year. So much for MARSHALL being undermanned against the SEC. And MARSHALL beat several SUN BELT teams that beat other SEC teams. There is no question that if KIM gets players who are about as good as the players on other SEC teams they will compete for the championship.
I just wanted to put my two cents in about whether CALDWELL is going to get the job done. God I hate that we lost KIM!! Now pardon me while I dry my tears again.
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Very classy post and fan experience you’re sharing. Don’t feel I could duplicate it and still root for a HC that left us for another program. Props.
 
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#87
#87
greenwolfe@gmail.com Ran said:
I am a MARSHALL graduate and a fan of the Thundering Herd. I just joined your TENNESSEE Forums. I am happy to know that KIM is now your Lady Vols HC. God how I hated to see us lose her to you guys!. I cried when I heard the news. This is the second time MARSHALL has lost a HC to an SEC school. A few years back, we lost BILLY DONOVAN to FLORIDA and you know how that turned out. I have no doubt that this will be the same.
One of the things you are going to find out about KIM'S teams is that the game is never ever over. I can't tell you how often her teams came back from huge deficits, and it didn't seem to matter what the other team did. For those who are worried, don't be. If she can get players who can make threes, then you won't have to worry about a thing. No opponent, no matter how good they are, will be too much to handle. Also, Kim's teams will get a lot of turnovers, offensive rebounds, and they will get more shots off than their opponents. Remember, MARSHALL beat FLORIDA this year. So much for MARSHALL being undermanned against the SEC. And MARSHALL beat several SUN BELT teams that beat other SEC teams. There is no question that if KIM gets players who are about as good as the players on other SEC teams they will compete for the championship.
I just wanted to put my two cents in about whether CALDWELL is going to get the job done. God I hate that we lost KIM!! Now pardon me while I dry my tears again.
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shoulda left those parts out,,,,gulp

also, might want to rethink an email for your name JMO
 
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#88
#88
I haven't noticed any hair on her face like our versatile football Coach has .....that is one difference .
 
#90
#90
The thing about going fast in basketball and shooting quickly is that gives the opponent just as many offensive attempts.

The stat that reduces the number of offensive opportunities for the opposing team is forced turnovers.

The philosophy of CKC's offense seems to be around physically wearing out the other team so that they start making turnovers and such. The better teams will have an answer and will have the players to also substitute.

Can she beat teams with the concept? Yes. Can she consistently beat the best teams in the country? Probably not.
 
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#91
#91
Teams that play that style, do get turnovers, but they also get a lot of fouls and put the other team on the line.

Don't kid yourself - it will work against lesser teams - but against the elite teams, she will need to be a coach and adjust when it is not working, or she will consistently get beat by those teams if she refuses to adjust to take advantage of the weaknesses and favorable matchups.
 
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#92
#92
volfan102455 said:
The thing about going fast in basketball and shooting quickly is that gives the opponent just as many offensive attempts.

The stat that reduces the number of offensive opportunities for the opposing team is forced turnovers.

The philosophy of CKC's offense seems to be around physically wearing out the other team so that they start making turnovers and such. The better teams will have an answer and will have the players to also substitute.

Can she beat teams with the concept? Yes. Can she consistently beat the best teams in the country? Probably not.
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And offensive rebounds. As I stated early, for all the talk about CKC implementing a revolutionary system, it still comes down to defense and rebounding.

The real contrast is that Kellie was still a running a 90's and 00's offense that focused on high-low post play and controlling tempo. CKC promises to run a more contemporary offense that is faster paced and spreads the floor with 3 point shooting. Since teams generally miss 60 to 65% of their 3 point attempts, that means there will be a lot of rebounds to grab.
 
#93
#93
madtownvol said:
The real contrast is that Kellie was still a running a 90's and 00's offense that focused on high-low post play and controlling tempo
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Like Dawn Staley? That's who has the roster loaded with athleticism and depth that could run the hell out of this 'system". Wonder why she doesn't?
 
#94
#94
glv98 said:
Like Dawn Staley? That's who has the roster loaded with athleticism and depth that could run the hell out of this 'system". Wonder why she doesn't?
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To be fair, she did have Boston and Cardosa the last several years that are perfect to run that system through. I wouldn’t call SC’s pace slow to control tempo though. She also did go out and get some three point shooters to open up space for them to operate in the paint after the semi loss. I do wonder with post like Kitts and Watkins if she doesn’t run more.
 
#96
#96
glv98 said:
Like Dawn Staley? That's who has the roster loaded with athleticism and depth that could run the hell out of this 'system". Wonder why she doesn't?
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She had to add 3 point shooting this season. Here is the thing. these comparisons to Heupel and American football are completely bogus. Soccer (Futball) and basketball have much direct tactical similarities in terms of the importance of exploiting open space, ball movement, counter attacking on breaks etc.

When new soccer coaches come into a team, it is very common for them to say something like "we are going to play lightning fast attacking futball and high press our opponents into submission. We will be the hardest working team....blah, blah. And fans goes, hellya because that is how they set their video games. But you see the teams in season, and they are passing the ball back to the goalie and locked in a 0-0 slug fest.

These sports aren't video games where you can set it to "all attack, hyperspeed" and go from there.

So, what you have are relative differences. Some teams press more than others but all teams press in stretches. Some teams want to do more hold play and keep possession more than others but all teams want some stretches with the ball in build up play.

In terms of b-ball. I go back to the Iowa versus LSU game which seemed like it should have been two radically different systems. But, Iowa won by getting to the rim, which was set up by the threat of their 3 point shooting.

Better teams have flexibility. Maybe their preferred style is a fast-pace game but they can hold their own in half court sets when needed.

Dawn added more outside shooting flexibility to complement the freak of nature she in had the post and all her slash and drive talent.

I expect that CKC team will a lot like the teams that gave the LVs more trouble over the last few seasons. Athletic, quick teams, that guard the perimeter very well and beat you to loose balls and offensive rebounds.
 
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#97
#97
spojo13 said:
To be fair, she did have Boston and Cardosa the last several years that are perfect to run that system through. I wouldn’t call SC’s pace slow to control tempo though. She also did go out and get some three point shooters to open up space for them to operate in the paint after the semi loss. I do wonder with post like Kitts and Watkins if she doesn’t run more.
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madtownvol said:
Better teams have flexibility. Maybe their preferred style is a fast-pace game but they can hold their own in half court sets when needed.

Dawn added more outside shooting flexibility to complement the freak of nature she in the post and all her slash and drive talent.
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Exactly my points. Eventually, you need a flexible balanced squad that can play different ways, and you definitely need reliable 3 pt shooting. And the ability to defend size in the post. I just pray a few of our offensively struggling but loaded w potential players can improve their shooting over the off season and help Jewel and Sara.
 
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#98
#98
glv98 said:
Exactly my points. Eventually, you need a flexible balanced squad that can play different ways, and you definitely need reliable 3 pt shooting. And the ability to defend size in the post. I just pray a few of our offensively struggling but loaded w potential players can improve their shooting over the off season and help Jewel and Sara.
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Just have to hope that they’ll improve their 3% shooting like they did at Marshall. Maybe having a system that looks for 3s will help some of them. I also think having a more aggressive perimeter defense will help with defending the post. For the last several years, we funneled everything into Key on defense and quite frankly never made anything that difficult on the perimeter. Don’t know if that was scheme or athleticism but I think the defensive pressure of CKC’s philosophy will have to help offset some of the lack of height outside of Jill and Spearman. I too have some concerns but I’m interested to see how it works
 
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#99
#99
spojo13 said:
Just have to hope that they’ll improve their 3% shooting like they did at Marshall. Maybe having a system that looks for 3s will help some of them. I also think having a more aggressive perimeter defense will help with defending the post. For the last several years, we funneled everything into Key on defense and quite frankly never made anything that difficult on the perimeter. Don’t know if that was scheme or athleticism but I think the defensive pressure of CKC’s philosophy will have to help offset some of the lack of height outside of Jill and Spearman. I too have some concerns but I’m interested to see how it works
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That was it. Key became the team's defensive crutch. But, 3 or 4 blocks a game does not compensate for 15 made 3s or a ton of blow lay ups. Perimeter defense is the hill that Kellie died on.
 
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