Lady Vol Softball.

[reverseosmosis]

You think I'm a protesting woman? My name is Jeff. Let me clue you in, I'm a guy. And no group has an exclusive lock on making decisions for other people, neither men nor women. You're fond of red herrings, that's one for you. But you unintentionally admitted that decisions are being made for these women by you.

I can't help but wonder what other rights of women you want to take away, all in the name of inclusiveness of course.

How about property rights? Does women owning property make you see red? Are you advocating removing a woman's right to own property, all in the name of inclusiveness? Let's see, women shouldn't own property because well by golly otherwise they wouldn't be able to be included in a man's domain. Yeah, that's it.

For all you women that may be reading this, look out, reverse osmosis has your individual rights in his sights. You would be well advised to stand up to him. He's a tyrant.

Reading comprehension, try it. The former "Lady Vols" involved in the protest are mostly women at this point. You have a couple of buffoons that have jumped to the forefront like Roger Kane, but you were referencing this through the lens of those with no choice. I choice to take your argument about giving no choice and spinning it into a question about whether this group of protesters could likely be inclined to themselves support an egregious removal of choices in other areas of their lives and interests. You go ahead and make the leap where I'm going there. It sounds as if these ladies should really be pro-choice since they have not been given an ability to choose for themselves. They should be fighting for the right to choose. Just wondering out loud if there might be a contradiction of ideology amongst this group. You can put as little or much of this on yourself as you'd like, Jeff. I don't really worry one bit about you, so I wasn't referencing you originally. Way to give yourself more credit within the discussion though.

 

[LVJeff]

Hey RO...what did you think of the game tonight?

Oh, wait. It was a Lady Vol game. You know, the team you're trying to dissolve. I guess you didn't watch the game. My bad. :dunno:

 

[Sandvol]

Reading comprehension, try it. The former "Lady Vols" involved in the protest are mostly women at this point. You have a couple of buffoons that have jumped to the forefront like Roger Kane, but you were referencing this through the lens of those with no choice. I choice to take your argument about giving no choice and spinning it into a question about whether this group of protesters could likely be inclined to themselves support an egregious removal of choices in other areas of their lives and interests. You go ahead and make the leap where I'm going there. It sounds as if these ladies should really be pro-choice since they have not been given an ability to choose for themselves. They should be fighting for the right to choose. Just wondering out loud if there might be a contradiction of ideology amongst this group. You can put as little or much of this on yourself as you'd like, Jeff. I don't really worry one bit about you, so I wasn't referencing you originally. Way to give yourself more credit within the discussion though.

Gobbledygook.

 

[Sandvol]

Yet, I wonder how many of that same group of protesting women prefers to make choices for other people and/or organisms?

I believe we've now gone full circle.

It's not just a group of protesting women who by the way are actual Lady Vols. It is the current athletes themselves. Hart came out originally and said he had asked the coaches and athletes about this and they overwhelmingly supported the change. Well, that wasn't true. He didn't ask anybody. So, he thought it was important enough to say that he asked the Lady Vols, but he really didn't. The full circle is your kooky head spinning.

 

[Rickster]

A lot of comments worthy of another thread but can we talk to this treads intent…..softball?

 

[Volfan2012]

A lot of comments worthy of another thread but can we talk to this treads intent…..softball?

I think the point that the softball team should no longer be called Lady Vols is the reason this got started.

That is true they are no longer considered Lady Vols by the University but trying to force that on individual fans isn't going to work.

The softball team is still Lady Vols to me just like basketball and that is the way I will state it in posts and posters that don't like that do not have to participate in the post.

 

[Rickster]

The softball team is still Lady Vols to me just like basketball and that is the way I will state it in posts and posters that don't like that do not have to participate in the post.

In going back and reading all this, I see your point. Women's sports at UT will always be the Lady Vols to me as well but don't see the name changing back with the current leadership at the helm.

 

[reverseosmosis]

A lot of comments worthy of another thread but can we talk to this treads intent…..softball?

Let's vote on it and see what everyone is feeling.

 

[Rickster]

Let's vote on it and see what everyone is feeling.

Sounds good to me.

 

[reverseosmosis]

Hey RO...what did you think of the game tonight?

Oh, wait. It was a Lady Vol game. You know, the team you're trying to dissolve. I guess you didn't watch the game. My bad. :dunno:

No one is trying to dissolve a team. That is intellectually dishonest of you to introduce that to the conversation. That is a great tactic to drop nuggets of falsehood into posts so that anyone following will be dishonestly swayed to believe a complete untruth about any of the argument. It's a great way to invalidate a terrific debate by one with a valid point. You introduce incorrect information without challenge to make other readers think that thought had come from the competing debater. I can't continue to debate with you now because of your moral flaw. It's also not healthy to put forth such effort when the other participant (Sand) has little more to add than insults. I guess there's no more taking either of you seriously. I hope your days are long and prosperous. Have a Merry Christmas and practice equality in the gift giving you observe this year. Wonderful Season to All!

 

[LVJeff]

So have you decided to stop dictating what other people call themselves? Until you do, you will be excluding them from a right that you yourself possess.

 

[Smallvol#1]

Thanks, LVJeff. Reason and consideration have great difficulty with negativity and hatefulness. Appreciate your efforts. And Go Lady Vols!

 

[alexvol]

I have been given the right to vote by reverseosmosis and I vote for Lady Vols .....and by the way I am most certainly all male.

RO has not been keeping up with who supports the Lady Vol moniker .....there are thousands of males who have supported and continue to support "Lady Vols ".

 

[armchair]

Bingo!

The university and/or athletic department decides what is best for school athletic programs. Should students decide their curricula or what sort of tests they take--they don't. Are the players asked to vote on what uniforms to wear? Most things in life get decided by people in authority, and if you don't know that there is no helping you. Only Lady Vol fans would get their knickers in a knot over losing an antiquated name and logo in favor of just being the Vols like every other sports program we have. The logo doesn't look very good either. It has been unchanged for a very long time and looks it.

 

[Sandvol]

The university and/or athletic department decides what is best for school athletic programs. Should students decide their curricula or what sort of tests they take--they don't. Are the players asked to vote on what uniforms to wear? Most things in life get decided by people in authority, and if you don't know that there is no helping you. Only Lady Vol fans would get their knickers in a knot over losing an antiquated name and logo in favor of just being the Vols like every other sports program we have. The logo doesn't look very good either. It has been unchanged for a very long time and looks it.

Corn. The student body originally voted on the name and the colors. And, the women's program has used the name Lady Vols for decades. So, the BOT hires a hired gun who is not even a VOL and he gets to decide what their name should be? So, then the next hired gun can change it? Nonsensical.

 

[Smallvol#1]

Corn. The student body originally voted on the name and the colors. And, the women's program has used the name Lady Vols for decades. So, the BOT hires a hired gun who is not even a VOL and he gets to decide what their name should be? So, then the next hired gun can change it? Nonsensical.

Agreed. And the football team has a say in wearing black and smoky grey uniforms. I don't particularly like them, but no problem with that, only seems fair the athletes have a say...it is not academics after all, a very weak argument to attempt and fittingly shot down by Sandvol. And don't forget Smokey...the AD and BOT at that time were smart enough to stay out of the decision making.

 

[LVJeff]

The university and/or athletic department decides what is best for school athletic programs. Should students decide their curricula or what sort of tests they take--they don't. Are the players asked to vote on what uniforms to wear? Most things in life get decided by people in authority, and if you don't know that there is no helping you. Only Lady Vol fans would get their knickers in a knot over losing an antiquated name and logo in favor of just being the Vols like every other sports program we have. The logo doesn't look very good either. It has been unchanged for a very long time and looks it.

You are conflating academic issues with athletic issues in your argument.

Regarding team names, colors, logos, mascots, etc, student bodies have a long history of voting on these.

Regarding your repeated assertions that the name is old and antiquated, again, your opinion about the name isn't relevant. What is relevant is that the athletes involved had no say.

 

[Orange Maniac]

AC seems to think the term Lady just came about in the 1950's when it actually dates all the way back to the year 900. The term is a complimentary term and is something I hope all our female athletes strive to be.

 

[tnburban]

Actually, I am just in favor of everyone coming together under the umbrella of inclusiveness. I'm not sure why you need to be so derogatory and spiteful. I can't fathom raining insults insinuating sexism at someone in favor of elevating the spirit of unity and empowerment.

I feel sorry for the two of you that are so willing to be mean and angry. You will regret being on the wrong side of this sexist history. It's time to progress beyond this isolationism. I hope you will each find peace in your hearts now and when history opposes you.

They remain individuals, and that is signified by a name on the back of most jerseys. Ultimately, they are all representatives of the same Power T that has been decided as the unifying symbol around which to assemble those individuals. It's odd that those wishing to be accepted the most are spending the most time trying to differentiate themselves from the group. I wonder if the Diversity Office could step in and supply some clarity to this situation.

You are not even taking into account that some of these women athletes could be playing in a state of pre-op transgender status based on current NCAA regulations and by-laws. The "lady" terminology is not fair to them. The best thing in this case is the singular Power T logo and Volunteers name. Since we are not ready for non-gender specific pronouns at the University, this creates the greatest comfort zone as far as terminology goes.

You're either a HUGE troll, or completely clueless. I don't care what god people want to worship, or even no god at all. I don't care what their favorite color is, or if they are vegans or love a good steak.

I do care when people try to take basic biology and human anatomy and think it can be "subject to change" based on how they "identify." If that's the case, I identify as a multi-billionaire with properties throughout the world, a fleet of private jets, and the ability to use the force. Is that how it works?

Girls are girls and boys are boys.

 

[Sandvol]

AC seems to think the term Lady just came about in the 1950's when it actually dates all the way back to the year 900. The term is a complimentary term and is something I hope all our female athletes strive to be.

Feminists don't like that term because they say people should be regarded as gender neutral. However, that really isn't it. The ideas of referring to a woman as a "Lady" and also the liberal idea of what a "Modern Woman" should be about, i.e. "Right to Choose" etc., conflicts. Their ideal espouses promiscuity, abortions, career first, latchkey kids, etc. and that ideal doesn't jive with the term "Lady." And, that's what it's all about.

They don't want young women aspiring to be "Ladies."

 

[reverseosmosis]

You're either a HUGE troll, or completely clueless. I don't care what god people want to worship, or even no god at all. I don't care what their favorite color is, or if they are vegans or love a good steak.

I do care when people try to take basic biology and human anatomy and think it can be "subject to change" based on how they "identify." If that's the case, I identify as a multi-billionaire with properties throughout the world, a fleet of private jets, and the ability to use the force. Is that how it works?

Girls are girls and boys are boys.

The NCAA Office of Inclusion August 2011 Inclusion of the Transgender Athlete documentation and guidelines disagrees with you.

 

[Sandvol]

The NCAA Office of Inclusion August 2011 Inclusion of the Transgender Athlete documentation and guidelines disagrees with you.

The NCAA Office of Inclusion....HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

 

[armchair]

"Ladies" is an old, antiquated term--that's a fact. That southerners still like it doesn't change the fact that it is old. The term "lady vols" originated at time when women's sports--or should I say "ladies sports"--when there weren't many women's sports and they were not taken very seriously--hence the term. Have the men's teams ever been identified by their gender? Have they ever been called the "Gentleman Vols"? No, because men's teams were considered the real thing--and the women, well, they were the "ladies team," a curiosity, not to be taken too seriously and requiring a separate identity. "Ladies" is a term that evokes the 1950s and our parents generation, when the women's role was to have babies, cook and go to bridge parties. We don't call them "ladies" teams anymore--they are women's teams.

 

[LVJeff]

"Ladies" is an old, antiquated term--that's a fact. That southerners still like it doesn't change the fact that it is old. The term "lady vols" originated at time when women's sports--or should I say "ladies sports"--when there weren't many women's sports and they were not taken very seriously--hence the term. Have the men's teams ever been identified by their gender? Have they ever been called the "Gentleman Vols"? No, because men's teams were considered the real thing--and the women, well, they were the "ladies team," a curiosity, not to be taken too seriously and requiring a separate identity. "Ladies" is a term that evokes the 1950s and our parents generation, when the women's role was to have babies, cook and go to bridge parties. We don't call them "ladies" teams anymore--they are women's teams.

It doesn't matter to me how old the name is. It doesn't matter whether it's antiquated, used only in the south, not used in the south, originated in the 1950's or 1650's. It matters not what you (or I) think of the name.

What matters to me is that the athletes who are/were called Lady Vol's had no official say in the removal of the name, have voiced their displeasure with the decision, and that the AD lied when he stated he had their full support for the name change. That is all that matters to me.

 

[GameTime]

I'm with the pro Lady Vols group here...
Taking away their name was wrong.

Let's just call the Great Smokey Mountains, the Smokey Mountains, or Orange Country, instead of Big Orange Country.

The name Lady Vols is who they are...