Latest Coronavirus - Yikes

#117,777
#117,777
utvolpj said:
No there's a lot claiming it may work. That's a big difference. Many are still riding on the initial studies that used toxic levels. It wasn't viable in humans. Then the conspiracy talk began.

The critiques are out there but like so many your mind is made up. Hope it works out for you but you may have better luck with consistent exercise and vitamin d
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Which in the analysis are these "many"? Can you find me an example of a peer reviewed study that they include in their analysis that is one of these "many" you speak of?
 
#117,778
#117,778
utvolpj said:
No there's a lot claiming it may work. That's a big difference. Many are still riding on the initial studies that used toxic levels. It wasn't viable in humans. Then the conspiracy talk began.

The critiques are out there but like so many your mind is made up. Hope it works out for you but you may have better luck with consistent exercise and vitamin d
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I know I'm kind of jumping in here but I'm sure by now you know my stance on this and this might be a good place for me to explain my strong opinion on Ivermectin and a few other treatments that work. My opinion is based off of conversations with a local doctor that I go to church with who has treated many many patients with Ivermectin and not had a single payient die when treatment was administerd early. He says it is absolutely criminal how early treatment has been suppressed and discouraged by many. He is one of a few local doctors who use it. I take what I see in real life and I feel like this can be applied everywhere.
 
#117,779
#117,779
VolinWayne said:
I know I'm kind of jumping in here but I'm sure by now you know my stance on this and this might be a good place for me to explain my strong opinion on Ivermectin and a few other treatments that work. My opinion is based off of conversations with a local doctor that I go to church with who has treated many many patients with Ivermectin and not had a single payient die when treatment was administerd early. He says it is absolutely criminal how early treatment has been suppressed and discouraged by many. He is one of a few local doctors who use it. I take what I see in real life and I feel like this can be applied everywhere.
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One doctor. How many doctors have conflicting information? The fact they took it and didn't die didn't mean that ivermectin was the reason
 
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#117,780
#117,780
VolinWayne said:
I know I'm kind of jumping in here but I'm sure by now you know my stance on this and this might be a good place for me to explain my strong opinion on Ivermectin and a few other treatments that work. My opinion is based off of conversations with a local doctor that I go to church with who has treated many many patients with Ivermectin and not had a single payient die when treatment was administerd early. He says it is absolutely criminal how early treatment has been suppressed and discouraged by many. He is one of a few local doctors who use it. I take what I see in real life and I feel like this can be applied everywhere.
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You're very keyed into this one study that seems to confirm your already held belief. There are many peer reviewed studies out showing that it is at best minimally more effective than a placebo against covid yet you ignore them as well. It just looks like your mind is made up. Good luck
 
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#117,783
#117,783
Velo Vol said:
Why is that? If a treatment really worked, why would nearly the entire medical community suppress it? What motive do thousands and thousands of doctors have to do so?
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You ask for motive. Money maybe??? Hospitals have been incentivized to mark deaths as COVID deaths, even in cases where it may not be the primary cause of death. Hospitals were paid $13,000 per person who was admitted as a COVID case, and another $39,000 for every patient put on a ventilator. I've also seen claims where hospitals were also being paid an additional $37,000 for every covid death. I hope this last claim is bogus but this would not surprise me. In case you haven't figured it out yet, we live in a world where evil exists. Money and greed causes people to do some crasy things. Whether or not this actually got misused we may never know for sure but there would definitely be motive there and evil people do exist.
 
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#117,784
#117,784
VolinWayne said:
You ask for motive. Money maybe??? Hospitals have been incentivized to mark deaths as COVID deaths, even in cases where it may not be the primary cause of death. Hospitals were paid $13,000 per person who was admitted as a COVID case, and another $39,000 for every patient put on a ventilator. I've also seen claims where hospitals were also being paid an additional $37,000 for every covid death. I hope this last claim is bogus but this would not surprise me. In case you haven't figured it out yet, we live in a world where evil exists. Money and greed causes people to do some crasy things. Whether or not this actually got misused we may never know for sure but there would definitely be motive there and evil people do exist.
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it likely costs a lot more to treat covid patients

If I go to the hospital that money doesn't funnel down to my general dr. What's his incentive or motive?
 
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#117,785
#117,785
Velo Vol said:
Why is that? If a treatment really worked, why would nearly the entire medical community suppress it? What motive do thousands and thousands of doctors have to do so?
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Why were treatments like Remdrsivir approved and encouraged openly when they were proven not to work and were actually much less safe than something like ivermectin?
 
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#117,786
#117,786
utvolpj said:
it likely costs a lot more to treat covid patients

If I go to the hospital that money doesn't funnel down to my general dr. What's his incentive or motive?
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Maybe he heard that it's horse paste and doesn't even want to consider it. Or maybe his insurance company won't let him prescribe a drug that hasn't been approved by the fda for off label use.
 
#117,790
#117,790
utvolpj said:
it likely costs a lot more to treat covid patients

If I go to the hospital that money doesn't funnel down to my general dr. What's his incentive or motive?
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The only motive there should be for a doctor is saving lives. If the protocols and treatments they are using is not working they should be willing to think outside the box and try other treatments.
 
#117,791
#117,791
VolinWayne said:
The only motive there should be for a doctor is saving lives. If the protocols and treatments they are using is not working they should be willing to think outside the box and try other treatments.
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Sure but that doesn't answer the question posed. How does my gp benefit from not prescribing meds that would save my life?

You don't think he would gladly hand me a pill that would keep me from getting covid? Just because a hospital spend more treating a covid patient?
 
#117,793
#117,793
utvolpj said:
No there's a lot claiming it may work. That's a big difference. Many are still riding on the initial studies that used toxic levels. It wasn't viable in humans. Then the conspiracy talk began.

The critiques are out there but like so many your mind is made up. Hope it works out for you but you may have better luck with consistent exercise and vitamin d
Click to expand...

Are you citing the "Together trial" as one of these critiques? That is the most recent trial that the media is using as a baseball bat to bash people over the head with statements along the lines of "Ivermectin is found to be useless against covid". Ed Mills (one of the two principal investigators of the Together Trial) is not nearly as convinced as you seem to be that Ivermectin doesn't work. He went into the trial as a skeptic of Ivermectin. Since the study was concluded he has changed his tune. Did you happen to see his email (private at the time, but released by himself and the recipient voluntarily to the public) to endocrinologist Dr. Marc Rendell?

Here are his own words:

"I don’t understand the psychology of the ivermectin advocates. They fail to see the positive in this study and just focus on it not being overwhelmingly positive. I actually think it is quite positive.
I presented this a couple weeks ago at the NIH Collaboratory Rounds and, if they listened, I advocate that actually, there is a clear signal that IVM works in COVID patients, just that our study didn’t achieve significance. In particular, there was a 17% reduction in hospitalizations that would be significant if more patients were added. I really don’t view our study as negative and, also in that talk, you will hear me retract previous statements where I had been previously negative. I think if we had continued randomizing a few hundred more patients, it would have likely been significant"

Basically, he is saying the exact opposite of what the entire media are reporting about his own trial. There are clear signals that it works, even at the incredibly low dosage, late stage, and short three day course that his trial provided.
 
#117,794
#117,794
utvolpj said:
Sure but that doesn't answer the question posed. How does my gp benefit from not prescribing meds that would save my life?

You don't think he would gladly hand me a pill that would keep me from getting covid? Just because a hospital spend more treating a covid patient?
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I am sure none of these hospitals ever mention profitability, or include it in their reviews, bonuses or what have you, when discussing with their GPs. Insurance never comes up. There are a dozen ways money can still be a force even if it never directly hits the doctors wallet.
 
#117,797
#117,797
LouderVol said:
I am sure none of these hospitals ever mention profitability, or include it in their reviews, bonuses or what have you, when discussing with their GPs. Insurance never comes up. There are a dozen ways money can still be a force even if it never directly hits the doctors wallet.
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It's one of the main conspiracy theories though. Hospitals make more treating cancer than they do a broken wrist. Conspiracy!

I have a very hard time believing very many doctors would choose their bonus over saving their patients lives. I know my doctor and I discussed early on the fact it was likely man made/manipulated. It's not like he was afraid to go into that territory
 
#117,800
#117,800
utvolpj said:
I have a very hard time believing very many doctors would choose their bonus over saving their patients lives. I know my doctor and I discussed early on the fact it was likely man made/manipulated. It's not like he was afraid to go into that territory
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When assessing any claimed conspiracy, ask yourself how many people would have to be in complete agreement to make it happen, and why.

Usually they fall apart to such scrutiny.
 
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