Louis Freeh releasing statement on ESPN now On Sandusky

#26
#26
TXA&M07 said:
I'll add that I only suggest the Death Penalty from an emotional standpoint. Legally, the Athletic Dept, namely the Football program, will most likely not be punished by the NCAA. That may be hard to fathom for some, but legally speaking, I'm most certain thats the right call.
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Good post
 
#28
#28
OrangeBalls said:
The death penatly would hurt the university's pockets for sure, but the fans, players and other coaches who had nothing to do with it would end paying the price for the sins of the former regime. That is what sucks about that kind of punishment. That is why no one should ever be allowed to have that much power and control. It usually ends up ending badly.
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It's a tough one.

Give them the death penalty. If the kids want to stay at Penn State, they get to keep their schollies. If not, they can transfer to another and play immediately. I think that's fair.
 
#29
#29
TXA&M07 said:
I'll add that I only suggest the Death Penalty from an emotional standpoint. Legally, the Athletic Dept, namely the Football program, will most likely not be punished by the NCAA. That may be hard to fathom for some, but legally speaking, I'm most certain thats the right call.
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You think NCAA will decide not to punish or you think NCAA does not have legal ability to punish? If the latter, why not?
 
#30
#30
The criminal in this matter has already been prosecuted and sentenced. The remiander of those responsible for the cover up of this have either been dismissed from the University or deceased. One in particular is both.

The matter as far as the legal process has been resolved. The Athletic Dept should not suffer any sanctions.

Not that it lessens the severity of this mushroom cloud, but the court of public opinon will punish that football program. The NCAA does not have any further jurisdiction on the matter and rightfully so.

Its time for the new regime to move forward as best they can.
 
#31
#31
vols4sure said:
You think NCAA will decide not to punish or you think NCAA does not have legal ability to punish? If the latter, why not?
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Idont think they have a choice to rule or not to rule against them any further. They govern college athletics, not the State of P.A.

It was a state matter that occured on a campus. Campus authorities addressed the matter as did the state prosecuters.

The NCAA legally has no further say in the matter.

They're pretty powerful, but they need not be considered on the same level as a State Governing body.
 
#32
#32
To put it plainly:

Cheating/Paying players/throwing games/ - NCAA issue

Rapping young boys anywhere - State Issue

(regardless of who the perp is and where the crime takes place)
 
#33
#33
TXA&M07 said:
The criminal in this matter has already been prosecuted and sentenced. The remiander of those responsible for the cover up of this have either been dismissed from the University or deceased. One in particular is both.

The matter as far as the legal process has been resolved. The Athletic Dept should not suffer any sanctions.

Not that it lessens the severity of this mushroom cloud, but the court of public opinon will punish that football program. The NCAA does not have any further jurisdiction on the matter and rightfully so.

Its time for the new regime to move forward as best they can.
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I agree. It's a very sad situation and it doesn't really matter if the NCAA punishes them or not because the public will. You'll never be able to think about Penn State and not remember this too, regardless of the accomplishment any of their sports teams achieve.
 
#34
#34
zjcvols said:
It's a tough one.

Give them the death penalty. If the kids want to stay at Penn State, they get to keep their schollies. If not, they can transfer to another and play immediately. I think that's fair.
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Part of the death penalty is that the NCAA allows student-athletes of all years to transfer without penalty (with the normal case being having to sit a year), and also allowing other schools to call/contact/recruit all the kids (might even be able to do so on campus)...
 
#35
#35
OrangeBalls said:
The death penatly would hurt the university's pockets for sure, but the fans, players and other coaches who had nothing to do with it would end paying the price for the sins of the former regime. That is what sucks about that kind of punishment. That is why no one should ever be allowed to have that much power and control. It usually ends up ending badly.
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This. Not only that, but everybody else in the Big Ten would pay the price for losing that game, holders of TV rights, so on and so forth.

TXA&M07 said:
The criminal in this matter has already been prosecuted and sentenced. The remiander of those responsible for the cover up of this have either been dismissed from the University or deceased. One in particular is both.

The matter as far as the legal process has been resolved. The Athletic Dept should not suffer any sanctions.

Not that it lessens the severity of this mushroom cloud, but the court of public opinon will punish that football program. The NCAA does not have any further jurisdiction on the matter and rightfully so.

Its time for the new regime to move forward as best they can.
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This is how I see it. Also kinda plays in with my view that NCAA penalties should punish guilty parties, not the programs and universities with which they were associated. Too many times have coaches, players and administrators paid the price for the wrongdoings of others who walk away (not in this particular case, but you get the idea).
 
#36
#36
TrueOrange said:
Part of the death penalty is that the NCAA allows student-athletes of all years to transfer without penalty (with the normal case being having to sit a year), and also allowing other schools to call/contact/recruit all the kids (might even be able to do so on campus)...
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Then do it.
 
#37
#37
TXA&M07 said:
The criminal in this matter has already been prosecuted and sentenced. The remiander of those responsible for the cover up of this have either been dismissed from the University or deceased. One in particular is both.

The matter as far as the legal process has been resolved. The Athletic Dept should not suffer any sanctions.

Not that it lessens the severity of this mushroom cloud, but the court of public opinon will punish that football program. The NCAA does not have any further jurisdiction on the matter and rightfully so.

Its time for the new regime to move forward as best they can.
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Also good post
 
#38
#38
milohimself said:
This. Not only that, but everybody else in the Big Ten would pay the price for losing that game, holders of TV rights, so on and so forth.


This is how I see it. Also kinda plays in with my view that NCAA penalties should punish guilty parties, not the programs and universities with which they were associated. Too many times have coaches, players and administrators paid the price for the wrongdoings of others who walk away (not in this particular case, but you get the idea).
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Agree
 
#39
#39
TXA&M07 said:
Idont think they have a choice to rule or not to rule against them any further. They govern college athletics, not the State of P.A.

It was a state matter that occured on a campus. Campus authorities addressed the matter as did the state prosecuters.

The NCAA legally has no further say in the matter.

They're pretty powerful, but they need not be considered on the same level as a State Governing body.
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also good one (sorry can't like posts from my phone)
 
#40
#40
TXA&M07 said:
Idont think they have a choice to rule or not to rule against them any further. They govern college athletics, not the State of P.A.

It was a state matter that occured on a campus. Campus authorities addressed the matter as did the state prosecuters.

The NCAA legally has no further say in the matter.

They're pretty powerful, but they need not be considered on the same level as a State Governing body.
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Thanks for the explanation, but I completely disagree. the NCAA has and should have the right to punish a member institution for covering widespread corruption and fostering an environment that allowed known criminal activity to continue. The athletic department harbored a known serial child rapist and allowed him to continue to use their facilities to rape additional boys. How can they not be punished?
 
#41
#41
vols4sure said:
Thanks for the explanation, but I completely disagree. the NCAA has and should have the right to punish a member institution for covering widespread corruption and fostering an environment that allowed known criminal activity to continue. The athletic department harbored a known serial child rapist and allowed him to continue to use their facilities to rape additional boys. How can they not be punished?
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That's debatable. There is an ethics clause, but it has never been applied in cases that don't deal with a violation of NCAA rules.
 
#42
#42
vols4sure said:
Thanks for the explanation, but I completely disagree. the NCAA has and should have the right to punish a member institution for covering widespread corruption and fostering an environment that allowed known criminal activity to continue. The athletic department harbored a known serial child rapist and allowed him to continue to use their facilities to rape additional boys. How can they not be punished?
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No, the Athletic Department didn't.

The people who worked within the Athletic Department did, and all those people concerned in this issue are either dead or (hopefully) being addressed by the legal system.

The death penalty or additional sanctions at this point would do 100% of the harm solely to people who had no involvement in this issue whatsoever, and have zero effect on the people who are actually guilty, as every single one of them are no longer affiliated with Penn State.

Additionally, IMO, I don't think the NCAA should have anything to do with criminal justice... This is why we have a criminal justice system to begin with. If the issue doesn't concern academics or competition, then the 'AA shouldn't be concerned with it.
 
#43
#43
milohimself said:
The death penalty or additional sanctions at this point would do 100% of the harm solely to people who had no involvement in this issue whatsoever, and have zero effect on the people who are actually guilty, as every single one of them are no longer affiliated with Penn State.
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Agree.

And it's these same people who did nothing to cover up for Sandusky that should expunge Paterno's name from their program. They did nothing, but continuing to honor a man who covered up for a pedophile is unacceptable.
 
#44
#44
bamawriter said:
Agree.

And it's these same people who did nothing to cover up for Sandusky that should expunge Paterno's name from their program. They did nothing, but continuing to honor a man who covered up for a pedophile is unacceptable.
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Well... That's up to them, it's in extremely poor taste, but it's their school.
 
#46
#46
milohimself said:
Additionally, IMO, I don't think the NCAA should have anything to do with criminal justice... This is why we have a criminal justice system to begin with. If the issue doesn't concern academics or competition, then the 'AA shouldn't be concerned with it.
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How does it not concern both academics and competition when the President, AD, head coach, and many others were all involved in the cover up. Don't you think a child abuse scandal would be much worse to PSU than recruiting violations. That is why they covered it up. They did not want it to tarnish their university or football program. As a result, no telling how many additional children were sexually assaulted.

I just don't understand how people can say, lets just let PSU go on there merry way like nothing ever happened. If this happened at UT, you can guarantee I would never step foot in Neyland Stadium again unless the school itself imposed a multi-year ban. Even then, I do not know if I would ever be able to cheer for my alma mater again.
 
#47
#47
4sure,

No one is saying that Penn State shouldn't sanction themselves. Some of us are simply saying the NCAA should stay out. And I'm with you on the idea that if this was Alabama, I'd have a tough time ever buying another ticket.
 
#48
#48
vols4sure said:
How does it not concern both academics and competition when the President, AD, head coach, and many others were all involved in the cover up. Don't you think a child abuse scandal would be much worse to PSU than recruiting violations. That is why they covered it up. They did not want it to tarnish their university or football program. As a result, no telling how many additional children were sexually assaulted.

I just don't understand how people can say, lets just let PSU go on there merry way like nothing ever happened. If this happened at UT, you can guarantee I would never step foot in Neyland Stadium again unless the school itself imposed a multi-year ban. Even then, I do not know if I would ever be able to cheer for my alma mater again.
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I see where you're coming from, but again, this was entirely a criminal matter where the guilty parties happened to work for a particular university.

The school and the program are already paying the piper, and the bottom line is still that any further punishment only hurts people who had nothing to do with this and has zero effect on those who are actually guilty.
 
#49
#49
The moral dellimma left to the School is just that, left to the school. The legalities of this case have been served due process. The NCAA should not govern as a figure of authority higher than that of our judicial system. Had their rules been violated, they'd have grounds, however, the facts of this reached a limit that exceeded their jurisdiction.

I'd also say that terminating the football program in any way, be it from the instituition or the NCAA (which I'll still argue would be a groce abuse of power) would only punish those that are innocent and left in the wake of the actions of a few folks. Folks that have been punished mind you.

Let them play. They'll heal over time. Hopefully the families will too, which should be at the forefront of everyone's mind to begin with.
 
#50
#50
My apologies for essentially re-stating exactly what Milo said previously. Excellent point Milo.
 
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