Martin Offense vs Pearl Offense

#26
#26
Best I remember, most of Pearl's offensive sets were geared towards the 'flex' offense. As many have said, us fans weren't real happy with it either...mainly because we would spend 25 - 30 seconds running baseline flex cuts, while our guards would never look to make the pass to the cutters. Then we'd depend on Lofton (or others) to bail us out as the shot clock wound down.
Martin's hanging his hat on the 'motion' offense.

Bottom line, imo, is that good coaches can win with either offensive system. The other intangibles (motivation, ability to adjust, defensive principles, etc) are what makes or breaks a coach.
 
#29
#29
Oh, don't be so hard on Cuonzo.
He got us to the NIT last year didn't he?
I'm confident he can do it again.

Well, the schedule does looke easier. We don't have to worry bout any barn burners with LMU this year.
 
#31
#31
Lol not in the SEC! Gotta be pro style!

The SEC sucks. We out-talented a lot of teams in 07-08 but got boat raced when it mattered. Pearl's major success came when he transitioned to a halfcourt game. They were running it tremendously from 2009 up to December 2010, when everything crashed.
 
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#32
#32
The SEC sucks. We out-talented a lot of teams in 07-08 but got boat raced when it mattered. Pearl's major success came when he transitioned to a halfcourt game. They were running it tremendously from 2009 up to December 2010, when everything crashed.

Thats not even close to accurate....our best season was 2007 when we won 30+ games, was number one and beat the number one team in the country on the road. We would have been in the elite eight if we had not blown a 20 point lead to eventual runner up Ohio state.

Pearl was really good at adapting and figuring out how to win with the talent we had on hand. If it was run and gun which he preferred we could win that way. If our guys couldnt play fast, he could win that way as well.
 
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#33
#33
Thats not even close to accurate....our best season was 2007 when we won 30+ games, was number one and beat the number one team in the country on the road. We would have been in the elite eight if we had not blown a 20 point lead to eventual runner up Ohio state.

Pearl was really good at adapting and figuring out how to win with the talent we had on hand. If it was run and gun which he preferred we could win that way. If our guys couldnt play fast, he could win that way as well.

This is accurate I think. Pearl's offense got VERY ugly (as ugly as the Martin era) his last year. I think he spent a lot more time trying to figure out how to get out of his mess than he spent coaching.
 
#35
#35
love revisionist history.

The last 3 years of Pearl's tenure people constantly complained about 25 seconds of baseline flex cuts and then jacking a shot.

Granted Pearl still won, but it's not like he is an offensive geniuous

A post of yours I agree with, never thought I'd see the day.

It's the old, the grass is always greener. I remember the constant complaints about pearls offense, now that he's gone he was some sort of John wooden.
 
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#39
#39
love revisionist history.

The last 3 years of Pearl's tenure people constantly complained about 25 seconds of baseline flex cuts and then jacking a shot.

Granted Pearl still won, but it's not like he is an offensive geniuous

Fair enough. But you said genius, I didn't. Actually you said geniuous??? but I got the gist. :)
 
#41
#41
A post of yours I agree with, never thought I'd see the day.

It's the old, the grass is always greener. I remember the constant complaints about pearls offense, now that he's gone he was some sort of John wooden.

Pearl IS John Wooden compared to Cuonzo. And Pearl's flex offense scored more points than Cuonzo's offense (on average of course).

Give it up, Cuonzo is not as good a coach as Bruce. Bruce isn't coming back, but the grass was so much greener when he was here.
 
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#42
#42
If you didn't catch it I'm not surprised

If people actually believe you were using sarcasm I'll be surprised. You just got through saying that people don't remember the bad times with Pearl and you constantly pump up Cuonzo. There was no sarcasm, you're just trying to cover your ridiculous comparison up.
 
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#43
#43
Pearl IS John Wooden compared to Cuonzo. And Pearl's flex offense scored more points than Cuonzo's offense (on average of course).

Give it up, Cuonzo is not as good a coach as Bruce. Bruce isn't coming back, but the grass was so much greener when he was here.

I've never said the contrary to anything you just said.
 
#44
#44
Pearl's first 11 games that year averaged 73.7ppg and included wins over #7 Villanova and #3 Pittsburgh. Please.

The year before Pearl still only averaged 73.5 per game. His teams also gave up more points than any Martin team. People hated Bruce's o the last few years. Now everyone wants to act like he scored 100 a game. If we couldn't score in transition his half court o was worse than Martin's.
 
#45
#45
Pearl IS John Wooden compared to Cuonzo. And Pearl's flex offense scored more points than Cuonzo's offense (on average of course).

Give it up, Cuonzo is not as good a coach as Bruce. Bruce isn't coming back, but the grass was so much greener when he was here.

Major Wingate approves this message.
 
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#47
#47
Like others have said, Martin runs a motion offense. The term "motion" offense is thrown around loosely in the basketball world. I have coached/played against many teams that call "motion," but what they're actually running is a structured continuity offense with the same cutting and screening action that you could run from now until the end of time. A true motion offense, whether it's 5 out, 4 around 1, or 3 around 2, is not patterned or structured. Most motion coaches have a few rules within the offense, for example, one rule might be on every post-entry the ballside wing will Laker cut off the post to prevent a quick dig or help from the closest defender. Also, motion coaches often use set plays that flow into motion if they're looking to get a specific action, or they'll run a set in late-clock situations. However, true motion offense is predicated on a number of different cutting and screening options the players are given, and those are determined by how many layers or rules a coach uses to build his offense, as well as, how much the players can retain. If taught and ran effectively a motion offense is extremely hard to guard because it teaches kids how to play instead of what the play is, and it's virtually impossible to scout as opposed to set plays or a base continuity offense. Yet, when I have a chance to watch Tennessee play their struggles are much the same as other motion teams, or any team that struggles offensively for that matter. They screen space, they come off screens lethargically, they don't set-up cuts or cut hard, they ball watch and spectate, and as a result they become stagnant. It doesn't matter what you run, if you don't have great attention to detail regarding the little things within an offense and play with a sense of urgency you won't be effective. That's where Pearl made a difference. I realize coaches are evaluated by their win-loss record, and Pearl certainly got it done in that regard. However, from a basketball standpoint, he was far from a schematic genius. He was a fantastic motivator/salesman. His teams played with relentless effort, great energy, and a sense of urgency, which is why they won. One of the greatest basketball minds I've ever known once told me,"there's a lot of different ways to get to town," and Pearl certainly had his, but it wasn't due to his extensive knowledge of the game. With that said, Pearl was a perfect fit for Tennessee basketball. Especially in his early years when they played in a chaotic scramble, and generated most of their offense off turnovers and in transition. He captivated the fanbase with his energy, and his team's energy. The times I saw him speak it was easy to see why people loved him. Ultimately, I'm not clamoring for one over another, but a coach's job is much easier when he doesn't have to constantly coach effort. That's what Martin is up against now. Pearl was a master at it, and that's why he's beloved.
 
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#48
#48
For all you Pearlites, he is not coming back. Get over it. You will have to get Jimmy Cheek to leave first. We will continue our mediocrity in BB for a while. Keep Cuonzo and we still remain in this state (of being). Fire Cuonzo and we get set back until a new coach would come in and get his program settled. Hopefully Cuonzo can get things turned around for the remaining season. Very unlikely, though.
 
#49
#49
Thats not even close to accurate....our best season was 2007 when we won 30+ games, was number one and beat the number one team in the country on the road. We would have been in the elite eight if we had not blown a 20 point lead to eventual runner up Ohio state.

Pearl was really good at adapting and figuring out how to win with the talent we had on hand. If it was run and gun which he preferred we could win that way. If our guys couldnt play fast, he could win that way as well.

If he preferred it, then why did he recruit personnel that couldn't run it? His last two rosters were perfectly tailored to a halfcourt style.

No, we got destroyed by Louisville that year.
 
#50
#50
Like others have said, Martin runs a motion offense. The term "motion" offense is thrown around loosely in the basketball world. I have coached/played against many teams that call "motion," but what they're actually running is a structured continuity offense with the same cutting and screening action that you could run from now until the end of time. A true motion offense, whether it's 5 out, 4 around 1, or 3 around 2, is not patterned or structured. Most motion coaches have a few rules within the offense, for example, one rule might be on every post-entry the ballside wing will Laker cut off the post to prevent a quick dig or help from the closest defender. Also, motion coaches often use set plays that flow into motion if they're looking to get a specific action, or they'll run a set in late-clock situations. However, true motion offense is predicated on a number of different cutting and screening options the players are given, and those are determined by how many layers or rules a coach uses to build his offense, as well as, how much the players can retain. If taught and ran effectively a motion offense is extremely hard to guard because it teaches kids how to play instead of what the play is, and it's virtually impossible to scout as opposed to set plays or a base continuity offense. Yet, when I have a chance to watch Tennessee play their struggles are much the same as other motion teams, or any team that struggles offensively for that matter. They screen space, they come off screens lethargically, they don't set-up cuts or cut hard, they ball watch and spectate, and as a result they become stagnant. It doesn't matter what you run, if you don't have great attention to detail regarding the little things within an offense and play with a sense of urgency you won't be effective. That's where Pearl made a difference. I realize coaches are evaluated by their win-loss record, and Pearl certainly got it done in that regard. However, from a basketball standpoint, he was far from a schematic genius. He was a fantastic motivator/salesman. His teams played with relentless effort, great energy, and a sense of urgency, which is why they won. One of the greatest basketball minds I've ever known once told me,"there's a lot of different ways to get to town," and Pearl certainly had his, but it wasn't due to his extensive knowledge of the game. With that said, Pearl was a perfect fit for Tennessee basketball. Especially in his early years when they played in a chaotic scramble, and generated most of their offense off turnovers and in transition. He captivated the fanbase with his energy, and his team's energy. The times I saw him speak it was easy to see why people loved him. Ultimately, I'm not clamoring for one over another, but a coach's job is much easier when he doesn't have to constantly coach effort. That's what Martin is up against now. Pearl was a master at it, and that's why he's beloved.

Nice post, this is what I've been waiting to see. A true breakdown of what a motion offense is supposed to be, as opposed to meaningless, hand picked stats. The reason it's not effective here is because of Martins lack of energy and lack of aggressiveness being instilled into his players. As stated, the reason Pearls teams played so aggressively, was due to his personality being instilled into his players. While Pearl may not have been a half court schematic genius, his teams effort and aggressiveness made up for it. Teams always take on the personality of their coach, and this is why Martin has come up short, while Pearl continuously overachieved.
 
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