Medicare and Social Security in big trouble

#126
#126
evillawyer said:
I agree. I love people dying of preventable conditions.
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"Preventable conditions" frequently have to do with lifestyle and personal decisions. Socialized medicine simply removes a layer in personal responsibility for one's own health.

We know the relationship between smoking and cancer and heart disease, but when has that ever stopped someone who ignores personal responsibility. We know the relationship between impaired driving and broken bodies, but when has that stopped irresponsible people?
 
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#129
#129
AM64 said:
Amazing how some people are gullible enough to think government bureaucrats can do anything other than waste better than the private sector, or that adding a bureaucratic layer and farming out the work to the private sector is more cost efficient. Half our problems are created by government bureaucracies running roughshod over everything as it is.
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Plenty of governments do it better than our private sector. We're ranked somewhere in the mid 30s for healthcare the last time I checked.
 
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#130
#130
evillawyer said:
Plenty of governments do it better than our private sector. We're ranked somewhere in the mid 30s for healthcare the last time I checked.
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Keep dreaming that impossible dream. Rankings are made from "statistics". Statistics are made of decisions about how to measure; therefore, the outcome on an unquantifiable and unmeasurable will always be determined by the rules that decide what the outcome should show.

Countries that still have more people not sitting at a desk all day will probably have better qualities of life due to physical exertion rather than socialized medicine. Same with countries that work more (manual labor) vs those that afford more leisure time for recreational drugs etc.
 
#131
#131
AM64 said:
Keep dreaming that impossible dream. Rankings are made from "statistics". Statistics are made of decisions about how to measure; therefore, the outcome on an unquantifiable and unmeasurable will always be determined by the rules that decide what the outcome should show.

Countries that still have more people not sitting at a desk all day will probably have better qualities of life due to physical exertion rather than socialized medicine. Same with countries that work more (manual labor) vs those that afford more leisure time for recreational drugs etc.
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What?
 
#132
#132
evillawyer said:
What?
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OK. More simple for you. Ever think that the countries rated above the US for things like longevity benefit more from work ethic and lack of sloth more than socialized medicine? Of course, to a lib it has to be socialized medicine - they have it, we don't; and, well, we are beyond manual labor - college for all.
 
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#133
#133
AM64 said:
OK. More simple for you. Ever think that the countries rated above the US for things like longevity benefit more from work ethic and lack of sloth more than socialized medicine? Of course, to a lib it has to be socialized medicine - they have it, we don't; and, well, we are beyond manual labor - college for all.
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I'm talking about healthcare systems, not longevity. Those systems are analyzed and ranked across a variety of metrics. The US historically does not do well on those and countries with nationalized healthcare do better than we do. Is that really something that's up for debate?
 
#134
#134
evillawyer said:
I'm talking about healthcare systems, not longevity. Those systems are analyzed and ranked across a variety of metrics. The US historically does not do well on those and countries with nationalized healthcare do better than we do. Is that really something that's up for debate?
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Yes, and the first number most studies use is lifespan - probably followed by infant mortality. Both are highly influenced by lifestyle - how you live and what you don't choose to put into your body.

As long has we have a huge welfare crowd and too much aggregate leisure time, both longevity and infant mortality are going to take a hit. But libs will attribute the difference to socialized healthcare.

What you won't do is attribute the "affordability of medicines" to the fact that the US is subsidizing the ultra low drug costs elsewhere. That is something that we do need to get a handle on.
 
#136
#136
evillawyer said:
I'm talking about healthcare systems, not longevity. Those systems are analyzed and ranked across a variety of metrics. The US historically does not do well on those and countries with nationalized healthcare do better than we do. Is that really something that's up for debate?
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Anytime the healthcare system can/does make the decisions for you, it isn't better. the "universality" of them is also a plain lie as well. In most EU countries, smoking, being out of shape, or doing too much of "something" can disqualify you from coverage. oh yeah also you have to let your baby die because the .gov says so, lololol. and they are still broke.
 
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#137
#137
hog88 said:
You have the keys to the candy store, a jet is attainable.
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Lol, maybe if I was a cash pay cosmetic surgeon. No, I have to rely on insurance companies actually paying me, which is not always guaranteed. Of course, there's always insurance fraud, but I'm not keen on retiring to the federal prison system.
 
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#138
#138
Vol8188 said:
lol we can’t afford it for some, let’s guarantee it to all
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It will SAVE money, ok? $5k back in your pocket. Well I mean maybe a little less if you’re one of the people paying more income tax or you own a business. But otherwise, $5k. And free healthcare! It’s a can’t miss idea.
 
#139
#139
evillawyer said:
I agree. I love people dying of preventable conditions.
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People die of preventable conditions because they fill their gullets with soda and fast food like it’s their last day on earth. Then say they have a thyroid problem. What’s that got to do with healthcare?
 
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#143
#143
1972 Grad said:
We didn't have it for the first couple hundred years. It's a fairly recent phenomenon.
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I’ve noticed the pro Europe crowd seems to conveniently gloss over the fact that Europe is quite segregated ethnically. On the whole they aren’t super into other races or ethnic groups, sort of the reason they have warred themselves into their current states. It will be interesting to see how their socialist notions change with the massive influx of immigrants from Africa and Asia minor.
 
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#144
#144
DancingOutlaw said:
I’ve noticed the pro Europe crowd seems to conveniently gloss over the fact that Europe is quite segregated ethnically. On the whole they aren’t super into other races or ethnic groups, sort of the reason they have warred themselves into their current states. It will be interesting to see how their socialist notions change with the massive influx of immigrants from Africa and Asia minor.
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Yep. Unlike the US,Europe is quite homogenous although that is changing rapidly and I don't think it will turn out well. Their life expectancy will likely decrease and infant mortality rise. Anyone who says that the US healthcare is lagging behind European countries in healthcare hasn't compared the post - operation success and volume of surgeries done in the US.
 
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#147
#147
1972 Grad said:
I think that was the beginning. The hippie movement began the death knell.
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Hippies = Kids (some of very advanced age) who thought they were entitled to think for themselves before learning and understanding how things actually work - probably not so different from millennials.
 
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#150
#150
LouderVol said:
What? A ponzi scheme doesnt actually have enough money to pay out to everyone who put in?

Maybe there is a reason they are considered illegal for everyone but the government.
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of particular interest is that the funds are built on IOUs from other parts of the government that are increasingly underwater.
 
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