Military struggling to meet quota.

#51
#51
n_huffhines said:
It's always war time, LOL.

I believe it was easier to recruit in 2004 than it is now. Just seems like common sense. But after 20 years of bad results, you'd think people would wise up. My Dad was trying to get me to join the military in 2000. I highly doubt he would do that with an 18 YO son at this point, and it has nothing to do with the woke state of the military. In fact, I am almost positive he didn't broach the topic with my brother, who is 7 years younger than me.

Unfortunately, there is no data that accurately measures how easy it is to recruit. I can see enlistment is down, basically year over year, for a while, but enlistment doesn't tell us a whole lot.
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My son graduated HS in 2008, he had an opportunity to get into the Navy nuclear program which I encouraged him to do. If he had come to me and asked about following my footsteps into the Army I would have actively discouraged that decision. I recently advised a friend's son who wanted to join and go airborne infantry to find something else.

I can understand (somewhat) kids being not wanting to join and go into combat arms branches but with the highly technical fields the military offers I see it as a problem that they aren't filling those slots.
 
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#55
#55
hog88 said:
Our military could be reduced but that is a different subject. What we're seeing now is the results of feckless and incompetent leadership at the top of the CoC all the way to the CiC coupled with a generation of kids raised by video games, social media and television.
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Yes Timmy bullets do really hurt.
 
#56
#56
happy-go_vol said:
Why is the U.S. military struggling to recruit young Americans?
Why join the military, they'll call you a racist because white and don't tell them you're a conservative or an nra member. You'll be branded an extremist.
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Yep over the years the vast majority of US enlisted personal likely came from Conservative/rural states across the South or Midwest. Then in comes a new administration where everyone from the President down through the Secretary of Defense to the head of the Joint Chiefs says those people are basically the enemy. They then begin pushing a woke all inclusive regime of transgenderism and pronouns etc... pushing out people who preferred a more traditional United States Military.
 
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#60
#60
I recently finished reading "The Chosen Few", it's about the 2007-2008 deployment of C company 2/503 Airborne 173rd Airborne regiment to Afghanistan. They fought some of the bloodiest battles of the entire Afghanistan war during their 15 month deployment. What struck and infuriated me throughout the book is the number of times the various levels of command from platoon leaders, the company commander up to the battalion commander ignored the concerns and advice from their senior NCOs.

In the end C company had 9 or 10 KIAs and multiple WIAs during their 15 months in Afghanistan. 2 separate boards of inquiry recommended letters of reprimand for the battalion and company commander for feckless and incompetent leadership yet none were ever issued. In fact all were awarded medals and promoted. This is one of the main problems with our military (at least the Army) and it has to effect recruiting. When officers are rewarded for spending their soldiers lives in order to advance their careers you're going to have retention and recruiting problems.
 
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#61
#61
hog88 said:
I recently finished reading "The Chosen Few", it's about the 2007-2008 deployment of C company 2/503 Airborne 173rd Airborne regiment to Afghanistan. They fought some of the bloodiest battles of the entire Afghanistan war during their 15 month deployment. What struck and infuriated me throughout the book is the number of times the various levels of command from platoon leaders, the company commander up to the battalion commander ignored the concerns and advice from their senior NCOs.

In the end C company had 9 or 10 KIAs and multiple WIAs during their 15 months in Afghanistan. 2 separate boards of inquiry recommended letters of reprimand for the battalion and company commander for feckless and incompetent leadership yet none were ever issued. In fact all were awarded medals and promoted. This is one of the main problems with our military (at least the Army) and it has to effect recruiting. When officers are rewarded for spending their soldiers lives in order to advance their careers you're going to have retention and recruiting problems.
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Unfortunately it’s been that way throughout history.
 
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#63
#63
hog88 said:
I feel that it has gotten worse since the 90s.
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It's not even just about the lives in combat anymore.

I've said it about a billion times on here but our military, now, is nothing but a big government jobs program. As a (very close) bystander, I've seen more incompetent people that were willing to play the political game (rather than do the right thing) get moved up than I care to think about. All it takes is a few of those types in the positions that make decisions and off we go.

The other thing to consider, and I think you were hitting on it, is that the military itself does very little to help transition veterans into normal life, and where they have anything its basically all run by the VA. You'd think a lot of the skills picked up in the military would transfer over to civilian life (and many should) but most guys coming out have 1) no professional licensure or real path to it for fields that require it, or 2) face situations where what they did was just a little too military-specific for private industry to recognize. Unless you're going career, going into the military for most people is just delaying any kind of other meaningful career.
 
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#65
#65
hog88 said:
My son graduated HS in 2008, he had an opportunity to get into the Navy nuclear program which I encouraged him to do. If he had come to me and asked about following my footsteps into the Army I would have actively discouraged that decision. I recently advised a friend's son who wanted to join and go airborne infantry to find something else.

I can understand (somewhat) kids being not wanting to join and go into combat arms branches but with the highly technical fields the military offers I see it as a problem that they aren't filling those slots.
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It could be that it is often hard to find a job in the field you worked in after you get out.
 
#66
#66
ButchPlz said:
It's not even just about the lives in combat anymore.

I've said it about a billion times on here but our military, now, is nothing but a big government jobs program. As a (very close) bystander, I've seen more incompetent people that were willing to play the political game (rather than do the right thing) get moved up than I care to think about. All it takes is a few of those types in the positions that make decisions and off we go.

The other thing to consider, and I think you were hitting on it, is that the military itself does very little to help transition veterans into normal life, and where they have anything its basically all run by the VA. You'd think a lot of the skills picked up in the military would transfer over to civilian life (and many should) but most guys coming out have 1) no professional licensure or real path to it for fields that require it, or 2) face situations where what they did was just a little too military-specific for private industry to recognize. Unless you're going career, going into the military for most people is just delaying any kind of other meaningful career.
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I know older guys that were electricians in the military back in the day and it put them on a great path when they got out. Then there’s those that use to go for a little college money but there’s really no need in that anymore. I think every MOS adds some skill that is at least partly translatable to civilian life careers.
 
#68
#68
C-south said:
I know older guys that were electricians in the military back in the day and it put them on a great path when they got out. Then there’s those that use to go for a little college money but there’s really no need in that anymore. I think every MOS adds some skill that is at least partly translatable to civilian life careers.
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Sure, there are definitely some fields where that's the case. And in a lot of ways it can get you started.

But think of it this way- you're now starting out 4-8 years older than the other guys just starting out. Maybe you have a wife and a kid now. Your carpentry (literally know a guy that did this on submarine tenders) could be useful, but not many are hiring carpenters and even then if you go into it you're going to be real tight on things while you're getting set in the civilian world. So why even join up? If you want to be an electrician, or a carpenter, or whatever it basically makes no sense to go military to start out.
 
#69
#69
ButchPlz said:
Sure, there are definitely some fields where that's the case. And in a lot of ways it can get you started.

But think of it this way- you're now starting out 4-8 years older than the other guys just starting out. Maybe you have a wife and a kid now. Your carpentry (literally know a guy that did this on submarine tenders) could be useful, but not many are hiring carpenters and even then if you go into it you're going to be real tight on things while you're getting set in the civilian world. So why even join up? If you want to be an electrician, or a carpenter, or whatever it basically makes no sense to go military to start out.
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I don’t disagree at all. I wasn’t sure what I was going to do after high school which is partly why I joined. Although my military career didn’t directly translate to my current career I learned invaluable skills that at least in part have benefited me throughout life. I will agree if you’re looking to join the military as being some sort of trade school you need to do your homework and be very specific in what you’re looking for. Lockheed Martin is just down the road and are recruiting people across the country who can work on F-16s.
 
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#70
#70
Talk to anyone in the officer ranks what they're up to. It basically a lower paying corporate job with piles of government mandates on HR/culture trainings. And beyond certain ranks if you don't have a nose for the political machinations you're not going to go much higher up.

The one concern I would have on manpower shortages is that it will accelerate the "need" and subsequent spending to get more mechanized combat machines into the services. While it would in theory save lives it will make it far too easy for future administrations to launch a fun little mission all over the world because the political blowback of losing troops will be diminished.
 
#71
#71
n_huffhines said:
It's always war time, LOL.

I believe it was easier to recruit in 2004 than it is now. Just seems like common sense. But after 20 years of bad results, you'd think people would wise up. My Dad was trying to get me to join the military in 2000. I highly doubt he would do that with an 18 YO son at this point, and it has nothing to do with the woke state of the military. In fact, I am almost positive he didn't broach the topic with my brother, who is 7 years younger than me.

Unfortunately, there is no data that accurately measures how easy it is to recruit. I can see enlistment is down, basically year over year, for a while, but enlistment doesn't tell us a whole lot.
Click to expand...
Maybe your dad thought you needed a foot in your ass from someone other than himself and your brother was the golden child 🤷🏻‍♂️
 
#72
#72
I think a lot of the problem are the typical types of young men of today. After going through three of my daughters dating, I’ve yet to be impressed with any they’ve brought home.
I know fathers thought I was a chump too, but holy cow…. I always had a job and acted like a male.
 
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#73
#73
SD189 said:
Maybe your dad thought you needed a foot in your ass from someone other than himself and your brother was the golden child 🤷🏻‍♂️
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I didn't. He was the golden chikd but we were both good kids. I went on a 2-year church service mission and to college instead of doing the military
 
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#75
#75
Majors said:
Who are the good guys?
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Anybody fighting against these guys...

screenshot_20220626-212751_youtube-jpg.467564
 
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