Modern day 40 acres and a mule?

[Delmar]

Joe Biden said it's so easy to farm. All you have to do is plant a seed and up pops corn ready to eat.

Whereas Trump would hire someone to plant his corn and then not pay them.

 

[Grand Vol]

Well here again, the land that was homesteaded out west was mostly distributed along racial lines after reconstruction. So the former slaves at the time missed out on that (which would have actually been the way to pay 40 acres and a mule). And also, something that I wasn't even made aware of until last year, but apparently after WWII when the GI Bill was taken advantage of by returning soldiers, there were several benefits included in the GI Bill that were denied to returning black soldiers.... mostly in terms of home financing and education financing. I realize a "home" and farm land are not the same thing, but the point I'm making is that there were several decisions made in the past that went along racial lines that frankly, are contributing to the madness and poverty that you see in the black community right now. Had blacks been given opportunities in getting access to homesteads after Reconstruction, the entire dynamics change and there would have been no need for blacks to migrate into the cities in the early part of the 20th Century.

If you have blacks that want to work on farms and be productive and make a living, I think that is a far better alternative in the long run than blacks being packed into these Democratic concrete jungles waiting on some white liberals to feed them their next meal. At least with a farm you are able to feed yourself.

Just something to think about...

You bring up good points here (especially the GI Bill portion) that could have helped over time. But you also know it wasn't just black farmers migrating to the cities in the early 20th century. Even back then, farms were becoming more efficient and not as much farming was needed to produce what had been done before. It continued to improve as time went on and even more farmers got put out of work because they couldn't keep up with the bills. Also, the Dust Bowl and Depression killed more farms than racist policies ever did.

People of all races and colors moved to the cities during that time because that's where the work was. We were just getting into our serious industrial capacity in the early 20th century and you could live a "better life" by moving to the city and making money or continue to do the hand to mouth existence you'd been doing your whole life.

Easy choice to move.

 

[Y9 Vol]

Whereas Trump would hire someone to plant his corn and then not pay them.

Someone like you, dumb enough not to get paid up front.

 

[hog88]

You of all people know if (or when) the government gets involved, it's never going to be "reasonable."

As I said, if a person has a legal claim to the land and we aren't being absurd about the timelines here, yes, the case should be heard. But as @hog88 pointed out, such people have to be willing to use the land for the intended purpose and be trained in such a thing. Now, it's not just that, but do you realize how expensive running a farm is or the initial startup costs of machinery, implements, irrigation setup, so on and so forth?

It ain't cheap. Of course, now the government feels compelled to grant such things to new landowners as well.

Not even going to get into how the market can/will get distorted by adding 32 million acres of new farms into the mix because you know that land originally taken isn't still farm areas these days. What happens when said land that "My great grandfather owned even though I can't prove that" is a strip mall?

Not even going to get into the additional subsidies that get tossed around when these farms actually start producing and they get paid not to produce either.

As stated, I'm about starting a fair process if the person has a legitimate claim to the property involved and not this "no clear line of ownership" like the link Hog put up. Sorry, we do NOT need yet more government oversight into farming. But if the government really wants this to go forward, they need to take a look at the lands they currently own and see how much of that can or could be converted to farming use and leave the ones already producing alone. Such things are easier than paying a metric ****-ton of money buying back land then feeling compelled to keep throwing money at it when they didn't think this all the way through.

Plus, I'm naturally suspicious (as you should be) when Booker, Gillibrand and Warren support anything...

You know the quickest way to have a million dollars after starting a farm?

Start it with 2 million dollars.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Seriously? How many young black folk want to be farmers? This is a damn joke.

From what I understand, this is mostly going to existing farmers and their families that were wronged before. I don't think a significant portion of it is "supposed" to go to anyone at random.

 

[hog88]

From what I understand, this is mostly going to existing farmers and their families that were wronged before. I don't think a significant portion of it is "supposed" to go to anyone at random.

Nope, read the link I posted. This is designed to go to start up farmers.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

You of all people know if (or when) the government gets involved, it's never going to be "reasonable."

As I said, if a person has a legal claim to the land and we aren't being absurd about the timelines here, yes, the case should be heard. But as @hog88 pointed out, such people have to be willing to use the land for the intended purpose and be trained in such a thing. Now, it's not just that, but do you realize how expensive running a farm is or the initial startup costs of machinery, implements, irrigation setup, so on and so forth?

It ain't cheap. Of course, now the government feels compelled to grant such things to new landowners as well.

Not even going to get into how the market can/will get distorted by adding 32 million acres of new farms into the mix because you know that land originally taken isn't still farm areas these days. What happens when said land that "My great grandfather owned even though I can't prove that" is a strip mall?

Not even going to get into the additional subsidies that get tossed around when these farms actually start producing and they get paid not to produce either.

As stated, I'm about starting a fair process if the person has a legitimate claim to the property involved and not this "no clear line of ownership" like the link Hog put up. Sorry, we do NOT need yet more government oversight into farming. But if the government really wants this to go forward, they need to take a look at the lands they currently own and see how much of that can or could be converted to farming use and leave the ones already producing alone. Such things are easier than paying a metric ****-ton of money buying back land then feeling compelled to keep throwing money at it when they didn't think this all the way through.

Plus, I'm naturally suspicious (as you should be) when Booker, Gillibrand and Warren support anything...

Well again, from the story I saw, this is mainly directed towards people that are farmers right now... "ideally", you are not going to get a bunch of first time farmers jumping on tis. I doubt very seriously that you are going to get a bunch of city folk wanting to move out to the country and work a farm in the middle of no where.

 

[hog88]

Well again, from the story I saw, this is mainly directed towards people that are farmers right now... "ideally", you are not going to get a bunch of first time farmers jumping on tis. I doubt very seriously that you are going to get a bunch of city folk wanting to move out to the country and work a farm in the middle of no where.

Again, nope.

He said the bill “would enact reforms within the USDA to finally end discrimination within that agency, protect the remaining Black farmers from losing their land, and provide land grants to create a new generation of Black farmers and begin to restore the land base that has been lost by Black farmers due to outrageous discrimination over past decades.”

‘Justice’ bill would transfer up to 32 million acres to Black farmers

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Nope, read the link I posted. This is designed to go to start up farmers.

Well that is different than the program I saw. Hmmm... i tht case, that is a different story.

 

[Grand Vol]

You know the quickest way to have a million dollars after starting a farm?

Start it with 2 million dollars.

Same quote is said about gun dealers.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Again, nope.



‘Justice’ bill would transfer up to 32 million acres to Black farmers

He said the bill “would enact reforms within the USDA to finally end discrimination within that agency, protect the remaining Black farmers from losing their land, and provide land grants to create a new generation of Black farmers and begin to restore the land base that has been lost by Black farmers due to outrageous discrimination over past decades.”

I doubt you get too many urbanites jumping on this. What you likely will get are people that were related to family members that lost land based on prior USDA practices.

 

[hog88]

I doubt you get too many urbanites jumping on this. What you likely will get are people that were related to family members that lost land based on prior USDA practices.

Still a tremendous waste of money. A small family could make a living (barely) on 160 acres if the machinery and everything else was paid for but it would be a meager living.

 

[LouderVol]

Well here again, the land that was homesteaded out west was mostly distributed along racial lines after reconstruction. So the former slaves at the time missed out on that (which would have actually been the way to pay 40 acres and a mule). And also, something that I wasn't even made aware of until last year, but apparently after WWII when the GI Bill was taken advantage of by returning soldiers, there were several benefits included in the GI Bill that were denied to returning black soldiers.... mostly in terms of home financing and education financing. I realize a "home" and farm land are not the same thing, but the point I'm making is that there were several decisions made in the past that went along racial lines that frankly, are contributing to the madness and poverty that you see in the black community right now. Had blacks been given opportunities in getting access to homesteads after Reconstruction, the entire dynamics change and there would have been no need for blacks to migrate into the cities in the early part of the 20th Century.

If you have blacks that want to work on farms and be productive and make a living, I think that is a far better alternative in the long run than blacks being packed into these Democratic concrete jungles waiting on some white liberals to feed them their next meal. At least with a farm you are able to feed yourself.

Just something to think about...

They would have stayed on the farms? The move to urban is not uniquely a black situation or one relegated to this country.

 

[LouderVol]

Still a tremendous waste of money. A small family could make a living (barely) on 160 acres if the machinery and everything else was paid for but it would be a meager living.

I was thinking 200 was needed to be really self supporting.

 

[1972 Grad]

Still a tremendous waste of money. A small family could make a living (barely) on 160 acres if the machinery and everything else was paid for but it would be a meager living.

Nope. Belgian Endive is the key. Wonder how many heads this flies over?

 

[hog88]

I was thinking 200 was needed to be really self supporting.

Really depends on what you're producing and how good the land is. Still in the vast majority of cases with 160 or even 200 acres one or both people would have to have an off the farm job in addition to the farm.

 

[hog88]

Nope. Belgian Endive is the key. Wonder how many heads this flies over?

Could grow a bunch of it on 160 acres.

 

[1972 Grad]

Could grow a bunch of it on 160 acres.

Do you remember who brought up the Endive suggestion originally?

 

[hog88]

Do you remember who brought up the Endive suggestion originally?

I do not.

 

[1972 Grad]

I do not.

Google Dukakis and Belgian Endive. It was a suggestion by Michael Dukakis to farmers in Iowa there in 1988. he was ridiculed for it.

 

[MG1968]

Hmm, I looked it up and was disappointed that Belgian Endive wasn’t Urban Dictionary slang for marijuana.

 

[NorthDallas40]

Whereas Trump would hire someone to plant his corn and then not pay them.

This topic has absolutely nothing to do whatsoever with Trump so you should probably keep your “but Trump” idiotic replies in the bank until you have a need to play them next year.

To Grand’s point if it can be proven land was actually TAKEN then sure that should be compensated. Now instead if loans or subsidies were not distributed equally, which is wrong, I don’t think the answer is to just give it away. To those whom want to actually farm the land and commit in a verifiable manner to do so then making favorable loans or subsidies seems reasonable to land which is currently available. But they need to commit or as hogg said they would just sell it

 

[volinbham]

Is there a shortage of farms in the country? Is there a market for the new produce/livestock? If the answer to these questions is no then this is a disaster of a program.

 

[hog88]

Is there a shortage of farms in the country? Is there a market for the new produce/livestock? If the answer to these questions is no then this is a disaster of a program.

No and no.

 

[1972 Grad]

Is there a shortage of farms in the country? Is there a market for the new produce/livestock? If the answer to these questions is no then this is a disaster of a program.

That sounds like a perfect program for the federal government then.