Mormon Proxy Baptisms

#26
#26
T-TownVol said:
You have to remember that you are lumping people that live in what we call the "civilized" world with the ones that live in places that the Gospel has not reached.
The standard is completely different.
Those that HAVE heard the gospel have the choice to accept it or not, thus determining their salvation. Those that have not heard are still required to acknowledge God's existance.
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That's exactly what I'm asking. What about the Indonesian guy in 1583 that never heard of Jesus. Apparently you say he doesn't have to accept Jesus, just acknowledge God's existence. From what I understand of the Bible, you have to accept Jesus. No exceptions.
 
#27
#27
nbakerld said:
That's exactly what I'm asking. What about the Indonesian guy in 1583 that never heard of Jesus. Apparently you say he doesn't have to accept Jesus, just acknowledge God's existence. From what I understand of the Bible, you have to accept Jesus. No exceptions.
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That's the conclusion I've drawn as well.

T-Town... how do you feel about Calvinism is relevance to situations like these? What if one hasn't even heard of God?
 
#29
#29
nbakerld said:
That's exactly what I'm asking. What about the Indonesian guy in 1583 that never heard of Jesus. Apparently you say he doesn't have to accept Jesus, just acknowledge God's existence. From what I understand of the Bible, you have to accept Jesus. No exceptions.
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Wrong, on the merits of the passage in Romans. Those people did not know that JC ever walked the Earth.
You have to accept Christ IF you have heard the gospel. The guy in Indonesia in 1583 propably never got that chance. Once again, the Bible seperates the people that have heard and those that have not in that Romans scripture. God says that he will not hold that guy as accountable as he will hold you and me.
 
#30
#30
DinkinFlicka said:
That's the conclusion I've drawn as well.

T-Town... how do you feel about Calvinism is relevance to situations like these? What if one hasn't even heard of God?
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That is what Romans 1:18-20 covers. All they have to do in acknowledge God. They can not confess the Gospel if they have never heard it.
 
#35
#35
Not ducking out, must go watch daughter play lax. I will check back later.
 
#36
#36
T-TownVol said:
That is what Romans 1:18-20 covers. All they have to do in acknowledge God. They can not confess the Gospel if they have never heard it.
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All I got from that scripture is people don't have excuses for not acknowledging God. I don't get where you are getting that acknowledging God replaces the requirement of accepting Christ if you never heard of Christ.
 
#37
#37
nbakerld said:
All I got from that scripture is people don't have excuses for not acknowledging God. I don't get where you are getting that acknowledging God replaces the requirement of accepting Christ if you never heard of Christ.
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How can someone accept Christ if they do not know of his existance? I clearly stated that I believe, because of the verses I mantioned, that the standards are different for those that have never been made aware of JC, therefore, have no chance to accept him. Acknowledging God is all they can do.
 
#39
#39
T-TownVol said:
will a former one do :)
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Actually. My kids attend a curch of Christ school but I'm not in line with their doctrine. We go to a Baptist church for Red but can probably answer OEs question.

We are so similar OE will accuse us of being alters.
 
#41
#41
T-TownVol said:
YES
Religion is man made......Christians are Christ like.......the world calls being a Christian the same as being religious but that is not Biblical.......like I said, many people that call themselves Christians are very very very religious and are no where near being a Christian
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James 1:27
Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.
 
#42
#42
nbakerld said:
That's exactly what I'm asking. What about the Indonesian guy in 1583 that never heard of Jesus. Apparently you say he doesn't have to accept Jesus, just acknowledge God's existence. From what I understand of the Bible, you have to accept Jesus. No exceptions.
Click to expand...

I have always thought this passage was applicable here:

James 2
12 For all who have sinned without the Law will also perish without the Law, and all who have sinned under the Law will be judged by the Law; 13 for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified. 14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, 15 in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them, 16 on the day when, according to my gospel, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.

I think that those who do not have the Bible or a teacher 'do not have the Law'.
 
#45
#45
RespectTradition said:
I have always thought this passage was applicable here:

James 2
12 For all who have sinned without the Law will also perish without the Law, and all who have sinned under the Law will be judged by the Law; 13 for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified. 14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, 15 in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them, 16 on the day when, according to my gospel, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.

I think that those who do not have the Bible or a teacher 'do not have the Law'.
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That also explains it well. Romans actually speaks to salvation when it says that they have "no excuse" for not believing in God even though they "do not have the law".
People keep going back to the "accept Jesus" line, they are not taking into account that God and Jesus are one in the trinity.
 
#46
#46
RespectTradition said:
James 1:27
Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.
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Exactly, has nothing to do with what the world/man has created with all the denominations and their rituals.
 
#48
#48
I misread the title as Moron Proxy Baptists and was momentarily offended that someone had me pegged.
 
#49
#49
T-TownVol said:
Exactly, has nothing to do with what the world/man has created with all the denominations and their rituals.
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Just curious, from your posts, you seem to imply that churches are obsolete and unnecessary. Would that be a correct inference?
 
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