NSA spying on millions in the USA

#78
#78
(orange+white=heaven @ May 11 said:
Perception-What votes are cast on.
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Yep - A concept that the GOP seems to be having trouble grasping. It's not what your record is, it's what people THINK your record is.
 
#79
#79
(smokedog#3 @ May 11 said:
there is the reason i don't like republicans. cry like a little girl when somebody says something bad about them and then turn right around and start crapping on the democrats as stated the typical republican way.
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I can't believe you actually believe your own post.

You started a thread with extreme statements - crapping on republicans to use your phrase. Some responded with fact-based opinion that disagreed with yours and you tell us that we're blind to the truth. When we start making unfounded extreme statements in jest you freak and say typical republican!

You've admitted you hate W and all he stands for yet expect us to view your opinion as objective and based wholly in fact.

You can't have it both ways man.
 
#81
#81
(GAVol @ May 11 said:
I guess so. But still . . . I managed to get through 8 years of Clinton trying to Nationalize healthcare, giving away nuclear secrets, lying to Grand Jurys, his wife being indicted, missing billing records, aides dying etc., and yet I managed to not go off the deep end, hate him and compare him to lord knows what crazy dictator.
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I totally agree. I disagreed with many of his policies and some of the nefarious issues associated with his terms but then again, I realize there will always be some of that in politics.

However, overall I assumed that most of his policies were what he thought were in the best or better interests of the country. Same for W. I don't agree with all his policies and will criticize the implementation of other policies. However, his basic policy approach matches my believes better than the democratic solution to the same problems.

Why people can't separate disagreement over the means to the same ends and assume that for the most part the ends are honorable, I'll never understand.
 
#82
#82
(volinbham @ May 11 said:
Why people can't separate disagreement over the means to the same ends and assume that for the most part the ends are honorable, I'll never understand.
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I guess some people just can't separate civil argument from personal conflict.
 
#83
#83
(volinbham @ May 11 said:
I totally agree. I disagreed with many of his policies and some of the nefarious issues associated with his terms but then again, I realize there will always be some of that in politics.

However, overall I assumed that most of his policies were what he thought were in the best or better interests of the country. Same for W. I don't agree with all his policies and will criticize the implementation of other policies. However, his basic policy approach matches my believes better than the democratic solution to the same problems.

Why people can't separate disagreement over the means to the same ends and assume that for the most part the ends are honorable, I'll never understand.
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Great post.
I think it has to do with those in the beltway losing sight of what a win looks like. It is not a win for your particular party, but rather for the nation as a whole.
Is there some way we can stamp that on the forehead of every wannabe who goes up there?? :D
 
#85
#85
With all of our public records and traceable identity information this is all very silly.

The unfortunate truth about our government is that it is propelled by the next election issue. (This is why a lame duck president only has to answer to his political party.) Imposition of congressional TERM LIMITS is the only real answer most of the nations problems.
 
#87
#87
The Supreme Court has twice ruled that collecting the type of information alleged in the USAToday article is legal and requires no warrant.

Additionally, some Congressional (both sides) members were briefed on the program.
 
#88
#88
You mean that USA Today is making an issue out of nothing? I just don't believe it.
 
#89
#89
(Lexvol @ May 11 said:
You mean that USA Today is making an issue out of nothing? I just don't believe it.
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When those friggin Islamic terrorists detonate a nuke in one our major cities and kill 2 or 3 million Americans and the military imposes martial law, you left-wing sissies will see what true loss of civil liberties really is. :banghead: Sadly, 9-11 changed our life forever, we may have to give up some liberties for security.
 
#90
#90
(rockydoc @ May 11 said:
When those friggin Islamic terrorists detonate a nuke in one our major cities and kill 2 or 3 million Americans and the military imposes martial law, you left-wing sissies will see what true loss of civil liberties really is. :banghead: Sadly, 9-11 changed our life forever, we may have to give up some liberties for security.
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YEAH!! Liberties?? We don't need no stinkin' liberties!! Look at how tightening up the civil liberties worked for Germans in 1932. It's the way to go I tell ya.
 
#91
#91
YEAH!! Liberties?? We don't need no stinkin' liberties!! Look at how tightening up the civil liberties worked for Germans in 1932. It's the way to go I tell ya.
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Sarcasm aside, theres a difference between rights and civil liberties. Hitler took away free speech and press, among many other things, which are rights, not civil liberties. Rights are explicitly spelled out in the first ten amendments. Civil liberties are implied and have grown in number over the years based on Supreme Court interpretation. The president can curb civil liberties at times. It was done in the civil war, world war I, II, during the cold war, and now. Nobody has had their "rights" violated. Civil liberties maybe, but even then all this attention is just a product of the 24 hour news channel need for something to talk about. The same things have always gone on its just they were not as well publicized.
:peace:
 
#92
#92
(Volunteer Rebel @ May 11 said:
The president can curb civil liberties at times. It was done in the civil war, world war I, II, during the cold war, and now. Nobody has had their "rights" violated.
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Doesn't mean it was the right thing to do. German immigrants were persecuted during WWI and WWII, Asians in general during WWII, and during the Cold War it was anybody that was even called a subversive.
 
#93
#93
(Volunteer Rebel @ May 12 said:
Sarcasm aside, theres a difference between rights and civil liberties. Hitler took away free speech and press, among many other things, which are rights, not civil liberties.
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Hitler persuaded President Hindenburg to issue a decree entitled, "For the Protection of the People and the State." Justified as a "defensive measure against Communist acts of violence endangering the state," the decree suspended the constitutional guarantees pertaining to civil liberties:



 
#95
#95
(Orangewhiteblood @ May 12 said:
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Nobody has restricted ANYTHING though. That's the big misconception in all of this.

And one other thing . . . Isn't it sort of strange that a story is being splashed all over the front pages of newspapers like a new revalation when this actually all came to light months ago?
 
#96
#96
(GAVol @ May 12 said:
Nobody has restricted ANYTHING though. That's the big misconception in all of this.

And one other thing . . . Isn't it sort of strange that a story is being splashed all over the front pages of newspapers like a new revalation when this actually all came to light months ago?
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I smell a liberal media bash session brewing for today... B)
 
#98
#98
(orange+white=heaven @ May 12 said:
I smell a liberal media bash session brewing for today... B)
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Not trying to start anything, but come on . . . a new CIA Director who is connected to the NSA program is about to go through confirmation hearings, and this story magically appears. :question:
 
#99
#99
This is all over nothing; you actually believe you have privacy?

Go to earth map and get a satellite picture of your house.
Google Earth

What about every time you use your credit and or debit card?

We have no privacy, to believe other wise is simply, ridiculous.

 
#100
#100
(GAVol @ May 12 said:
Not trying to start anything, but come on . . . a new CIA Director who is connected to the NSA program is about to go through confirmation hearings, and this story magically appears. :question:
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Or you could flip the table on the direction you are going...

A new CIA director is about to be appointed, so folks start looking into it all.
Is it magic that they found something, albeit minor, and printed it?
 
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