Oakland Mayor tipped off illegal immigrants about ICE raid

#51
#51
n_huffhines said:
So no valid examples?

Might as well say it's increased danger because ICE agents have to drive around more.
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I think donuts are more of a threat at that point than driving.

again, someone doesn't actually have to get hurt to make it more dangerous.

50% chance of getting hurt is more dangerous than a 49% chance, even if no one ultimately gets hurt. What Sessions or whoever said is true. the guy who quit said they were trying to make him lie. that was not the case. He may feel that way, but its not the truth.
 
#52
#52
I have judged for awhile that the illegal immigration issue was primarily about cheap labor and votes. The voting thing I wasn't too sure about, but I was 100% sure that cheap labor was a major component concerning most of those fighting for the illegal immigrants. There have been some on this board admit they were for the cheap labor.

Well, this weekend, I received nearly 100% confirmation on both issues.

I had the pleasure of spending the weekend in New York, roughly 15 miles north of the city, as the locals call it. Met many extremely nice folks and learned a lot about the area. I never realized how hilly NY is. But I digress...

During the weekend, I happen to have a long discussion with a local attorney whom has lived there for all of his 70+ years. He and others I talked to discussed how "the city" is nothing like it used to be. That very few native people live there anymore; that it's full of transplants and it has really "gone down hill". Many "mellenials" are moving to the city but realize they cannot afford it, so they are in fact flooding the outer townships, to the dismay of the locals.

The attorney proceeded to talk about Mario Cuomo and how he lost his first run for the governor of NY. The second time he ran, this attorney talked in length about how he and other attorneys were bombarded with calls from "friends" of Cuomo to round up the 'laborers' and get them to the polls. Even went into discussion on how this was to be done and how to manipulate the machines.

He then proceeded to discuss the "day laborers" and how 2-3 areas in the city are known to be where one goes to pick up their day laborers. It is referred to as 'the slave trade' area. I thought this was very interesting, especially in ultra liberal NY.

Therefore, could it really be that simple? Cheap labor and votes? I know in my area, migrants are used for farming. Heck, our government built a local farmer a 4 bedroom house for his workers to live in. He just has to use it for them for 5 years then he can do as he wishes with it.

Thoughts? Let the debate.
 
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#53
#53
CABVOL said:
I have judged for awhile that the illegal immigration issue was primarily about cheap labor and votes. The voting thing I wasn't too sure about, but I was 100% sure that cheap labor was a major component concerning most of those fighting for the illegal immigrants. There have been some on this board admit they were for the cheap labor.

Well, this weekend, I received nearly 100% confirmation on both issues.

I had the pleasure of spending the weekend in New York, roughly 15 miles north of the city, as the locals call it. Met many extremely nice folks and learned a lot about the area. I never realized how hilly NY is. But I digress...

During the weekend, I happen to have a long discussion with a local attorney whom has lived there for all of his 70+ years. He and others I talked to discussed how "the city" is nothing like it used to be. That very few native people live there anymore; that it's full of transplants and it has really "gone down hill". Many "mellenials" are moving to the city but realize they cannot afford it, so they are in fact flooding the outer townships, to the dismay of the locals.

The attorney proceeded to talk about Mario Cuomo and how he lost his first run for the governor of NY. The second time he ran, this attorney talked in length about how he and other attorneys were bombarded with calls from "friends" of Cuomo to round up the 'laborers' and get them to the polls. Even went into discussion on how this was to be done and how to manipulate the machines.

He then proceeded to discuss the "day laborers" and how 2-3 areas in the city are known to be where one goes to pick up their day laborers. It is referred to as 'the slave trade' area. I thought this was very interesting, especially in ultra liberal NY.

Therefore, could it really be that simple? Cheap labor and votes? I know in my area, migrants are used for farming. Heck, our government built a local farmer a 4 bedroom house for his workers to live in. He just has to use it for them for 5 years then he can do as he wishes with it.

Thoughts? Let the debate.
Click to expand...

By talking to one guy? Yeah, I can see why you think it is just that simple
 
#54
#54
114VOL said:
By talking to one guy? Yeah, I can see why you think it is just that simple
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One guy whom is someone in that community for over 70+ years and has direct interactions in this topic. But keep up your smarta$$ typical bs that you’re good for. That’s about all you have been good for from what I’ve read in these forums.
 
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#55
#55
It's not just about cheap labor for me and it's not about votes at all, since I ****ing hate the democratic party.

We are a nation of immigrants
Being a melting pot enriches us culturally
We as a nation are better off economically with a steady influx of immigrants
We need their labor to sustain SS and medicare (baby boomers retiring is very problematic)
I believe that it is immoral and selfish to support a system that gives people basically no shot at the American dream
 
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#56
#56
n_huffhines said:
It's not just about cheap labor for me and it's not about votes at all, since I ****ing hate the democratic party.

We are a nation of immigrants
Being a melting pot enriches us culturally
We as a nation are better off economically with a steady influx of immigrants
We need their labor to sustain SS and medicare (baby boomers retiring is very problematic)
I believe that it is immoral and selfish to support a system that gives people basically no shot at the American dream
Click to expand...

Did the immigrants storm the borders and disappear into the population?
 
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#57
#57
n_huffhines said:
It's not just about cheap labor for me and it's not about votes at all, since I ****ing hate the democratic party.

We are a nation of immigrants
Being a melting pot enriches us culturally
We as a nation are better off economically with a steady influx of immigrants
We need their labor to sustain SS and medicare (baby boomers retiring is very problematic)
I believe that it is immoral and selfish to support a system that gives people basically no shot at the American dream
Click to expand...

:thud:
 
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#58
#58
n_huffhines said:
It's not just about cheap labor for me and it's not about votes at all, since I ****ing hate the democratic party.

We are a nation of immigrants
Being a melting pot enriches us culturally
We as a nation are better off economically with a steady influx of immigrants
We need their labor to sustain SS and medicare (baby boomers retiring is very problematic)
I believe that it is immoral and selfish to support a system that gives people basically no shot at the American dream
Click to expand...

Melting pot sounds good. Won't work in this era of uncivil discourse and identity politics.
 
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#59
#59
n_huffhines said:
It's not just about cheap labor for me and it's not about votes at all, since I ****ing hate the democratic party.

We are a nation of immigrants
Being a melting pot enriches us culturally
We as a nation are better off economically with a steady influx of immigrants
We need their labor to sustain SS and medicare (baby boomers retiring is very problematic)
I believe that it is immoral and selfish to support a system that gives people basically no shot at the American dream
Click to expand...

we naturalize approx 740k people a year. not at all "basically no shot". and thats not considering the any other legal methods at getting a shot at the American dream.

yes, we need more people to prop up the welfare state, all so that later even more people are needed to prop them up when their SS comes due. not really a good argument to let in more people imo. just making the problem worse later.

the rest I agree with.
 
#61
#61
LouderVol said:
we naturalize approx 740k people a year. not at all "basically no shot". and thats not considering the any other legal methods at getting a shot at the American dream.

yes, we need more people to prop up the welfare state, all so that later even more people are needed to prop them up when their SS comes due. not really a good argument to let in more people imo. just making the problem worse later.

the rest I agree with.
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You don't have to give them SS. That's thd beauty of being a lawmaker. Just write the law so **** works.

It's basically no shot. You can't waste your life away waiting on a list.
 
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#62
#62
n_huffhines said:
You don't have to give them SS. That's thd beauty of being a lawmaker. Just write the law so **** works.

It's basically no shot. You can't waste your life away waiting on a list.
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I think the average wait no lawyer is 3, with lawyer slightly less than 2. hardly wasting your whole life, especially as you can do it at home, or here in the states. there typically isn't some magic waiting area.

How Long Does it Take to Become a U.S. Citizen After Filing My Application for Naturalization?

this link says 2, but real world usually takes about 3.


"just right the law so stuff works" who are you and what did you do with Huff?

I would love for them to get rid of SS, but unless you are getting rid of it for everyone, or at least giving everyone an opt out (but still pay taxes) you are creating a second class of citizen. maybe if it was just for the border hoppers and not second generation.

as far as no shot, there are apparently 6 million applications a year. How Many Immigration Applications Are Filed Each Year? which would be 12%, hardly no shot. and that is just naturalization. we apparently grant about 1 million green cards, plus the naturalizations. which brings it up to about 30%, and then you have the visas which is an always changing number. best I can see is another 150k for visas, which would push that total percentage to 31.5%.

again, hardly "no shot". you seem to sensationalize things without doing real research on things. at least as long as it makes the government look bad.
 
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#63
#63
We have between 12-20 million illegal immigrants, to the open borders crowd how many is enough? 30 million,50 million, 150 million? Whats the number?
The American dream should be difficult, no one has a right to come here, you should be vetted and have to stand in line.

And please learn the damn language. Many of these people legal and illegal can't speak a word of English and don't bother to learn it.
 
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#64
#64
volfanjustin said:
We have between 12-20 million illegal immigrants, to the open borders crowd how many is enough? 30 million,50 million, 150 million? Whats the number?
The American dream should be difficult, no one has a right to come here, you should be vetted and have to stand in line.

And please learn the damn language. Many of these people legal and illegal can't speak a word of English and don't bother to learn it.
Click to expand...

Continuing trend.

every time there was a "little Italy" or whatever country, people would flock there to speak their language and generally not assimilate into standard American culture. first gens rarely drop their native tongue. but by gen 2 and 3 its very common for English to be the predominate to only language spoken. living history is never as neat as reading about.
 
#65
#65
LouderVol said:
as far as no shot, there are apparently 6 million applications a year. How Many Immigration Applications Are Filed Each Year? which would be 12%, hardly no shot.
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12% of people who apply....that's not a good shot. Playing the odds, if you apply every year, you don't get here until year 9. You just lost 1/3 of your working life waiting. People don't apply because those are such bad odds, so the real % of people accepted who want to come is lower than 12%. Sneaking across the border is treacherous, costly, and difficult, but it's more attractive to people than waiting for a reason. They have no real shot.
 
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#66
#66
n_huffhines said:
12% of people who apply....that's not a good shot. Playing the odds, if you apply every year, you don't get here until year 9. You just lost 1/3 of your working life waiting. People don't apply because those are such bad odds, so the real % of people accepted who want to come is lower than 12%. Sneaking across the border is treacherous, costly, and difficult, but it's more attractive to people than waiting for a reason. They have no real shot.
Click to expand...

yeah, just ignore the rest of it showing that that 6 million was for EVERYONE applying to enter the US. not just naturalization.

again sensationalizing even when presented the information.

30%, or 3.3 years to get in.

and if you bothered to read the information you would see that 50% of that 6 million is already here in the US. so again its not like they wasted 9 years, they were here working and giving you cheap crap without being legal.
 
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#67
#67
LouderVol said:
yeah, just ignore the rest of it showing that that 6 million was for EVERYONE applying to enter the US. not just naturalization.
Click to expand...

What makes you think I didn't get that?

again sensationalizing even when presented the information.

30%, or 3.3 years to get in.

and if you bothered to read the information you would see that 50% of that 6 million is already here in the US. so again its not like they wasted 9 years, they were here working and giving you cheap crap without being legal.
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You're talking about EVERYONE. You're talking about a group that includes a doctor from Sweden (who will be just fine with or without the American dream). I'm talking about our neighbors, who don't have a realistic chance.

About 1 million green cards are issued each year, but there are limits in some categories. There are no limits on immediate family — spouses and unmarried sons and daughters younger than 21 and parents of U.S. citizens 21 or older. The largest number of green cards is given to immediate relatives.

This is how far behind they are: The State Department is now processing visas for the Mexican married sons or daughters of U.S. citizens who have been waiting in line since May 1995.

Another example: A brother or sister from Mexico of an adult U.S. citizen would have to be waiting in line since October 1997.
Click to expand...

Why don't Mexicans just apply for citizenship? | Immigration | Dallas News

This shows in 2011 that 1.4M Mexicans tried to legally immigrate here and 65k were accepted. Is that higher or lower than 12%?

1.4 million Mexicans waiting to legally immigrate into U.S., only 65,600 were allowed in | AL.com


Again, if sneaking across the border is your best shot at the American dream, then the alternative probably isn't very realistic, right?
 
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#68
#68
n_huffhines said:
What makes you think I didn't get that?

the fact that you just singled out 12%, when I presented more information showing it shouldn't just be 12% for your "no shot" number.

You're talking about EVERYONE. You're talking about a group that includes a doctor from Sweden (who will be just fine with or without the American dream). I'm talking about our neighbors, who don't have a realistic chance.

With the 2013 data, Mexicans were 12.7% of those being naturalized, according to you that is a small enough number not to matter. now if you looked at the whole data you see it is pretty even across who gets taken. life aint fair, being rich generally gives you a better shot at life, getting into the US is no different.

Why don't Mexicans just apply for citizenship? | Immigration | Dallas News

This shows in 2011 that 1.4M Mexicans tried to legally immigrate here and 65k were accepted. Is that higher or lower than 12%? my numbers from the government show that number should be well over 100k no 65k in your article. no clue what Trump has done, but I am guessing he is cutting down across the board. you are also just looking at naturalization, not green cards and others.

1.4 million Mexicans waiting to legally immigrate into U.S., only 65,600 were allowed in | AL.com


Again, if sneaking across the border is your best shot at the American dream, then the alternative probably isn't very realistic, right?
Click to expand...

at least 50% of those applying are already here, there legal status has nothing to do with them having a chance at the dream. if American citizenship isn't the dream then I would argue they could get their dream anywhere. its not like when they cross over they are handed a job, welfare, housing and everything else. they have to work for it. plenty of places they could go for that.
 
#70
#70
n_huffhines said:
What makes you think I didn't get that?



You're talking about EVERYONE. You're talking about a group that includes a doctor from Sweden (who will be just fine with or without the American dream). I'm talking about our neighbors, who don't have a realistic chance.



Why don't Mexicans just apply for citizenship? | Immigration | Dallas News

This shows in 2011 that 1.4M Mexicans tried to legally immigrate here and 65k were accepted. Is that higher or lower than 12%?

1.4 million Mexicans waiting to legally immigrate into U.S., only 65,600 were allowed in | AL.com


Again, if sneaking across the border is your best shot at the American dream, then the alternative probably isn't very realistic, right?
Click to expand...

65k too high.
 
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#71
#71
Happy 4th

In before "but they didn't have a welfare state" - people that don't vote for fiscal responsibility
 

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#72
#72
n_huffhines said:
Happy 4th

In before "but they didn't have a welfare state" - people that don't vote for fiscal responsibility
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Happy 4th back!

And happy 4th to all of our legal immigrant citizens and permanent residents who respected our laws and immigrated lawfully. May you all reach the prosperity level you dreamed of and drove you to work lawfully to get here!
 
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#73
#73
NorthDallas40 said:
Happy 4th back!

And happy 4th to all of our legal immigrant citizens and permanent residents who respected our laws and immigrated lawfully. May you all reach the prosperity level you dreamed of and drove you to work lawfully to get here!
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You forgot, happy 4th to the very unlawful founders and revolutionaries. Today is not about the law, bro. Save your worship for Sundays.
 
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#74
#74
n_huffhines said:
You forgot, happy 4th to the very unlawful founders and revolutionaries. Today is not about worshipping the law, bro. Save your worship for Sundays.
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Your words not mine. I stand by my post as written.

And you’re really posting a highly level of dumbassery content this morning. Got desert fever?

You’re basically saying we are a nation founded in lawlessness and thus should remain lawless?

I counter we are a nation founded by people who stood up for their basic unalienable rights. And once they won their freedom they established their own form of government and basic law framework.

unalienable - Dictionary Definition : Vocabulary.com
 
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#75
#75
I didn't say we are founded in lawlessness. I am saying our origin is a rebellious one. Boot licking law worshippers like yourself tend to forget this.
 
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