obama to raise taxes by 5% on people who earn over $1 mil to pay for his healthcare

[wellway16]

so you have psudo gov't job. that explains a bit.

wait so people forced these people to buy homes the couldnt' afford? and the lenders didn't care if these people to default on their loans? countrywide wanted to go bankrupt i guess. and i suppose the democrats forcing fannie and freddie to lower standards to lend ot low imcome people wasn't any part of the problem?

and what evidence do you have that the middle class has been eroding since reagonomics? the fact they currently have the highest standard of living in any country ever?

The one thing that has been proven that Gov't does better than the private sector is electricity......ask anyone who lives in the Tennessee Valley if they would rather have TVA or some hack de-reg company raping them silly every month. There aren't any blackouts here......

And TVA has their flaws too, but that .07/kWh with the occasional FCA ain't bad.

You obviously missed my statement that there was blame to go around, but to absolve the lenders of the yeomans share of the blame is misguided....they are the experts. The Gov't deserves blame too (Clinton and Bush), but maybe if we weren't so busy abroad, some of these domestic issues could have been taken care of. Bush had the same mandate Obama has for six years, and other than one tax cut (that because of Iraq was stupid in retrospect), I can't think of one domestic topic unrelated to terrorism that was TOUCHED during his terms!

The middle class is eroding, because their jobs are....may not show up statistically in 2009, but its happening. We're lucky to have a high standard of living, in comparison to other nations, but we're not other nations.......we are The United States of America.

We're better than this crap that's going on.

 

[T-TownVol]

I work in the electrical utility business.....we're all about conservation and efficiency today, but we can change stripes and go back to pure generation and transmission at any time.

Everytime each of us hits the light switch.....I get a measure of security.

You are factual on the home market being flooded with marginal buyers, but who sold them the bill of goods on the dream.....that was a bipartisan bill passed in the late 1990's by Phil Gramm and some other senator that helped facilitate this mess....but the mortgage lenders were as sleazy as used cars salesmen/credit card providers.

There is blame to go around, but I like to assign more to the idiots that knew better and preyed on weakness....those would be the greedy a**** lenders. They knew this was a slippery slope and went along with it anyways.

And on BigPapa's point, obviously our strength is compromised with the economic downturn.....but I would argue that this economy was strongest when there was a swelling of the middle class......which has been slowly eroding since Reaganomics.

now apply this statement to what our current administration is doing

 

[T-TownVol]

The one thing that has been proven that Gov't does better than the private sector is electricity......ask anyone who lives in the Tennessee Valley if they would rather have TVA or some hack de-reg company raping them silly every month. There aren't any blackouts here......

And TVA has their flaws too, but that .07/kWh with the occasional FCA ain't bad.

You obviously missed my statement that there was blame to go around, but to absolve the lenders of the yeomans share of the blame is misguided....they are the experts. The Gov't deserves blame too (Clinton and Bush), but maybe if we weren't so busy abroad, some of these domestic issues could have been taken care of. Bush had the same mandate Obama has for six years, and other than one tax cut (that because of Iraq was stupid in retrospect), I can't think of one domestic topic unrelated to terrorism that was TOUCHED during his terms!

The middle class is eroding, because their jobs are....may not show up statistically in 2009, but its happening. We're lucky to have a high standard of living, in comparison to other nations, but we're not other nations.......we are The United States of America.

We're better than this crap that's going on.

It is not the job of the government to "take care of" taking my money to give to other people.
My charitible contributions are so high that I gate flagged every year on my return. I know where that money is going and I know for sure that the people that I help truly need it. BHO needs to keep his hands out of my wallet.

 

[wellway16]

so you have psudo gov't job. that explains a bit.

wait so people forced these people to buy homes the couldnt' afford? and the lenders didn't care if these people to default on their loans? countrywide wanted to go bankrupt i guess. and i suppose the democrats forcing fannie and freddie to lower standards to lend ot low imcome people wasn't any part of the problem?

and what evidence do you have that the middle class has been eroding since reagonomics? the fact they currently have the highest standard of living in any country ever?

It is not the job of the government to "take care of" taking my money to give to other people.
My charitible contributions are so high that I gate flagged every year on my return. I know where that money is going and I know for sure that the people that I help truly need it. BHO needs to keep his hands out of my wallet.

So,

You are one of these minimal gov't....don't want to pay for anything but essential services guys??

How does that work in any equitable fashion.....I respect anyone who makes charitable donations, as it appears you do...but what about those in need who may not fit into a niche....

Let me state, that I think we need reform in welfare, for instance. I do see Obama having some really good ideas on how to make the public education system more accountable...whether his ideas take flight with the unions fighting him, IDK, but he talks a really good game on that subject with some bipartisan support.

I won't argue with you that gov't programs have the propensity to be wasteful and taxation can be ugly....but what better way is there to do it in a nation of 305 million people?

I would LOVE to know.....I'm young and not set in my ways...give me a better way to fish, and I'll utilize it.

I just see a lot of people griping, but no one has the sensible solution for any of it.

 

[T-TownVol]

So,

You are one of these minimal gov't....don't want to pay for anything but essential services guys??

How does that work in any equitable fashion.....I respect anyone who makes charitable donations, as it appears you do...but what about those in need who may not fit into a niche....

Let me state, that I think we need reform in welfare, for instance. I do see Obama having some really good ideas on how to make the public education system more accountable...whether his ideas take flight with the unions fighting him, IDK, but he talks a really good game on that subject with some bipartisan support.

I won't argue with you that gov't programs have the propensity to be wasteful and taxation can be ugly....but what better way is there to do it in a nation of 305 million people?

I would LOVE to know.....I'm young and not set in my ways...give me a better way to fish, and I'll utilize it.

I just see a lot of people griping, but no one has the sensible solution for any of it.

Bottom line....NOTHING, even your precious TVA, that government takes over is better off...as you get older you will realize that you will want and demand more control over your own money.
The solution is as old as time.....if people are not dependant on others...they will depend on themselves.
I have more faith in people making their own way, than the government making it for them, thus causing a dependance on government.

"Equitable" is a socialist term.

 

[droski]

So,

You are one of these minimal gov't....don't want to pay for anything but essential services guys??

How does that work in any equitable fashion.....I respect anyone who makes charitable donations, as it appears you do...but what about those in need who may not fit into a niche....

Let me state, that I think we need reform in welfare, for instance. I do see Obama having some really good ideas on how to make the public education system more accountable...whether his ideas take flight with the unions fighting him, IDK, but he talks a really good game on that subject with some bipartisan support.

I won't argue with you that gov't programs have the propensity to be wasteful and taxation can be ugly....but what better way is there to do it in a nation of 305 million people?

I would LOVE to know.....I'm young and not set in my ways...give me a better way to fish, and I'll utilize it.

I just see a lot of people griping, but no one has the sensible solution for any of it.

you can't seriously think obama would take on the teachers unions do you? this is a guy who just violated 200 years of us bankruptcy laws to hand the auto makers to the unions.

 

[wellway16]

Bottom line....NOTHING, even your precious TVA, that government takes over is better off...as you get older you will realize that you will want and demand more control over your own money.
The solution is as old as time.....if people are not dependant on others...they will depend on themselves.
I have more faith in people making their own way, than the government making it for them, thus causing a dependance on government.

"Equitable" is a socialist term.

See, you are just uttering the Rush/Hannity/Fox company line now.....I asked a realistic question, and you gave me an oft-rehearsed line of the Right Wing.

You guys don't have the answer either!! Let's just eliminate welfare, schools, and every gov't program and see what level of mayhem would ensue.....

 

[droski]

Let's just eliminate welfare, schools, and every gov't program and see what level of mayhem would ensue.....

link where anyone said anythign like that? we already have among the highest tax rates in the world and with obama's tax plan will have the second highest maximum income tax in the world. do you really think taxes being too low is the problem? maybe the middle class isn't paying enough of our taxes.

 

[KB5252]

See, you are just uttering the Rush/Hannity/Fox company line now.....I asked a realistic question, and you gave me an oft-rehearsed line of the Right Wing.

You guys don't have the answer either!! Let's just eliminate welfare, schools, and every gov't program and see what level of mayhem would ensue.....

You have just pointed out a big problem with entitlement, welfare and social programs. Once they are implemented they are just short of impossible to get rid of, even when they are shown to be a failure. When you give people a benefit, especially when it is unearned, the people begin to believe it is their right to receive this benefit.

 

[wellway16]

and what skill do you have exactly? a plummer?

and last time i checked the me me me attitude that crapped out this economy came from the poor people buying homes they couldn't afford.

this same "Marie Antionette" attitude in this country (as you call it) created the richest middle class in the world. you assign the rich too much power in your life clearly. gone are the day of kings and queens who have power over the poor. if anything in this country the rich are raped by the poor, not the other way around.

link where anyone said anythign like that? we already have among the highest tax rates in the world and with obama's tax plan will have the second highest maximum income tax in the world. do you really think taxes being too low is the problem? maybe the middle class isn't paying enough of our taxes.

You have just pointed out a big problem with entitlement, welfare and social programs. Once they are implemented they are just short of impossible to get rid of, even when they are shown to be a failure. When you give people a benefit, especially when it is unearned, the people begin to believe it is their right to receive this benefit.

Like I said, I am all for welfare reform....the people receiving benefit should have some stipulations...

Schools.....I hope to goodness we don't do away with schooling for all children. I do think that citizens owe all kids an opportunity to better themselves via education.

I won't argue that there are a ton of "filler" programs that should be eliminated or at least audited for viability, but we probably waste more money over in the sandbox, than we do on these programs.

 

[wellway16]

link where anyone said anythign like that? we already have among the highest tax rates in the world and with obama's tax plan will have the second highest maximum income tax in the world. do you really think taxes being too low is the problem? maybe the middle class isn't paying enough of our taxes.

May be stating the obvious here, but this is a numbers game, pure and simple. The Max income tax affects a SMALL percentage of the population DIRECTLY.

Now, it can have trickle-down ramifications, as it pertains to employment levels, but I suppose it is easier to grab from them, than the next level down, because of numbers and the political backlash from cracking the middle class with more taxation.

Like I said, I hope to one day have the problems of those in the max tax bracket......starting on my MBA in 4 weeks to get closer to the goal.

 

[droski]

May be stating the obvious here, but this is a numbers game, pure and simple. The Max income tax affects a SMALL percentage of the population DIRECTLY.

Now, it can have trickle-down ramifications, as it pertains to employment levels, but I suppose it is easier to grab from them, than the next level down, because of numbers and the political backlash from cracking the middle class with more taxation.

Like I said, I hope to one day have the problems of those in the max tax bracket......starting on my MBA in 4 weeks to get closer to the goal.

why do we need more taxation for anyone?

 

[T-TownVol]

See, you are just uttering the Rush/Hannity/Fox company line now.....I asked a realistic question, and you gave me an oft-rehearsed line of the Right Wing.

You guys don't have the answer either!! Let's just eliminate welfare, schools, and every gov't program and see what level of mayhem would ensue.....

horseshat....I "utterred" my PERSONAL line. I promise you that I am FAR more conservative than any you mention.
the crap you are "utterring" is absolutely the reason that this country is in shambles.
I gave you a very real answer to the problem, you choose not to beleive it.
Take ALL entitlements away!

 

[T-TownVol]

May be stating the obvious here, but this is a numbers game, pure and simple. The Max income tax affects a SMALL percentage of the population DIRECTLY.
Now, it can have trickle-down ramifications, as it pertains to employment levels, but I suppose it is easier to grab from them, than the next level down, because of numbers and the political backlash from cracking the middle class with more taxation.

Like I said, I hope to one day have the problems of those in the max tax bracket......starting on my MBA in 4 weeks to get closer to the goal.

and we should pay the biggest percentage of our income....why? what you say here is not a reason.

 

[MG1968]

if we had a Fair Tax...

 

[BigPapaVol]

May be stating the obvious here, but this is a numbers game, pure and simple. The Max income tax affects a SMALL percentage of the population DIRECTLY.

Now, it can have trickle-down ramifications, as it pertains to employment levels, but I suppose it is easier to grab from them, than the next level down, because of numbers and the political backlash from cracking the middle class with more taxation.

Like I said, I hope to one day have the problems of those in the max tax bracket......starting on my MBA in 4 weeks to get closer to the goal.

supporting a govt driven theft scheme because it's more politically palatable is exactly why politicians and socialists suck. We have been warned for generations that this would be our downfall and it is proving true.

 

[BigPapaVol]

And on BigPapa's point, obviously our strength is compromised with the economic downturn.....but I would argue that this economy was strongest when there was a swelling of the middle class......which has been slowly eroding since Reaganomics.

on every front, this is dead wrong. The middle class has simply gotten wealthier. What has eroded is the embarrassment over bilking our government and any control the pols had in giving away money for votes.

 

[wellway16]

horseshat....I "utterred" my PERSONAL line. I promise you that I am FAR more conservative than any you mention.
the crap you are "utterring" is absolutely the reason that this country is in shambles.
I gave you a very real answer to the problem, you choose not to beleive it.
Take ALL entitlements away!

No sir, the horseshat you spew on here is that elitist, country club mentality that permeates the Good Ole Boy Party, out to show the world that you are the victim, when in reality, you have all the good cards in hand and always have. I suggest that a lot of people, not just you, step off the manicured golf course communities for a day or two and reintroduce themselves to their country. Your reality isn't reality for 90 percent of Americans. I'm not just talking welfare folks either. Hard working people of all walks are living in perilous states right now. Taxes suck, but they are what they are.
Posted via VolNation Mobile

 

[droski]

No sir, the horseshat you spew on here is that elitist, country club mentality that permeates the Good Ole Boy Party, out to show the world that you are the victim, when in reality, you have all the good cards in hand and always have. I suggest that a lot of people, not just you, step off the manicured golf course communities for a day or two and reintroduce themselves to their country. Your reality isn't reality for 90 percent of Americans. I'm not just talking welfare folks either. Hard working people of all walks are living in perilous states right now. Taxes suck, but they are what they are.
Posted via VolNation Mobile

right. the world has just dealt those other people a worse hand right? those making millions are just lucky.

 

[utvolpj]

No sir, the horseshat you spew on here is that elitist, country club mentality that permeates the Good Ole Boy Party, out to show the world that you are the victim, when in reality, you have all the good cards in hand and always have. I suggest that a lot of people, not just you, step off the manicured golf course communities for a day or two and reintroduce themselves to their country. Your reality isn't reality for 90 percent of Americans. I'm not just talking welfare folks either. Hard working people of all walks are living in perilous states right now. Taxes suck, but they are what they are.
Posted via VolNation Mobile

wow, funny how you tell people to step into the real US while just assuming anyone who believes they should keep the money they earn is living on East St. It's sad that the "woe is me" mentality has been allowed to permeate US society.

 

[OrangeEmpire]

Like I said, I am all for welfare reform....the people receiving benefit should have some stipulations...

Schools.....I hope to goodness we don't do away with schooling for all children. I do think that citizens owe all kids an opportunity to better themselves via education.

I won't argue that there are a ton of "filler" programs that should be eliminated or at least audited for viability, but we probably waste more money over in the sandbox, than we do on these programs.

This explains every thing...

:banghead2:

 

[utvolpj]

This explains every thing...

:banghead2:

of course it does. The new lib belief is that none of this would ever have happened if it wasn't for the money we spend in Iraq. Nevermind that we're now spending $1.2mil in bailout funds on pork (not the Senate version but the real stuff)

 

[T-TownVol]

No sir, the horseshat you spew on here is that elitist, country club mentality that permeates the Good Ole Boy Party, out to show the world that you are the victim, when in reality, you have all the good cards in hand and always have. I suggest that a lot of people, not just you, step off the manicured golf course communities for a day or two and reintroduce themselves to their country. Your reality isn't reality for 90 percent of Americans. I'm not just talking welfare folks either. Hard working people of all walks are living in perilous states right now. Taxes suck, but they are what they are.
Posted via VolNation Mobile

at-a-boy....show your true colors
hate the wealthy!!!!!
i knew i could bring it out of ya.

 

[T-TownVol]

right. the world has just dealt those other people a worse hand right? those making millions are just lucky.

or maybe....just maybe....their family grew up share croppers and they worked their ass off to make a good living

 

[OrangeEmpire]

Damn you T-Town for not wanting to get up every day and work for people who have no desire to contribute to society!

Damn you!