Oklahoma hospital shooting

#76
#76
evillawyer said:
Amazing that we live in a country where you can wake up and say, "You know, I'd like to buy a gun and shoot a place up today. That sounds fun," and 35% of the country--and you know which 35% it is-- thinks you should have that right. 'Murica, MAGA, Freedumb, etc etc.

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You could do that with anything. Innocent until proven guilty.
 
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#78
#78
OHvol40 said:
Putting myself in a teacher’s shoes, for instance, I’m free to carry a gun into a school but I’m not free to choose the books for my classroom or tell my students who I’m married to. Is that the kind of freedom we’re talking about?
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Since the creation of the federal DOE have teachers had the freedom to choose what books to use and why would a teacher have need to discuss their personal life?
 
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#79
#79
OHvol40 said:
Putting myself in a teacher’s shoes, for instance, I’m free to carry a gun into a school but I’m not free to choose the books for my classroom or tell my students who I’m married to. Is that the kind of freedom we’re talking about?
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Then get the government out of the classroom. Teachers and parents should be in charge of the curriculum, not some bureaucrat in Washington. Who gives a single **** who you’re married to?
 
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#80
#80
OHvol40 said:
Putting myself in a teacher’s shoes, for instance, I’m free to carry a gun into a school but I’m not free to choose the books for my classroom or tell my students who I’m married to. Is that the kind of freedom we’re talking about?
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I wasn't free to do a lot of things my employer didn't allow when I was working, and I was also free to work somewhere else if I didn't like it.
 
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#82
#82
OHvol40 said:
Putting myself in a teacher’s shoes, for instance, I’m free to carry a gun into a school but I’m not free to choose the books for my classroom or tell my students who I’m married to. Is that the kind of freedom we’re talking about?
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You believe that front line teachers get to choose the books and materials for their classrooms? 😂
and who cares who teachers have sex with? I didn’t give a crap about that when I was in school
 
#84
#84
OHvol40 said:
Putting myself in a teacher’s shoes, for instance, I’m free to carry a gun into a school but I’m not free to choose the books for my classroom or tell my students who I’m married to. Is that the kind of freedom we’re talking about?
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For what reason can you conceive that an adult should be discussing thier personal sex life with a child??
 
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#85
#85
whodeycin85 said:
For what reason can you conceive that an adult should be discussing thier personal sex life with a child??
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For the record, your comment is the rationale that my wife's grandmother had to fight to stay in the classroom when she was pregnant with my father in law. The belief at the time was that seeing a pregnant woman would cause students to develop interest in sex and pregnancy.

She won her court case and Tennessee Code Annotated changed as a result. She taught until just before it was time to deliver.

There's going to be implicit education going on whether or not there's explicit education. If you want to kill discussion altogether then ban individuals from wearing wedding rings, ban pregnant women from teaching, disallow teachers from having family pictures at their desks. Make it a punishable offense for students to talk about their families. I could continue to find areas where implicit education takes place and address those.

Ultimately, students are going to learn about these things one way or another. I was taught at home and church that all gays were predators who just wanted to get in my pants and pull me away from God. I tried to get laid in college my freshman year just to prove how straight I was seeing as how God forgives people who have hetero sex, especially if they're men. (The women, of course, were just whores according to my pastor at the time.).

We can either approach sex education through rigorous academic standards and give students a solid grounding that is religion neutral (as opposed to anti-religion, which is just as horrible a way to go) or we can continue to try to pass off hard things to people who may or may not have any clue what they're talking about and make things far worse.
 
#86
#86
mr.checkerboards said:
I have many questions about the pain stuff. Did doc not prescribe because he normally didn't? Did he not for some other reason? Did patient have a past history leading to doctor not to prescribe? Did doctor prescribe and patient went through all that was prescribed too quickly and doctor refused to add more?
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AshG said:
Each one of your questions is very legitimate.
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Legitimate to what? Shooter didn't get the meds he wanted or thought he needed so he killed a bunch of people? Just trying to understand what those questions have to do with it other than setting up victim for taking some of the fault for this.
 
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#87
#87
volkyries said:
Legitimate to what? Shooter didn't get the meds he wanted or thought he needed so he killed a bunch of people? Just trying to understand what those questions have to do with it other than setting up victim for taking some of the fault for this.
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I'm absolutely not setting up any of the victims to bear fault.

What's the highest pain you've ever had to tolerate (1 being none, 10 being so intense you pass out) for days on end? Whether or not the doctor over or under prescribed pain management is not the issue. The issue is that the pain was so intensely bad that it caused the shooter to lose his grip on right and wrong and attempt to alleviate the pain however possible. It just so happens he chose very, very poorly.
 
#88
#88
AshG said:
I'm absolutely not setting up any of the victims to bear fault.

What's the highest pain you've ever had to tolerate (1 being none, 10 being so intense you pass out) for days on end? Whether or not the doctor over or under prescribed pain management is not the issue. The issue is that the pain was so intensely bad that it caused the shooter to lose his grip on right and wrong and attempt to alleviate the pain however possible. It just so happens he chose very, very poorly.
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I get that pain can be debilitating and can cause people to act irrationally, but all of those questions were pointing the doctor's actions (prescribing or not) as being in question. Pain management techniques (correct or incorrectly applied) not working don't equal murdering someone no matter how you slice it.
 
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#89
#89
volkyries said:
I get that pain can be debilitating and can cause people to act irrationally, but all of those questions were pointing the doctor's actions (prescribing or not) as being in question. Pain management techniques (correct or incorrectly applied) not working don't equal murdering someone no matter how you slice it.
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The shooter apparently didn't have anyone to keep an eye on him during his home convalescence.

Also, I have taken myself off of medications because they made me violent. I will never take Tramadol or gabapentin again. Luckily my wife was around to tell me how I was changing and talked to my doctor about what she was seeing.
 
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#90
#90
OHvol40 said:
Putting myself in a teacher’s shoes, for instance, I’m free to carry a gun into a school but I’m not free to choose the books for my classroom or tell my students who I’m married to. Is that the kind of freedom we’re talking about?
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Is that your version comparing gun deaths and auto deaths?
 
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#91
#91
volkyries said:
Legitimate to what? Shooter didn't get the meds he wanted or thought he needed so he killed a bunch of people? Just trying to understand what those questions have to do with it other than setting up victim for taking some of the fault for this.
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It doesn't justify anything. What happened was wrong, just my curiosity as to the why
 
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#92
#92
AshG said:
Post-op pain adds a whole new dimension to this. The desperation for the physical pain to end is mind-destroying. Absolutely does not excuse what he did, though. There are options to take care of the pain.
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As I sit here typing this I’m still dealing with four bulging discs, two have impinged on the sciatic nerve where I have had both numbness and continual acute pain for multiple weeks so much that I haven’t slept a night thru in about four weeks now. The pain is no longer acute but I still can’t sleep the night thru. Been on muscle relaxers and pain killers for multiple weeks.

At no time have I thought about killing my care givers or myself. The pain discussion is a red herring here. This guy was nuts and violent plain and simple.
 
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#93
#93
AshG said:
I'm absolutely not setting up any of the victims to bear fault.

What's the highest pain you've ever had to tolerate (1 being none, 10 being so intense you pass out) for days on end? Whether or not the doctor over or under prescribed pain management is not the issue. The issue is that the pain was so intensely bad that it caused the shooter to lose his grip on right and wrong and attempt to alleviate the pain however possible. It just so happens he chose very, very poorly.
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He was ambulatory enough to go out and buy two guns and get himself to the hospital to kill four people.
 
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#95
#95
Of course there is no media coverage of the attempted graduation mass shooting in West Virginia that was stopped before it started by a woman with a gun permit......and the suspect was black so......
 
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#96
#96
Hoosier_Vol said:
Of course there is no media coverage of the attempted graduation mass shooting in West Virginia that was stopped before it started by a woman with a gun permit......and the suspect was black so......
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How did you hear about it?
 
#99
#99
OHvol40 said:
Putting myself in a teacher’s shoes, for instance, I’m free to carry a gun into a school but I’m not free to choose the books for my classroom or tell my students who I’m married to. Is that the kind of freedom we’re talking about?
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how to prove without a doubt that you have no concept of the 2A
 
#100
#100
AshG said:
I'm absolutely not setting up any of the victims to bear fault.

What's the highest pain you've ever had to tolerate (1 being none, 10 being so intense you pass out) for days on end? Whether or not the doctor over or under prescribed pain management is not the issue. The issue is that the pain was so intensely bad that it caused the shooter to lose his grip on right and wrong and attempt to alleviate the pain however possible. It just so happens he chose very, very poorly.
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You can't be serious.
 
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