Oklahoma hospital shooting

#126
#126
hog88 said:
Just like your job teachers are free to use their own techniques and individuality as long as the lessons are within the parameters of the approved curriculum.
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Uh huh, but should we apply the same parameters and approved curriculum of, say, operating a motor vehicle: to firearms?
 
#132
#132
OHvol40 said:
Lol, I thought they were omnipotent and could foresee everything, even 250 years in the future… so I’ve been told.
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Nobody ever told you that the FF were omnipotent. You have been told that they were were smart enough to warn us against big government and to give us the levers to changes anything we didn’t like about our constitution. It’s always fascinating to me that its the the pro 2a people that are the ones that will except the constitution being ratified and will tell you that repeatedly.
 
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#134
#134
OHvol40 said:
Lol, I thought they were omnipotent and could foresee everything, even 250 years in the future… so I’ve been told.
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Nobody told you anything of the sort. The FFs were brilliant enough to give us mechanisms to change the constitution, they had the foresight to make any changes hard because they probably knew that is amending it were easy it would happen almost every time congress changed hands.
 
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#136
#136
hog88 said:
Completely moving the goalposts I see but go on, explain WTF you are talking about.
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I’m not moving any goalposts, I’m pointing out the hypocrisy that you are apparently missing completely.
 
#139
#139
OHvol40 said:
I wouldn’t expect your civics teacher to do that, because, well, it’s nonsense 😂. We get the “slippery slope” argument from 2A absolutist nuts on here all the time, so why don’t they apply the same logic to books? I’ll give you two guesses, but I bet you’ll only need one.
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Uhhhh, I've kinda stumbled onto more than I wanted to take on.

I'm answering in quote boxes so as not to leave walls of text in the thread.

So I'll divide my answer and take both guesses you gave me.
PART ONE - CRT
I'll state on the front end I don't think a teacher should be allowed to autonomously decide what books and curriculum resources to utilize, but I'll insist they should be able to recommend virtually any book the 1st amendment allows to be published.

I neither revere nor denigrate teachers and think my suggestion puts the capacity of a teacher’s outreach and influence on the efficacy of their teaching and not the doldrums of their position as a bully pulpit.

So if a 10th grade Social Studies, Civics, History, or whatever kind of public school teacher wants to help their class better understand civil unrest during the 60's and 70's, the teacher should feel completely free to recommend Abbie Hoffman's:'Steal This Book', without fear of repercussion.

Then only 2-3 students, out of his public school class of 30, will get exposed to the dangerous anarchic ideas like:
Shoplift cereal, make rice crispie treats, and live with your friends in an abandoned warehouse to bankrupt the establishment's war machine
And they'll be the few students actually smart enough to recognize it as a snapshot of the era's counter culture.

If the teacher is actually dumb enough to make the dirty hippies' book required reading, instead of recommended reading, then it's his own fault when the 27-28 idiot students and their even dumber parents are outraged about the leftist extremist teacher 'leading the insurgency!'

I think I just described about 80% of the publics issues with CRT in schools.

I don't really care if a teacher recommends the (questionable IMHO) '1619 Project', but until they've vetted and pushed it through the school text book publishing rackets, they shouldn't require it as part of the curriculum. I have no issues with controversial topics being taught, but I don't think they should be presented without BoTh SiDeS. 1619 will make it through and be taught in schools eventuality, there's too much $$ behind it as a NYT's project not to. It won't make it through without some Historian's academic objections being noted, as it shouldn't given the amount of revisionism it contains.

PART TWO - SEX
Because sex shouldn't be taught outside of reproductive capacity, risk of disease, and risk of infection starting late middle school or higher up. Outside of that, it's the parents responsibility.

After the reproductive aspect, potential disease and infections are taught, show the terrifying videos.

Then let hormones continue their so far undefeated course, in spite of the terrifying videos we all watched in sex ed.

I don't really care what any two consenting adults do with their sexuality.
I think for the most part every individual discovers their sexuality inately through blundering 1st hand life experience.

No matter how clinical and sterile the environment, altruistic and good the intentions are,.... an adult teaching sexuality to minors is cringe and creepy.

99.9% of the time, an adult teaching sexuality to children who haven't reached puberty is purely degenerate.
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#140
#140
hog88 said:
Please explain my hypocrisy because I'm not seeing the correlation between the two subjects.
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Lol, you tried to correlate my job to teachers, I see guns compared to cars on this forum constantly as “tools”, but you can’t understand the correlation between cars and guns in this instance?
 
#141
#141
MemphisVol77 said:
Uhhhh, I've kinda stumbled onto more than I wanted to take on.

I'm answering in quote boxes so as not to leave walls of text in the thread.

So I'll divide my answer and take both guesses you gave me.
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Thanks for the thoughtful reply. I will ask, simply, if you had to guess, what percentage of public school educators are teaching/desire to teach CRT and/or sexuality beyond biological aspects?

Just attempting to point out the selective “freedom” some here speak of. It seems they are only interested in ideas of unfettered freedom when it suits their personal interests.
 
#142
#142
OHvol40 said:
Lol, you tried to correlate my job to teachers, I see guns compared to cars on this forum constantly as “tools”, but you can’t understand the correlation between cars and guns in this instance?
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Ahh I see where you were going now.

First, teachers are employees just like you are an employee (I could have used Joe the ditch digger instead of you) as a comparison. All employees in every job I can think of has standards, procedures and policies they must adhere to while doing their jobs, teachers are no different. They have a curriculum to follow (should be set no higher than state level preferably county level) so they can't just teach any 'ol thing they want any way they want as you said they should be able to. Would you want a science teacher teaching the 7 day creation story as fact?

Second, the main thing you see about cars v guns is when the gun grabbers bring up the "you don't need" fallacy. "You don't need an AR15 to hunt so you shouldn't be allowed to have one" the response is "you don't need a Corvette that goes 150mph to get your groceries so you shouldn't be allowed to have one". So it's an apples to oranges discussion between the teachers and curriculum to the cars and guns discussion.

I see no hypocrisy in my statements at all.
 
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#143
#143
hog88 said:
Ahh I see where you were going now.

First, teachers are employees just like you are an employee (I could have used Joe the ditch digger instead of you) as a comparison. All employees in every job I can think of has standards, procedures and policies they must adhere to while doing their jobs, teachers are no different. They have a curriculum to follow (should be set no higher than state level preferably county level) so they can't just teach any 'ol thing they want any way they want as you said they should be able to. Would you want a science teacher teaching the 7 day creation story as fact?

Second, the main thing you see about cars v guns is when the gun grabbers bring up the "you don't need" fallacy. "You don't need an AR15 to hunt so you shouldn't be allowed to have one" the response is "you don't need a Corvette that goes 150mph to get your groceries so you shouldn't be allowed to have one". So it's an apples to oranges discussion between the teachers and curriculum to the cars and guns discussion.

I see no hypocrisy in my statements at all.
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No, the comparison between cars and guns that I’ve seen most is that both are tools used by people and that both are deadly. I agree with this much, but vehicles are far more regulated than guns and in almost all instances serve a different utility than killing or maiming. This is a paradox.
 
#144
#144
OHvol40 said:
Thanks for the thoughtful reply. I will ask, simply, if you had to guess, what percentage of public school educators are teaching/desire to teach CRT and/or sexuality beyond biological aspects?

Just attempting to point out the selective “freedom” some here speak of. It seems they are only interested in ideas of unfettered freedom when it suits their personal interests.
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Ughhh...... my perception of perception......

Well way back in long long ago when I was in school, the 90's. I'd say it was 5% CRT and 2% sexuality beyond biology.
CRT scores high because we had a just graduated from Vandy, 22 yr old in his first year as a teacher (U.S. History) woke stereotype. The first day of class he took it upon himself to rename his class, Perspectives of U.S. History. I'm not certain why, but report cards still just said U.S. History.
He was a little cheesey but actually an alright dude. Completely non threatening and no radical threat to democracy.

Based on limited conversations with the few teachers I know and have known over the past 25 odd years, I'd say it's probably around 8-10% CRT and 3-5% sexuality now.

If I only used social media I'd guess it was 25% and 15% though........
 
#145
#145
OHvol40 said:
No, the comparison between cars and guns that I’ve seen most is that both are tools used by people and that both are deadly. I agree with this much, but vehicles are far more regulated than guns and in almost all instances serve a different utility than killing or maiming. This is a paradox.
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Do you have to have a BGC to by and/or operate a vehicle?
Can you take a gun to school?
What's the minimum age to buy a vehicle?
Can a felon possess a vehicle?
Can I take a my gun into NYC legally?
 
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#147
#147
hog88 said:
Do you have to have a BGC to by and/or operate a vehicle?
Can you take a gun to school?
What's the minimum age to buy a vehicle?
Can a felon possess a vehicle?
Can I take a my gun into NYC legally?
Click to expand...
Those are very specific points, here, let me give you some general, universal points:

Can you operate a gun without a license?
Can you own and operate a gun without education?
Can you operate a gun without a written test?
Can you operate a gun without a practical test?
Can you operate a gun without insurance?
Can you operate a gun with physical limitations?
Can you operate a gun without registering it yearly with the state?
Can you operate a gun without renewals and inspections?
 
#148
#148
OHvol40 said:
Those are very specific points, here, let me give you some general, universal points:

Can you operate a gun without a license?
Can you own and operate a gun without education?
Can you operate a gun without a written test?
Can you operate a gun without a practical test?
Can you operate a gun without insurance?
Can you operate a gun with physical limitations?
Can you operate a gun without registering it yearly with the state?
Can you operate a gun without renewals and inspections?
Click to expand...

You can do pretty much all of that with a car as long as you don't take it on a public road.
 
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#149
#149
OHvol40 said:
Those are very specific points, here, let me give you some general, universal points:

Can you operate a gun without a license?
Can you own and operate a gun without education?
Can you operate a gun without a written test?
Can you operate a gun without a practical test?
Can you operate a gun without insurance?
Can you operate a gun with physical limitations?
Can you operate a gun without registering it yearly with the state?
Can you operate a gun without renewals and inspections?
Click to expand...

Can you operate a gun without a license? Yes and you can also operate a car without one.
Can you own and operate a gun without education? Yes and same goes with a car
Can you operate a gun without a written test? yes and same goes with a car
Can you operate a gun without a practical test? See the 3 above
Can you operate a gun without insurance? Same as the 4 above
Can you operate a gun with physical limitations? Depends on those limitations
Can you operate a gun without registering it yearly with the state? See 1st 3
Can you operate a gun without renewals and inspections? See 1st 3
 
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