Penn State scandal (merged)

There seems to be a pattern he that everyone assumes that Paterno should have been the only competent adult on that campus; that he should have perceived everyone else as incapable of doing anything. An adult does not need Paterno to take his hand and walk him to the police station. An adult does not need Paterno to constantly monitor him when he has told Paterno that he would investigate the report.

If Paterno's downfall is that he trusted people, I do not see that as morally abhorrent. Some could certainly make the claim that it is naive and ideal, but trusting individuals is certainly not wicked, evil, or ego-centric.

I don't think Paterno was the only one who should have done something, but he most certainly is one who could have.

He does not deny he got information about the incident. He is disputing the details of said information. He can't believe both parties. How does he allow both of them to be around the program for this long?

Do you think he he did the right thing by keeping them both around?
 
I do not jump to this conclusion. According to the GJ indictment, it is a fact that Paterno reported it up; it is a fact that Curley told Paterno he would investigate; it is a fact that Curley and Schultz spoke with McQueary the following week; it is a fact that Curley and Schultz made statements to the effect that they had reported it to outside authorities and that an investigation was being conducted.

It is not an established fact that Paterno was in any way part of or privy to Curley and Schultz's attempt to cover this up.

If that fact comes out, then you can make such an assertion. Prior to that, it is simple speculation.

But, I am the dolt.

The conspiracy will be the hardest thing to prove. My sense is there is something there given the fact that MQ was given a job and kept in the circle. JP has had a tight lock on all things PSU football for 46 years but no one outside of the program could ever prove that he fixed tickets, had charges dropped against players and had a tall wall of silence surrounding the program. Now that he is out, all bets are off and I expect a stream of bad news to come out soon.
 
I don't think Paterno was the only one who should have done something, but he most certainly is one who could have.

He does not deny he got information about the incident. He is disputing the details of said information. He can't believe both parties. How does he allow both of them to be around the program for this long?

Do you think he he did the right thing by keeping them both around?

It is dependent upon the the exact verbiage McQueary used and on Paterno's interpretation of that verbiage.
 
According to wikipedia in an interview he was quoted as saying "I guess we know who the real McQueer was now."
 
It is dependent upon the the exact verbiage McQueary used and on Paterno's interpretation of that verbiage.

Not really. If the situation was unclear, Paterno screwed the pooch in not having it clarified. Given the prior incident(s), it was downright negligent if he didn't get clarification. Lack of follow up is damning.
 
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It is dependent upon the the exact verbiage McQueary used and on Paterno's interpretation of that verbiage.

Was Paterno's interpretation not in the GJR?

Sandusky, shower, boy. That is enough verbiage to find which one is telling the truth.

Do you think Paterno was unaware of the allegations in 08? There was a former playing on ESPN saying he was aware in 08.
How could Paterno not be aware?

Then throw in his testimony to the Grand Jury. That is a minimum of three times he had knowledge of allegations, although I don't think for second he was unaware of the 99 allegations.

Three times and still no effort to keep the rat bastard off campus until he was exonerated. That is entirely on Paterno.
 
Not really. If the situation was unclear, Paterno screwed the pooch in not having it clarified. Given the prior incident(s), it was downright negligent if he didn't get clarification. Lack of follow up is damning.

The only two individuals who know exactly how that conversation occurred are McQueary and Paterno (maybe McQueary's father).

If McQueary couched this report in language of "I'm not certain of this, but I think I saw Sandusky acting inappropriate with a boy in the shower", then Paterno certainly should ask for clarification; however, that does not automatically imply that McQueary then responded with, "I certainly saw Sandusky raping the boy".

Given the prior incident in which the DA did not move forward on the charges, I do not see this as negligent. The fact that McQueary left the scene, went home, and called his Dad provides the possibility that McQueary was unsure of what to do and, possible, unsure of how to express what he saw. It is possible that his Dad instructed him not to make an outright accusation against Sandusky.

There are many possibilities here and very little facts of how that conversation actually occurred. To simply pick how you think that conversation occurred so that you can assert that Paterno is morally bankrupt is just as irresponsible as picking any other possibility. Hopefully, an investigation will bring light to that situation and what was information was actually relayed to Paterno. If it turns out that McQueary was very clear in asserting that he saw Sandusky rape the boy, then there is something inconsistent with Paterno keeping McQueary on staff and "allowing" Sandusky access to the facilities.
 
It is dependent upon the the exact verbiage McQueary used and on Paterno's interpretation of that verbiage.


Sandusky/naked/shower/10 yr old boy

Why the hell someone needs to know more verbage beyond those words is ridiculous, mindboggling and a little scary.

There are truly people that are brainwashed by texts or "scholars" that prevent them from thinking with logic, reason, common sense, ethics and morals.

Pathetic
 
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Not really. If the situation was unclear, Paterno screwed the pooch in not having it clarified. Given the prior incident(s), it was downright negligent if he didn't get clarification. Lack of follow up is damning.

This.

Either JP had a GA that was a liar/misrepresented the facts, or worst he had a criminal in his athletic facility in which he is in charge of.

Given the accusations, if I was unclear on what I heard. Id ask again. Not getting clarification (if that is an issue here) leaves JP looking like he didn't want his name and PSU football dragged into this.
 
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Was Paterno's interpretation not in the GJR?

No; it is a summary of the testimony. A transcript of the testimony would better shed light on the situation, though.

Joseph V. Paterno testified to receiving the graduate assistant's report at his home on a Saturday morning. Paterno testified that the graduate assistant was very upset. Paterno called Tim Curley, Penn State Athletic Director and Paterno's immediate superior, to his home the very next day, a Sunday, and reported to him that the graduate assistant had seen Jerry Sandusky in the Lasch Building showers fondling or doing something of a sexual nature to a young boy.

Approximately one and a half weeks later, the graduate assistant was called to a meeting with Penn State Athletic Director Curley and Senior Vice President for Finance and Business Gary Schultz. The graduate assistant reported to Curley and Schultz that he had witnessed what he believed to be Sandusky have anal sex with a boy in the Lasch Building showers. Curely and Schultz assured the graduate assistant that they would look into it and determine what further action they would take. Paterno was not present for this meeting.

"What he believed" is not certainty. It is along the same lines of "I think I saw".
 
No; it is a summary of the testimony. A transcript of the testimony would better shed light on the situation, though.



"What he believed" is not certainty. It is along the same lines of "I think I saw".

Wow just wow. Please do not have children you sir are unfit. Naked boy, naked man, shower, FOOLING AROUND! None of that is in dispute, that right there is enough to ban the SOB from your facilities, what else do you need?

Please tell us what you would have doen if in Joe's shoes?
 
The only two individuals who know exactly how that conversation occurred are McQueary and Paterno (maybe McQueary's father).

If McQueary couched this report in language of "I'm not certain of this, but I think I saw Sandusky acting inappropriate with a boy in the shower", then Paterno certainly should ask for clarification; however, that does not automatically imply that McQueary then responded with, "I certainly saw Sandusky raping the boy".

Given the prior incident in which the DA did not move forward on the charges, I do not see this as negligent. The fact that McQueary left the scene, went home, and called his Dad provides the possibility that McQueary was unsure of what to do and, possible, unsure of how to express what he saw. It is possible that his Dad instructed him not to make an outright accusation against Sandusky.

There are many possibilities here and very little facts of how that conversation actually occurred. To simply pick how you think that conversation occurred so that you can assert that Paterno is morally bankrupt is just as irresponsible as picking any other possibility. Hopefully, an investigation will bring light to that situation and what was information was actually relayed to Paterno. If it turns out that McQueary was very clear in asserting that he saw Sandusky rape the boy, then there is something inconsistent with Paterno keeping McQueary on staff and "allowing" Sandusky access to the facilities.

Are you saying he shouldn't have followed up on either Sandusky or McQueary?
 
Wow just wow. Please do not have children you sir are unfit. Naked boy, naked man, shower, FOOLING AROUND! None of that is in dispute, that right there is enough to ban the SOB from your facilities, what else do you need?

Please tell us what you would have doen if in Joe's shoes?

"I believe I saw fooling around".

"I think I saw fooling around".

"I saw fooling around".

One of these ducks is not like the others.
 
Are you saying he shouldn't have followed up on either Sandusky or McQueary?

I am saying that he should have reported it to his superior so that these claims could be investigated. Paterno, due to his relationship with Sandusky, could not be an impartial investigator anyhow. This is why professional investigators have to at times recuse themselves from investigations due to conflicts of interests with regard to relationships with either the accused or the accuser.
 
I am saying that he should have reported it to his superior so that these claims could be investigated. Paterno, due to his relationship with Sandusky, could not be an impartial investigator anyhow. This is why professional investigators have to at times recuse themselves from investigations due to conflicts of interests with regard to relationships with either the accused or the accuser.

And you think that is all he needed to do? Report it like it was a guy speeding on the highway and be done with it?
 
No; it is a summary of the testimony. A transcript of the testimony would better shed light on the situation, though.



"What he believed" is not certainty. It is along the same lines of "I think I saw".

Your leaving out a piece that is also in the indictment. He heard sounds of skin slapping? So put those two together.
 
No; it is a summary of the testimony. A transcript of the testimony would better shed light on the situation, though.



"What he believed" is not certainty. It is along the same lines of "I think I saw".


Still doesn't explain Paterno continuing to do nothing after the 08 incident and his testimony to the GJ. Unless you think Paterno was powerless to do so.

Also , how the hell , especially after multiple accusations, you don't err on the side of caution when it comes to innocent children is one of the scariest thought processes ive ever heard.
 
Your leaving out a piece that is also in the indictment. He heard sounds of skin slapping? So put those two together.

It does not state in the GJ indictment what exactly was reported to Paterno nor how exactly that was reported. You are leaping to the conclusion that McQueary reported the skin-slapping to Paterno. I am not making that leap sans evidence.
 

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