Playoff In The Future...

[tvolsfan]

I'm not sure why everyone is in a hurry to get teams that finish 8th a shot at the national title when they clearly weren't one of the best teams. People seem to think that because March Madness is exciting, implementing a similar tournament won't negatively affect college football at all.

 

[strongtower]

Instituting a playoff won't stop this from happening. Do you really think the Giants were the best team in the NFL in 2007-2008? Or did they just get some luck in the Super Bowl?

no they simply outplayed the Patriots in that game, they were the better team period. They even had a chance at the end of the game and still couldn't stop them.

 

[strongtower]

I'm not sure why everyone is in a hurry to get teams that finish 8th a shot at the national title when they clearly weren't one of the best teams. People seem to think that because March Madness is exciting, implementing a similar tournament won't negatively affect college football at all.

probaly because the only thing separating #1-8 is a 1 game loss.

 

[tvolsfan]

no they simply outplayed the Patriots in that game, they were the better team period. They even had a chance at the end of the game and still couldn't stop them.

A playoff makes much more sense in the NFL because the talent gap is so much smaller between teams making going unbeaten extremely unlikely. In college, however, it's pretty obvious to draw the line between the top 2 teams and the top 16.

 

[tvolsfan]

probaly because the only thing separating #1-8 is a 1 game loss.

Do you only look at the teams record when judging teams?

Look at last year. Why did teams like Iowa and Ohio State deserve a shot at the national title?

I agree that some change could improve things, but I'm talking about a plus 1 or 4 team playoff.

 

[strongtower]

A playoff makes much more sense in the NFL because the talent gap is so much smaller between teams making going unbeaten extremely unlikely. In college, however, it's pretty obvious to draw the line between the top 2 teams and the top 16.

It's just my opinion but I think a one game system cheats other teams. I don't think many teams would want to play Wisconsin right now who could possibly be the best but we will never know.

 

[tvolsfan]

It's just my opinion but I think a one game system cheats other teams. I don't think many teams would want to play Wisconsin right now who could possibly be the best but we will never know.

So you're saying reward the hottest team and not the one that proved the most throughout the season? Wisconsin essentially beat Ohio State and a bunch of average to awful teams to end the season. I'm not really buying the argument that they're getting cheated. By the way, I actually like TCU and am rooting for them in that game. I wouldn't be crushed if a team like TCU got a shot, but we don't need to include the entire top 8.

 

[GreveHaller]

Do you only look at the teams record when judging teams?

Look at last year. Why did teams like Iowa and Ohio State deserve a shot at the national title?

I agree that some change could improve things, but I'm talking about a plus 1 or 4 team playoff.

I'm sorry but this year I cannot support a plus 1 or a 4 team. While TCU did a tremendous job and deserved a nod if either Aub or Ore lost, there's no way that a 1 loss Stanford/Wisconsin/Ohio St should even sniff the NC. They were good, just not Aub-Ore-TCU good.

Now if this was last year with Bama-Tx-Cincy-TCU all undefeated....ehhh sure. In 08 with Ok-Fla-Tx-Bama-USC again it would not work.

The number of teams worthy of even playing for the NC isnt consistent year to year. Any attempt to assign an unvarying amount of teams to determine the NC reduces the importance of what the teams did to acheive their record.

 

[wheaton4prez]

Fast foward to 2010

...

Auburn then screms 'Standford cant be the best. We were #1 during the season and we didnt get to play them on the field. We are the champions'.

Yet another example of a playoff making the situation worse.

They can't scream that because they were beat by a team in the play-offs. Nobody contests that the super bowl champion is not the super bowl champion because they didn't beat some other team with a similar (or even better) record.

Not in a game that matters.

How would those games not matter? They were BCS games. If there were a play-off, it would mean they advance.

Absolutely ridiculous. You listed two wins. One against a team starting a wide receiver at quarterback and one against a team who cared so much about the game one of the players didn't even bother waiting for it to end to sign with an agent. One of these days, Boise State will find themselves losing end of blowout like Florida-Cincy from last season.

This underscores my point that play-offs would add importance to games. Nobody would be thinking about agents during a play-off game that could lead to the NC.

I'm sure that Boise State will get blown out at some point. Every team does. I'm not sure what point that is supposed to serve?

I'm not sure why everyone is in a hurry to get teams that finish 8th a shot at the national title when they clearly weren't one of the best teams. People seem to think that because March Madness is exciting, implementing a similar tournament won't negatively affect college football at all.

A few reasons:

• Top 8 rankings are often not clear with multiple teams having similar records.
• Most people do not dispute the results of elimination play-offs. Many people dispute the results of ballot box and computer results.
• Watching top teams play each other is more entertaining than waiting to hear whether some writer we've never heard of or a coach that hasn't watched any games decide who they think (or have heard) is best.
• It's better to have to debate between the 8th and 9th placed team than the 1st, 2nd or 3rd.
• Scoring teams with voting is used in gymnastics. This is football.

A playoff makes much more sense in the NFL because the talent gap is so much smaller between teams making going unbeaten extremely unlikely. In college, however, it's pretty obvious to draw the line between the top 2 teams and the top 16.

I don't think it's obvious. Often times, the top 8 all have the same record save maybe a 1 loss difference. When comparing teams with the same record, one has to start comparing schedules, etc. which is a giant cluster-frack with no real consensus or standard that anyone goes by.

 

[The Ron Mexico]

The mid majors have a far better shot at the national title now than they would with a playoff.

Please provide evidence for this argument.

 

[The Ron Mexico]

I believe a plus 1 is the simplest and most fair way of having a playoff in CFB. I also think that the way the teams are ranked should be evaluated as much as whether or not CFB needs a playoff.

 

[GreveHaller]

Please provide evidence for this argument.

One simple reason is a thing called home field advantage.

I'm sure we'd all say that any game played in an SEC stadium is considered getting home field advantage. Who wants to play LSU at night no matter if the oppnent is BCS or mid major, right? Same thing with Bama, Auburn this year, and even the Vols. So what does this have to do with mid majors? well, it goes into what would happen if there was a playoff.

If it were implemented, there's two ways to do it. First would be that the bowls would be used as the prelim rounds. Without going into full detail on how this really isnt possible anyway we can skip to the next. Next would to play the games at a home field then the final game being at a neutral site. Sound familar? It should - this is what the FCS does.

See, one of the dirty little secrets that everybody never addresses is how the FCS chose where to play their games. To determine where to play the game, the schools have to submit a bid to host the game.

Site Determination. With regard to first-round, second-round, quarterfinal and semifinal sites, in addition to the criteria listed in Bylaw 31.1.3.2.1, the NCAA Division I Football Committee shall consider the following additional criteria when selecting playoff sites:
a. Prospective host institutions must submit the following minimum financial guarantees, which shall be 75 percent of the estimated net receipts as submitted on the proposed budget:
First round—$30,000
Second round—$30,000
Quarterfinal—$40,000
Semifinal—$50,000

Yes, that's right. They have to PAY the NCAA to have the games. Put the WAC or CUSA schools up against any of the BCS schools who do you think would win that financial battle?

Oh, there's more

When determining host institutions for playoff games when both teams are unseeded, criteria shall apply as follows: (1) quality of facility, (2) revenue potential plus estimated net receipts, (3) attendance history and potential, (4) team’s performance (e.g., conference place finish, head-to-head results and number of Division I opponents), and (5) student-athlete well-being (e.g., travel, missed class time).

Yeah, that's right - what the school can produce in revenue has a bearing on if they host a playoff or not.

Of the 120 Div 1 schools, the top 25 stadium capacities all are BCS schools. Why capacity? Because more seats = more revenue. Here's a few of the best of the non BCS schools

27 UAB Legion Field 71,594
30 San Diego St Qualcom 70,561
31 Rice Rice Stadium 70,000
32 Tulane Superdome 69,703

look at this years darlings, BSU and TCU

70 TCU Amon G Carter Stadium 46,000
89 BSU Bronco Stadium 33,500

while each of those are going thru some stadium expansion, they still will not approach what the majority of the BCS has.

What this means is that if you put the BCS schools up against the non BCS, all home game would be at the BCS for monetary reasons. Why would Boise host a game at a a 35k stadium when they could play a UT, Bama, Michigan, or even OSU that would hold 3x as many and bring in 3x the amount of revenue regardless of standings. This puts all the mid majors at a distinct disadvantage. Could they do it? Sure, but home cookin' sure taste might good.

 

[The Ron Mexico]

One simple reason is a thing called home field advantage.

I'm sure we'd all say that any game played in an SEC stadium is considered getting home field advantage. Who wants to play LSU at night no matter if the oppnent is BCS or mid major, right? Same thing with Bama, Auburn this year, and even the Vols. So what does this have to do with mid majors? well, it goes into what would happen if there was a playoff.

If it were implemented, there's two ways to do it. First would be that the bowls would be used as the prelim rounds. Without going into full detail on how this really isnt possible anyway we can skip to the next. Next would to play the games at a home field then the final game being at a neutral site. Sound familar? It should - this is what the FCS does.

See, one of the dirty little secrets that everybody never addresses is how the FCS chose where to play their games. To determine where to play the game, the schools have to submit a bid to host the game.

Site Determination. With regard to first-round, second-round, quarterfinal and semifinal sites, in addition to the criteria listed in Bylaw 31.1.3.2.1, the NCAA Division I Football Committee shall consider the following additional criteria when selecting playoff sites:
a. Prospective host institutions must submit the following minimum financial guarantees, which shall be 75 percent of the estimated net receipts as submitted on the proposed budget:
First round—$30,000
Second round—$30,000
Quarterfinal—$40,000
Semifinal—$50,000

Yes, that's right. They have to PAY the NCAA to have the games. Put the WAC or CUSA schools up against any of the BCS schools who do you think would win that financial battle?

Oh, there's more

When determining host institutions for playoff games when both teams are unseeded, criteria shall apply as follows: (1) quality of facility, (2) revenue potential plus estimated net receipts, (3) attendance history and potential, (4) team’s performance (e.g., conference place finish, head-to-head results and number of Division I opponents), and (5) student-athlete well-being (e.g., travel, missed class time).

Yeah, that's right - what the school can produce in revenue has a bearing on if they host a playoff or not.

Of the 120 Div 1 schools, the top 25 stadium capacities all are BCS schools. Why capacity? Because more seats = more revenue. Here's a few of the best of the non BCS schools

27 UAB Legion Field 71,594
30 San Diego St Qualcom 70,561
31 Rice Rice Stadium 70,000
32 Tulane Superdome 69,703

look at this years darlings, BSU and TCU

70 TCU Amon G Carter Stadium 46,000
89 BSU Bronco Stadium 33,500

while each of those are going thru some stadium expansion, they still will not approach what the majority of the BCS has.

What this means is that if you put the BCS schools up against the non BCS, all home game would be at the BCS for monetary reasons. Why would Boise host a game at a a 35k stadium when they could play a UT, Bama, Michigan, or even OSU that would hold 3x as many and bring in 3x the amount of revenue regardless of standings. This puts all the mid majors at a distinct disadvantage. Could they do it? Sure, but home cookin' sure taste might good.

I'm sorry you had to type all that. But what you said here is not evidence. You have based your argument on home filed advantage. There is no plan in place much less one that includes home field advantage. Also, I was looking for evidence that says mid-majors have a better shot at a championship in this system. Your argument does not provide that evidence.

 

[wheaton4prez]

Not to mention that the entire argument was based on the odd assumption that a BCS play-off would work the same way as the FCS play-offs.

 

[TnScooby]

Give it up guys, Greve is deadset against a playoff and will take any and all facts and formulate them to fit his opinion..Thinking outside the box is not an option..Believe me, I tried to convince him otherwise but I just finally agreed to disagree...

 

[TnScooby]

Here's a nice article about the bowls....

The College Bowl System Is For The Fans (Who Are Watching At Home) - From Our Editors - SBNation.com

 

[milohimself]

Solid write up. I love being able to sit at home during the holidays and gorge myself on all the college ball I can before it goes on a nine month hiatus. But te fact remains that it's a broken system that robs all the participating schools of their hard earned money.
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