Please gents, this is herb streets opinion and not mine

[KnoxRealtorVOL]

I can't believe you guys are arguing about the defense, the DB's, the talent gap, or the final drive of the Vandy game.

Here's the only stat anyone needs to know for that game:

11/19

53 yds (half of which came at the end of the 4th)

2 INT

0 TD

 

[oregonvol]

Lets just review that final Vandy drive with 4:16 left on the clock

1st and 10 at VAN 8 Austyn Carta-Samuels pass complete to Jordan Matthews for 8 yards to the Vandy 16. 7 10

2nd and 2 at VAN 16 Jordan Matthews rush for a loss of 4 yards to the Vandy 12.

3rd and 6 at VAN 12 Austyn Carta-Samuels pass complete to Jonathan Krause for 18 yards to the Vandy 30 for a 1ST down.

1st and 10 at VAN 30 Austyn Carta-Samuels pass complete to Wesley Tate for a loss of 5 yards to the Vandy 25.

2nd and 15 at VAN 25 Austyn Carta-Samuels pass complete to Jonathan Krause for 17 yards to the Tenn 43, TENNESSEE penalty 15 yard Face Mask on Devaun Swafford accepted for a 1ST down.

1st and 10 at TENN 43 Austyn Carta-Samuels pass incomplete to Jonathan Krause.

2nd and 10 at TENN 43 Austyn Carta-Samuels pass complete to Jordan Matthews for 9 yards to the Tenn 34.

3rd and 1 at TENN 34 Wesley Tate rush for no gain to the Tenn 34.

4th and 1 at TENN 34 Timeout VANDERBILT, clock 0:48.

4th and 1 at TENN 34 Austyn Carta-Samuels rush for 1 yard to the Tenn 33 for a 1ST down.

1st and 10 at TENN 33 Austyn Carta-Samuels pass complete to Jordan Matthews for 25 yards to the Tenn 8 for a 1ST down.

1st and Goal at TENN 8 Austyn Carta-Samuels rush for 3 yards to the Tenn 5.

2nd and Goal at TENN 5 Timeout VANDERBILT, clock 00:21.

2nd and Goal at TENN 5 Patton Robinette rush for 5 yards for a TOUCHDOWN. 13 10

Carey Spear extra point GOOD. 14 10

Carey Spear kickoff for 65 yards returned by Devrin Young for 15 yards to the Tenn 15.

just utterly sickening

 

[Spartacavolus]

pretty sad that some hold onto the past so tightly they still get upset about a game a year ago and even do the research for a play by play where the SEC alltime leading receiver is lighting up Max Arnold, Toney and Swafford.
Crybaby is the best description. Game was 6 months ago, and grown men still acting like crybabies.
Good luck with that way of looking at things. I'm sure it's great to be around you folk.

 

[Boca Vol]

Well, we did put in a true freshman at quarterback between there. I'd say that affected the performance of the team a little bit.

I didn't go to the O&W game but in watching the highlight film it seems Dobbs has matured as a football player quite a bit. His passes seemed to arrive with a bit more zip.

Not saying he should or will beat out Worley this season, but if he's progressed that much then we should be in decent shape at QB for '15-'16.

 

[vollygirl]

I didn't go to the O&W game but in watching the highlight film it seems Dobbs has matured as a football player quite a bit. His passes seemed to arrive with a bit more zip.

Not saying he should or will beat out Worley this season, but if he's progressed that much then we should be in decent shape at QB for '15-'16.

Agreed.

 

[oregonvol]

pretty sad that some hold onto the past so tightly they still get upset about a game a year ago and even do the research for a play by play where the SEC alltime leading receiver is lighting up Max Arnold, Toney and Swafford.
Crybaby is the best description. Game was 6 months ago, and grown men still acting like crybabies.
Good luck with that way of looking at things. I'm sure it's great to be around you folk.

So you don't believe previous games have any bearing on future results? Interesting. I guess with that POV, you would say Dooley should have just been kept, since he could have turned things around at any moment, huh? I guess you've never pointed to Butch Jones' past record of success at other schools as evidence of anything, have you? Or is it only negative results we're all supposed to ignore? Please enlighten us.

 

[CountVolcula]

Well, we did put in a true freshman at quarterback between there. I'd say that affected the performance of the team a little bit.

Dobbs had no outcome on that last drive. He played well enough to have UT in the lead until the end

A soft defensive package at the end cost us that game. We had them pinned at their own 8. Double coverage on Matthews and pressure Samuels would have ended that drive.

 

[titansvolsfaninga]

He still got beat by a 5-7 team

By what history will say as one of the worst, if not the, worst coach in UT history.


The bottom line is the talent excuse couldn't be used by Dooley and it can't be used by Jones. We had more than enough talent to take Georgia to the wire and beat SC, but not enough to beat Vandy?

That tells me that there is some issues with coaching when you can beat a top 10 team but not a 7-4 Vandy at home to secure a possible bowl game

So all of the other injuries to WR and QB should not matter either...right? I mean all of the starting secondary is out for Vandy, but we have no decent WR to even take advantage of that. That's not coaching, that's talent my friend. It appears that you are being glib and asinine this morning just to be glib and asinine. Good luck with that sir, and good day! :hi:

 

[titansvolsfaninga]

Dobbs had no outcome on that last drive. He played well enough to have UT in the lead until the end

A soft defensive package at the end cost us that game. We had them pinned at their own 8. Double coverage on Matthews and pressure Samuels would have ended that drive.

Hell, that works on Madden, why not in real life!

 

[CountVolcula]

So you don't believe previous games have any bearing on future results? Interesting. I guess with that POV, you would say Dooley should have just been kept, since he could have turned things around at any moment, huh? I guess you've never pointed to Butch Jones' past record of success at other schools as evidence of anything, have you? Or is it only negative results we're all supposed to ignore? Please enlighten us.

So with his statement, we can't use Jones' prior history. So all we should go on is 5-7 and 2nd worst defense it UT history

I like these new rules

 

[CountVolcula]

So all of the other injuries to WR and QB should not matter either...right? I mean all of the starting secondary is out for Vandy, but we have no decent WR to even take advantage of that. That's not coaching, that's talent my friend. It appears that you are being glib and asinine this morning just to be glib and asinine. Good luck with that sir, and good day! :hi:

I had no idea North was out of the Vandy game

Did I miss that?

 

[BowlBrother85]

He still got beat by a 5-7 team

By what history will say as one of the worst, if not the, worst coach in UT history.


The bottom line is the talent excuse couldn't be used by Dooley and it can't be used by Jones. We had more than enough talent to take Georgia to the wire and beat SC, but not enough to beat Vandy?

That tells me that there is some issues with coaching when you can beat a top 10 team but not a 7-4 Vandy at home to secure a possible bowl game

Did LSU have issues with coaching in 2005 during Les Miles 1st season when they blew a 21-0 halftime lead at home to a Tennessee team which finished 5-6? How about Alabama when they lost at home to Louisiana-Monroe in Nick Saban's 1st year in 2007? It's definitely possible that coaching mistakes were made against Vanderbilt but for the most part it looked like the results last year were consistent with what you normally see in a new regime with a team that has been struggling. I'm not sure what you want people here to say but it's not unreasonable to have faith in Jones based on his history and how well recruiting has gone at least so far...

 

[CountVolcula]

I can't believe you guys are arguing about the defense, the DB's, the talent gap, or the final drive of the Vandy game.

Here's the only stat anyone needs to know for that game:

11/19

53 yds (half of which came at the end of the 4th)

2 INT

0 TD

Only throwing 19 times against a depleted Vandy secondary says coaching

That screams ultra conservative and playing not to lose football

Dobbs was 26/42 with 240 against Missouri, a far better defense than Vandy and on the road.

 

[CountVolcula]

Did LSU have issues with coaching in 2005 during Les Miles 1st season when they blew a 21-0 halftime lead at home to a Tennessee team which finished 5-6? How about Alabama when they lost at home to Louisiana-Monroe in Nick Saban's 1st year in 2007? It's definitely possible that coaching mistakes were made against Vanderbilt but for the most part it looked like the results last year were consistent with what you normally see in a new regime with a team that has been struggling. I'm not sure what you want people here to say but it's not unreasonable to have faith in Jones based on his history and how well recruiting has gone at least so far...

Ask Florida fans about how Ron Zook worked out

Great recruiter doesn't always equal great coach

 

[BowlBrother85]

Ask Florida fans about how Ron Zook worked out

Great recruiter doesn't always equal great coach

Very true. It remains to be seen how the Jones tenure at Tennessee is going to work out. I feel safe to say that it won't be defined by anything that happened in his 1st season which involved the implementation of new philosophies on both sides of the ball.

 

[Crazy Ivan]

Ask Florida fans about how Ron Zook worked out

Great recruiter doesn't always equal great coach

True, but Zook had zero HC experience prior to the UF job. At least with Butch, we've seen him have success at his 2 prior HC jobs. It obviously doesn't guarantee success at UT, but the fact that he did have success previously at least suggests that if he can recruit SEC-level talent then he can have SEC-level success.

 

[KBVol]

They played every team in the East, and Ole Miss and A&M in the West, and it appears that they beat both Georgia and Florida.

I made a factual statement about Vandy's 2013 schedule....

How the NCAA would rank the SEC

I like context. One can cite those games all one wants but they still played, yet for another year, the easiest schedule in the SEC. They did play all the teams in the East, however, they played no better than the 4th best team in the West in Texas A&M.....no Bama, no Auburn, no LSU.

The teams they beat were a combined 34-76, a whopping 31% win pct. They teams they lost to were 40-13. When they played a bad team they won (barely in most cases), when they played a good team they lost.

They lost to a pretty average 8-5 Ole Miss team at home, got throttled by a 9-4 Texas A&M team who would've scored 70+ points had they not pulled Manziel in the 3rd qtr, barely beat an injury-plagued Georgia team at home that self-destructed in the 4th qtr, and beat the worst Florida team in a generation that was also decimated by injuries.

They also played 0-12 APSU, 1-11 UMass, 2-10 UAB and eeked out a 4th qtr comeback win at home vs mighty 4-8 Wake Forest.

Kudos to the best Vandy team perhaps ever, based on their 9 win season. I firmly believe that pre-Franklin, perhaps pre-Johnson teams, would've lost to many of the bad teams they beat in 2013, so again, kudos. But understand that a big part of their success has been based on playing, inarguably, the worst SEC schedule on a consistent basis.

 

[KBVol]

So, how many games was it, then? Who did they beat?

They won 9 games. The composite record of the bad teams they beat was 34-76 & and .310 win %. They bested 0-12 APSU, 1-11 UMass, 2-10 UAB, 2-10 Ky and 4-8 Wake Forest. Of course they also barely beat a bad UT team that has the game won 17-7 were it not for another Pig Howard mistake and a bad reply call (and yes, I think Vandy got the first down, but that's beside the point). They also played no better than the 4th best SEC West team and managed to avoid Bama, LSU and Auburn. I won't go into the very fortunate (for Vandy) circumstances of their wins vs Florida and Georgia....I'll just say those weren't exactly your typical Florida and Georgia teams.

Bottom line for the only SEC team who played vs teams with a below .500 record in 2013, when they played a good team they lost, when they played a bad team they won.

 

[Crazy Ivan]

We had more than enough talent to take Georgia to the wire and beat SC, but not enough to beat Vandy?

That tells me that there is some issues with coaching when you can beat a top 10 team but not a 7-4 Vandy at home to secure a possible bowl game.

Apples and oranges. Worley was playing undoubtedly his best ball when we played UGA and SCar, and North certainly helped him out a lot as he showed why he was so highly recruited. Against Vandy, we had to start an 18-year old true freshman QB who had a couple of starts under his belt. And who didn't have North to help him out.

 

[MWAVolfan]

I don't pay much attention to these preseason rankings. Nobody expected much out of Auburn when they won the NC in 2010, and when they reached the NC last year. It was all.....:worship:
Alabubba...Alabubba...Alabubba...Alabubba...Alabubba...Alabubba...Alabubba...Alabubba...Alabubba...Alabubba...Alabubba...Alabubba...Alabubba...Alabubba...Alabubba... :worship:

Wasn't it just two years ago that USC started out ranked as No.1 in the country....laden with talent...then about midway through the season, the wheels came off?

They would have laughed if you had said Mizzou and Auburn would play in the SECCG. So, their predictions are usually based on what happened the previous year. But the truth of the matter is, when teams "break out" of the doldrums, it's usually in a dramatic fashion....not this slow, but steady improvement.

Butch Jones Cincinnati team broke out after his first year...so, I'm not worried. Not with the talent coming in.

To be fair, their prediction about Alabama was correct until the very last play of the very last game of the year.

The experts cant predict fluke plays.

Also, Missouri didnt "break out in dramatic fashion". They won the east by default because Georgia and USCe were unexpectedly bad (for example USCe lost to UT). Missouri was proven fraudulent by getting embarrassed by Auburn. Missouri will not repeat as eastern champs this year, proving that they did not "break out" of anything.

 

[jimallvol]

Teams with average players simply can not compete in this league. :no:

I agree 100%! The lack of talent and overall team speed has really hurt us and not having a sec caliber QB has really been the downfall for our program.

 

[vollygirl]

I had no idea North was out of the Vandy game

Did I miss that?

Apparently so.

 

[oregonvol]

They won 9 games. The composite record of the bad teams they beat was 34-76 & and .310 win %. They bested 0-12 APSU, 1-11 UMass, 2-10 UAB, 2-10 Ky and 4-8 Wake Forest. Of course they also barely beat a bad UT team that has the game won 17-7 were it not for another Pig Howard mistake and a bad reply call (and yes, I think Vandy got the first down, but that's beside the point). They also played no better than the 4th best SEC West team and managed to avoid Bama, LSU and Auburn. I won't go into the very fortunate (for Vandy) circumstances of their wins vs Florida and Georgia....I'll just say those weren't exactly your typical Florida and Georgia teams.

Bottom line for the only SEC team who played vs teams with a below .500 record in 2013, when they played a good team they lost, when they played a bad team they won.

Last I checked Vanderbilt beat a number of teams we lost to. Vanderbilt also beat us.

I know, I know, it's all about injuries. But the Georgia and Florida teams both had numerous injuries when they played us. And we were pretty healthy when we played them. I guess we'll ignore the fact that Vanderbilt had to win both of those games with their back-up QB.

But we can debate what constitutes a bad team all you want. It doesn't change the original point. It was stated that you had to have great talent to win in the SEC. Vanderbilt did not have great talent and they won. If we just did as well as they did (which in your estimation was just beating "bad teams") then we would have easily made a bowl last year.

 

[CountVolcula]

Apparently so.

That's what alcohol during games does to you

 

[vollygirl]

That's what alcohol during games does to you

lol: