President Donald Trump - J.D. Vance Administration

#7,528
#7,528
hjeagle1vol said:
😂 yea ok. We got us an outlaw over here folks.
Too proper to just provide and Id when required. Bet 💯 he/she does for a beer, at the bank, to renew licenses…but draws the line at a police request.
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Unless it’s one of the few occasions when you are required to provide an ID why would you?
 
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#7,529
#7,529
hjeagle1vol said:
I understand perfectly. You, I, or any other has the right to not identify. Total right of choice. Understood and agree. Please tell and show us any examples of people who are being detained that simply complied and provided appropriate documentation? During a declared national border emergency. You show your ID constantly and without hesitation for basic luxuries…not even rights…but draw the line here. Ok 😂
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No, I show id during voluntary interactions. There's a huge difference as it's on my terms

Again, people being lawfully detained need to comply and show id. That's the big distinction you continue to miss

Your scary border emergency does not trump my rights or the rights of any other citizens.
 
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#7,531
#7,531
hog88 said:
Unless it’s one of the few occasions when you are required to provide an ID why would you?
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If you are suspected of committing a crime and provided an opportunity to easily clear any and all confusion you’re gonna stand on that BS?
No, no you wouldn’t. Just admit that.
You show it to enter a bar, buy a beer, and a whole host of other times, but as an opportunity given to clear yourself as being a legal citizen is where you draw the line. Seriously doubtful.
 
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#7,533
#7,533
utvolpj said:
No, I show id during voluntary interactions. There's a huge difference as it's on my terms

Again, people being lawfully detained need to comply and show id. That's the big distinction you continue to miss

Your scary border emergency does not trump my rights or the rights of any other citizens.
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Yea whatever. You fold every time it’s ask for and you know it. Please regail us in how you stood up for your rights when asked for an ID.
We can’t wait to hear the take.
 
#7,535
#7,535
hjeagle1vol said:
If you are suspected of committing a crime and provided an opportunity to easily clear any and all confusion you’re gonna stand on that BS?
No, no you wouldn’t. Just admit that.
You show it to enter a bar, buy a beer, and a whole host of other times, but as an opportunity given to clear yourself as being a legal citizen is where you draw the line. Seriously doubtful.
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I’m a middle aged man who is not poor so the odds of me being suspected of a crime are infinitesimally low or I actually committed a crime. So if a cop is asking me for my ID outside of a traffic stop they’re most likely in the wrong or I’m actually guilty and in no way cooperating.
 
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#7,536
#7,536
hjeagle1vol said:
Yea whatever. You fold every time it’s ask for and you know it. Please regail us in how you stood up for your rights when asked for an ID.
We can’t wait to hear the take.
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If I want to purchase alcohol or cash a check there's the chance I will be asked for id. I understand that's the law and will comply of i want the thing done

If I choose to walk down the street there is no reason for me to be asked to identify myself. There is no reason for me to comply with the request unless they wish to detain or arrest me. That's a big difference you continue to get completely wrong
 
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#7,537
#7,537
utvolpj said:
That's called being legally detained and you would need to identify in that case.
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So what are you calling illegally detained then?
If someone is suspected of a crime such as being in country illegally not legal?
And yes I get and agree with your dystopian nightmares that could happen given a complete breakdown in American society, but this simply isn’t the case. ICE isn’t randomly pulling people over for detainment.
 
#7,538
#7,538
hog88 said:
I’m a middle aged man who is not poor so the odds of me being suspected of a crime are infinitesimally low or I actually committed a crime. So if a cop is asking me for my ID outside of a traffic stop they’re most likely in the wrong or I’m actually guilty and in no way cooperating.
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Freedom of choice and voice. Legal residency is a blessing in this world. I commend you for not showing an ID to anyone as is your right…of
Course unless you want a beer or to be able to drive legally and all.
 
#7,541
#7,541
hjeagle1vol said:
So what are you calling illegally detained then?
If someone is suspected of a crime such as being in country illegally not legal?
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The question for probable cause is why they are suspected. Just because they're non-white and Boomer Karen heard them speak a language she doesn't understand? Yeah, that doesn't work
 
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#7,542
#7,542
utvolpj said:
If I want to purchase alcohol or cash a check there's the chance I will be asked for id. I understand that's the law and will comply of i want the thing done

If I choose to walk down the street there is no reason for me to be asked to identify myself. There is no reason for me to comply with the request unless they wish to detain or arrest me. That's a big difference you continue to get completely wrong
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You’re opening up the illegal strawman to everyone. When you can show examples of how legal citizens are being detained over deportation then I’m open to hearing more. You are now just playing what-if-me outside the deportation subject.
Trust me I’m all for legal citizens and our rights. All I’ve said is “if” due to this deportation process a mistake is made…no examples shown to date…it’s quite easily remedied.
 
#7,543
#7,543
utvolpj said:
The question for probable cause is why they are suspected. Just because they're non-white and Boomer Karen heard them speak a language she doesn't understand? Yeah, that doesn't work
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I’ve asked for examples of this happening several times but crickets. Show us what you are arguing about with examples. Mistakes happen 💯. I’ve been falsely accused of crimes before and you can bet your ass I (as would you) simply took the steps to prove my innocence. If it does then clear it up by reaching in a pocket for your ID get your apologies and go on with life.
 
#7,545
#7,545
utvolpj said:
The question for probable cause is why they are suspected. Just because they're non-white and Boomer Karen heard them speak a language she doesn't understand? Yeah, that doesn't work
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I don’t think anyone is advocating the idea of checking people’s papers as they are walking down the street.
 
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#7,547
#7,547
hjeagle1vol said:
I’ve asked for examples of this happening several times but crickets. Show us what you are arguing about with examples. Mistakes happen 💯. I’ve been falsely accused of crimes before and you can bet your ass I (as would you) simply took the steps to prove my innocence. If it does then clear it up by reaching in a pocket for your ID get your apologies and go on with life.
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There are plenty of examples of law enforcement violating the rights of citizens all across the country. It's going to harken with this "deport them all" charge that Trump jackets seem to love. It's inevitable that they're will be violations in these round up efforts. The damages will be paid from tax dollars
 
#7,548
#7,548
utvolpj said:
Not true. Due process applies to every part, even arrest (probable cause)
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You're already assuming there is no probably cause which does happen from time to time and is corrected with process. You are basically saying every time someone is arrest there is no probable cause and their civil rights are violated.
 
#7,550
#7,550
utvolpj said:
Oh I bet the number is way higher than you think. In this thread we have posters saying to just show your papers when asked.
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If they have probable cause there isn't anything wrong with it.

How about this, when they start rounding up millions of innocent Americans and putting them in camp than you can come back and say how right you were. Until that time, you sound very unreasonable.

Hey guys, this might happen. Hey guys, that might happen. Well, they might happen...

This is why there is process, to work out the issues to where wrongs are made right as much as possible..... life is not perfect.
 
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