Public confidence in the military is slipping

#51
#51
NorthDallas40 said:
That guy is the first CJCS that I can ever remember seeing depicted in makeup and wigs in a less than macho military view. And it’s a result of his own pandering to all the various polits distracting away from our military’s sole reason of existing. To be ready and able to extinguish any external threat to our nation with extreme violence and prejudice and in rapid fashion. I think he’s done a major blow to the image of our military leaders as a whole but for sure it began before he assumed chairman.
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How many former Chiefs can the average American even name?

Mark Milley is way too conspicuous/infamous for my liking.
 
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#54
#54
85SugarVol said:
How many former Chiefs can the average American even name?

Mark Milley is way too conspicuous/infamous for my liking.
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Sir, Mark Milley single handedly stopped Donald Trump from nuking the entire earth. He should receive all the medals ever issued.
 
#55
#55
hog88 said:
It was a rapid change in 93. From 88-93 it was fun, tough but fun we were in the field or deployed more than 1/2 the year and schools were easy to get (hey your single and we have a slot for xyz). Then spring/summer 93 most live fire exercises were scaled back or cancelled, school slots became harder to get, promotion points were maxed and we started to get stupid warnings about things like cadences and language. Stopped being fun real fast.
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?
 
#56
#56
ButchPlz said:
They're politicians now- not soldiers.
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Milley appears to like that role anyway. I’d like to think he’s in the minority but I’m guessing he isn’t.

They’ve always had to have political savvy but they were not outright politicians.
 
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#59
#59
85SugarVol said:
?
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Marching/running cadences used to have some derogatory and colorful language. Females, homosexuals, short people/tall people, fat people, skinny people, ugly people, anyone outside of your unit within earshot was fair game. Some guys were just geniuses at coming up with them on the fly. That had to be stomped out.
 
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#61
#61
hog88 said:
Marching/running cadences used to have some derogatory and colorful language. Females, homosexuals, short people/tall people, fat people, skinny people, ugly people, anyone outside of your unit within earshot was fair game. Some guys were just geniuses at coming up with them on the fly. That had to be stomped out.
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Ah, I see. Yes, that type of rhetoric can negatively impact training.
 
#62
#62
hog88 said:
Stalin wanted part of Japan, that's the only reason he declared war on them in the waning days of WWII. If not for MacArthur he would have gotten his wish.
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I can't dispute that and as a matter of fact, I'm leaning towards believing that because they presently have a dispute with Japan over the Kuril Islands that they gained after WWII.
 
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#64
#64
sonofUT62 said:
Trump could have made an orderly/safe/ responsible withdrawal within a year of taking office. This isn’t just DroneStrike Barry’s fault.
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Oh I dont disagree with that at all. It should have never gone on past 2012.
 
#68
#68
hog88 said:
It was a rapid change in 93. From 88-93 it was fun, tough but fun we were in the field or deployed more than 1/2 the year and schools were easy to get (hey your single and we have a slot for xyz). Then spring/summer 93 most live fire exercises were scaled back or cancelled, school slots became harder to get, promotion points were maxed and we started to get stupid warnings about things like cadences and language. Stopped being fun real fast.
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Clinton's "balanced budget" and "fiscal restraint" had some costs - like unfunded wars and military. Guess who got credit when the financial indiscretions had to be addressed. Seems like every time a republican administration follows a democrat administration, the military has to be rebuilt and there's a lot of cost. Truman and his henchman Louis Johnson decimated the military at the end of WW2, and there was precious little of tactical value when Korea happened - and it's been that way ever since. Ground support aircraft like P-47s and other equipment were simply bulldozed - we were all about big bombers and nuclear weapons ... and total failures in intelligence (probably both kinds). MacArthur's intelligence clown couldn't have found his butt with both hands and a searchlight.

Admiral, the Navy is on its way out. There's no reason for having a Navy and a Marine Corps. General Bradley tells me amphibious operations are a thing of the past. We'll never have any more amphibious operations. That does away with the Marine Corps. And the Air Force can do anything the Navy can do, so that does away with the Navy.
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Louis Johnson

Probably the only mitigating thing was that when the Korean War started there was a big change to jet fighters. My dad was not RIFed following WW2 until the spring of 1950; by late summer 1950, he was back in Korea directing radar guided airstrikes - generally Marines using Corsairs and Tigercats - some of those P-47s and other planes could have been useful - there's a reason jets and water cooled piston engines don't make the best ground attack aircraft for troop support. Why we have to continually relearn the old lessons is one of our greatest weaknesses, but every new generation knows better - until they don't.
 
#71
#71
Freiwillige said:
I wonder what Milley did to get all of those medals?

It wasn't for winning any wars.
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If you look at all the medals above the mostly green one (Commendation medal), they mostly start with either "distinguished" or "meritorious". His Bronze Star doesn't have a V for valor - so another meritorious thing. He did manage a CIB, so somehow he managed to get into the field (supposedly with people shooting back) without getting hurt. Lot's of ticket punching in his career obviously. BTW, I'm certainly not anti military - I come from a military family, but the award show (flair, chest candy, whatever) has become absurd.
 
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#72
#72
AM64 said:
If you look at all the medals above the mostly green one (Commendation medal), they mostly start with either "distinguished" or "meritorious". His Bronze Star doesn't have a V for valor - so another meritorious thing. He did manage a CIB, so somehow he managed to get into the field (supposedly with people shooting back) without getting hurt. Lot's of ticket punching in his career obviously. BTW, I'm certainly not anti military - I come from a military family, but the award show (flair, chest candy, whatever) has become absurd.
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Patton near the end of WWII

General_George_S_Patton.jpg
 
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#73
#73
AM64 said:
If you look at all the medals above the mostly green one (Commendation medal), they mostly start with either "distinguished" or "meritorious". His Bronze Star doesn't have a V for valor - so another meritorious thing. He did manage a CIB, so somehow he managed to get into the field (supposedly with people shooting back) without getting hurt. Lot's of ticket punching in his career obviously. BTW, I'm certainly not anti military - I come from a military family, but the award show (flair, chest candy, whatever) has become absurd.
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Go compare the photos of our legitimate great generals from years gone by (Eisenhower, etc.) and modern generals looking like Christmas trees. It's a me-me-me leadership structure.
 
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#74
#74
Rasputin_Vol said:
Ho Chi Minh begged Truman for US support when they were fighting the French. Once that happened and the French were defeated, Vietnam went into civil war. Had FDR been alive, Ho Chi Minh might have gotten a more receptive response and Vietnam would have been a stable Western ally in the 1950s. Instead, Ho Chu Minh was forced to turn to the communists for assistance in their war for independence. Once that happened, now suddenly Ho Chi Minh is the bad guy.
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Vietnam was one screwed up place at the end of WW2 when the Japanese left. I can't honestly figure out whether Ho Chi Minh was just anti-colonialism or just another communist dupe. In any case European colonialism and withdrawal left a lot of power vacuums all around the world - just primed for communists to come in and "sooth" the ruffled feathers and promise a new and better day - and a lot of spots open for would be dictators with Sino/Soviet backing. Our involvement in Vietnam probably had more to do with calming the post WW2 communists in France than a real interest in Vietnam - France was on the verge of turning communist. We basically financially funded the French war in Vietnam after WW2 until they collapsed and went home.
 
#75
#75
AM64 said:
Vietnam was one screwed up place at the end of WW2 when the Japanese left. I can't honestly figure out whether Ho Chi Minh was just anti-colonialism or just another communist dupe.
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I think he was in line with FDR's long term vision of liberating all of these European colonies around the globe. I just found out this morning after doing some more reading that the OSS even provided support for him when he was fighting the Vichy French. Once FDR was out of the way, Ho Chi Minh became expendable or useless. The Truman administration was not eager to be breaking up these colonial empires and ignored Ho Chi Minh's calls for assistance against France.

AM64 said:
In any case European colonialism and withdrawal left a lot of power vacuums all around the world - just primed for communists to come in and "sooth" the ruffled feathers and promise a new and better day - and a lot of spots open for would be dictators with Sino/Soviet backing.
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I think things would have turned out a bit differently with regards to some of these former colonies. You likely wouldn't have seen the emergence of the Dulles Brothers and their merging of the CIA and State Department assets to engage in coups, counterinsurgencies and the creation of the Military Industrial Complex.

AM64 said:
Our involvement in Vietnam probably had more to do with calming the post WW2 communists in France than a real interest in Vietnam - France was on the verge of turning communist. We basically financially funded the French war in Vietnam after WW2 until they collapsed and went home.
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And once the French left, why did we stick around during this time in the mid-1950s? He already had over a decade of presence over there already by then.
 
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