questioning faith

[InVOLuntary]

I am not sure that it is unique and it damn sure ain't perfect.

It's perfect from the sense that the earth is ideal to foster all kinds of life.

 

[Wafflestomper]

Reminds me of this Douglas Adams quote:

"Imagine a puddle waking up one morning and thinking, 'This is an interesting world I find myself in — an interesting hole I find myself in — fits me rather neatly, doesn't it? In fact it fits me staggeringly well, must have been made to have me in it!'"

 

[InVOLuntary]

Reminds me of this quote:

" I can't touch it, I can't hear it, I can't see it, I can't smell it. It can't exist!"

- Dead man at the bottom of a 10 story building.

 

[Wafflestomper]

Reminds me of this quote:

" I can't touch it, I can't hear it, I can't see it, I can't smell it. It can't exist!"

- Dead man at the bottom of a 10 story building.

I'm guessing you'd be able to come up with tangible evidence of a building.

 

[InVOLuntary]

I'm guessing you'd be able to come up with tangible evidence of a building.

Man I've over estimated you.

 

[Wafflestomper]

Man I've over estimated you.

Sorry, were you expecting me to do something else with your half-assed strawman analogy?

 

[InVOLuntary]

Sorry, were you expecting me to do something else with your half-assed strawman analogy?

No more half assed and strawman than yours. Think about it. You're the genius here, I'm the dumbass. Surely you can get it. Us people that believe in God are Stoopid.

 

[Wafflestomper]

You said:

I'm a very logical thinker and I can't logically think that this planet, this Galaxy, this universe, is all a big accident. I look up on a clear night and see all those stars. I see how this Earth is precisely the right distance from our sun to not just sustain life but to foster an environment where humans can thrive. I believe a master's hands were involved.

and:

I believe this world is so unique and so perfect that I have to believe it's not just anomaly.

So tell me how this isn't analogous to your quote...

Reminds me of this Douglas Adams quote:

"Imagine a puddle waking up one morning and thinking, 'This is an interesting world I find myself in — an interesting hole I find myself in — fits me rather neatly, doesn't it? In fact it fits me staggeringly well, must have been made to have me in it!'"

Also, I never said anyone was stupid for what they believe. I just think you ought to have good reasons for being convinced something is true.

 

[InVOLuntary]

You said:

and:


So tell me how this isn't analogous to your quote...


Also, I never said anyone was stupid for what they believe. I just think you ought to have good reasons for being convinced something is true.

All my reasons would be stupid to you. Nothing I could say would pass your standards of scientific certainty. It takes a bit of faith. You can't expect someone that believes in God to produce rock solid evidence of His existence. That's why I hate getting into these discussions because it's a no win.

You compared my stance with a puddle of water. You couldn't have been more condecending. It's real easy for you guys because all you have to say is "It's your burden to prove it".

You know what? I have seen enough over my life to know God exist. I really don't give a **** whether it meets your level of scrutiny or not. I am more than comfortable with my stance and that's really all that matters.

 

[PKT_VOL]

You are asking me to prove that God exist. I'll be the first to admit, I can't. If I could, I definitely wouldn't be here having this discussion with you. I could offer up evidence of why I believe in God but you or others would just poopoo on it.

That's how propositions work. Person A states they think X is true for H, I, J reasons. Person B then assess and critics X based on H, I, J (and possibly K, L, M). May the best ideas (X's) win.

I suggest that if you do believe in God, don't waste your time trying to find evidence that will pass scientific muster. It doesn't exist. That's why it's called faith.

Depends on what your conception of God is an what you use to support it. Neither is ubiquitous.

 

[InVOLuntary]

That's how propositions work. Person A states they think X is true for H, I, J reasons. Person B then assess and critics X based on H, I, J (and possibly K, L, M). May the best ideas (X's) win.



Depends on what your conception of God is an what you use to support it. Neither is ubiquitous.

But the deck is stacked. No evidence is good enough. It's futile to discuss it. Like i said , it's good enough for me so that's all that matters. I can only surmise that it must be pretty miserable to have no hope beyond this life bug to each his own I guess.

 

[PKT_VOL]

But the deck is stacked. No evidence is good enough. It's futile to discuss it. Like i said , it's good enough for me so that's all that matters.

Only to those who say "nothing could change my mind", on either side. Yet, people's minds get changed all the time. That's the whole point of missions/proselytizing.

I can only surmise that it must be pretty miserable to have no hope beyond this life bug to each his own I guess.

And yet there is no difference in happiness. Telling for both sides, actually.

 

[InVOLuntary]

Only to those who say "nothing could change my mind", on either side. Yet, people's minds get changed all the time. That's the whole point of missions/proselytizing.

Again, there is zero evidence that would meet your criterion, zero. It's pointless.

And yet there is no difference in happiness. Telling for both sides, actually.

So now you are the authority on happiness. Didn't realize I was talking to God himself. Wow.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

Sorry, no offense, but you're absolutely, 100% wrong. There is an order to everything. From what we know now, there is zero evidence that another planet exist like earth where intelligent life exist, despite astronomical odds. Hell, we can't even find a planet to this point that can definitively support any life. Sorry if it doesn't fit in your neat little box.

And, I'll add, neither of us can prove our point one way or another. We each choose to look at the evidence and form an opinion. I choose to look at the evidence and say a master's hand is at work. You choose to look at the evidence and conclude that this is all happenstance, one big huge soup that evolved into what is today. I'm good with mine as I'm sure you are with yours.

If they are both opinions, then you can't tell him he's "absolutely, 100% wrong."

 

[InVOLuntary]

If they are both opinions, then you can't tell him he's "absolutely, 100% wrong."

I agree. I was giving him some of his own medicine. He said my opinion was wrong so I said the same back. I agree, an opinion is just that.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

I agree. I was giving him some of his own medicine. He said my opinion was wrong so I said the same back. I agree, an opinion is just that.

My opinion is....Florida sucks.

 

[Slydell]

Oh, Lawd, please don't let me be misunderstood.

 

[InVOLuntary]

My opinion is....Florida sucks.

Amen. I think we win big. Well sort of big.

 

[PKT_VOL]

Again, there is zero evidence that would meet your criterion, zero. It's pointless.

Criteria for what exactly?

So now you are the authority on happiness. Didn't realize I was talking to God himself. Wow.

Or just look up the academic studies that examined this very question.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

Amen. I think we win big. Well sort of big.

Wait that's a fact not an opinion

 

[InVOLuntary]

Criteria for what exactly?



Or just look up the academic studies that examined this very question.

Studies mean zilch to me. You can't quantify someone's happiness based on a study. You obviously put more faith in those studies than I do.

As far as criteria, you want scientifically provable evidence of God. It doesn't exist so there's no since carrying this further.

 

[InVOLuntary]

Wait that's a fact not an opinion

Your opinion of my fact is 100% correct.

 

[PKT_VOL]

Studies mean zilch to me. You can't quantify someone's happiness based on a study. You obviously put more faith in those studies than I do.

It was the other way around. Individuals quantified their happiness to the surveyors.

As far as criteria, you want scientifically provable evidence of God. It doesn't exist so there's no since carrying this further.

Who says I want that? Did you miss where I said I wasn't an atheist?

 

[TNJOKER]

So he doesn't care what happens to us on Earth? How is allowing a child to endure extreme suffering a good lesson to others?

Think about the story of job. He endured trials for I think around 40 years.. he spent 40 years in the wilderness before God blessed him. He questioned god on why he was doing the things that he did. In the end god showed job that he (God) is almighty and controls ALL things... Good or evil.

He allows Satan to do his evil and demonic work here on Earth.. because let's face it . We humans are weak to temptation. We all fall, and that is where repentance comes into play.

 

[pismonque]

Think about the story of job. He endured trials for I think around 40 years.. he spent 40 years in the wilderness before God blessed him. He questioned god on why he was doing the things that he did. In the end god showed job that he (God) is almighty and controls ALL things... Good or evil.

He allows Satan to do his evil and demonic work here on Earth.. because let's face it . We humans are weak to temptation. We all fall, and that is where repentance comes into play.

Oh. Well, that's different then.