Quit with the "we don't have talent and are slow" crud

#127
#127
Doyle Hargraves said:
While I am not a part of the "Far Butch" crowd, I don't get the mentality some have that he is above any criticism. At $3m a year, he should expect every move he makes to be analyzed and picked apart. If someone questions him, the "Blind Butchers" shouldn't automatically assume that the one asking wants him fired.
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I'm not calling for his head either, but people need to realize he was a last min, desperation hire from a mid-major conference program. I think Butch is doing a lot of things right. I don't think he or his staffs strength is X's and O's. I don't think he was ready for a job this big. Can he get there? That's the $3 mil question. Regardless, he's our coach for at least three years. I hope he is the guy cause if not we're 10 years from being competitive because a coaching change will set us back another 5 years.
 
#129
#129
volinbama256 said:
98% of all these kids got other scholarship offers to other D-1 schools, so they are that talented and other schools saw D-1 potential in them. The problem isn't so much the lack of talent and speed (which is definitely a challenge, but not an excuse everytime), its the lack of mentoring and coaching to develop basic skills. There were missed lanes, false starts, horrible angles, horrible tackling, lack of defensive vision and defensive common sense (QB spy after he gashed us for what seemed to be 200yds in the first half) ZERO, and I mean ZERO defensive adjustments at half-time--- see opening kickoff and QB runs the rest of the game. This team lacks COACHING. All this and we are 3/4 through the season.
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:no:
 
#130
#130
I'l correct Volnation on the befhalf of Volnation.

They do not have properly DEVELOPED talent.

Also, they may have had good offers, but Dooley filled this team with slow pokes.
 
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#131
#131
Wylo said:
Could it be that UT hired a Big East coach? I know he won or shared that prestigious championship and the MAC championship several times.

What his record during those title years? He obviously didn't play an SEC type schedule. Did he ever go undefeated? Did Cincy ever threaten the top 5? Top 10? Top 15?

If not, how can he possibly expect to do more at UT?

This is what we should be asking instead of fighting amongst ourselves.
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If you honestly think Cincy will ever have a shot at being ranked top 5 you are crazy. It's hard to go undefeated anywhere, yet 2 loss SEC school LSU made it to the title game.

I'm not disrespecting your arguement but I don't understand the point of bringing up the SEC schedule. He had Big East talent against Big East schools. Now he has Big East talent against NFL talent (seeing how they've only played really good SEC schools and not the 1st middle of the row team).
 
#132
#132
Boca Vol said:
Why do people always say this? It's not like Dooley told them they sucked every day. That argument is too played out and is used as an excuse when there is no basis.

Auburn didn't seem to have a problem "undoing" Chizik!
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considering that Malzahn was the mastermind behind the 2010 BCS championship win & recruited most of those players to AU, I would say that is a completely different scenario.
 
#133
#133
PanicVol said:
Really, cause im pretty sure most the people on here thought this would be a close game.

Is it because Auburn has a bunch of 5 star players? Or is it because they have a great coach?
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Good coaching on top of good speed at the skill positions = Great outcome.
 
#134
#134
PanicVol said:
Really, cause im pretty sure most the people on here thought this would be a close game.

Is it because Auburn has a bunch of 5 star players? Or is it because they have a great coach?
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Well lets look at their most recent recruiting classes:

2011- 1 5*, 13 highly ranked 4*
2012- 13 highly ranked 4*
2013- 2 5*, 10 high 4*

Looks like to me GM walked into a really good team that has some really good talent. GM is a good coach but how do you think Butch would do with that kind of talent?
 
#137
#137
Vol4life25 said:
So your saying Gus is a better coach then butch?
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Cannot compare them unil the talent levels become equal. Because using your logic Gus is a better coach than Saban. In 2006 Bama went 6-7 and Saban came in and only went 6-6 his first year. So is Gus a better coach than Saban?
 
#139
#139
volinbama256 said:
For starters I know their QB is one of the best runners in the country and would have had a nickel or LB spying and following him every play- that would have probably cut 14pts instantly. If I didn't do it at the beginning of the game, I sure as hell would have done it the second half, stacked the box and dared them to throw. Next would be to kick out of bounds/thru the endzone, another halftime adjustment. I could keep going if you want me to?
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Spy on a QB ...a running QB at that . You gonna get that burner AJ Johnson to spy him ? Or how bought that freshman nickel ? Who is gonna cover the receiver the nickel is not covering ? A safety ? Which one of our secondary guys do you want to leave in man coverage since you have one of our most awesome safeties in coverage ?

You do realize that the 'spy' has to shed blocks ...he does not get a special jersey that says ' I am a spy..don't block meeeee'

Who is even using a 'spy' anymore ? In a zone type of system with a running QB ...Dline-men are left unblocked and placed behind the play . The offense then out numbers the defense at the point of attack ...so with a running QB the D is already 2-3 players outnumbered. Not practical at all. A spy is for I form football when the D is 1 heavier at the point of attack .

They stacked the box most of the game . It comes down to speed and depth . Your front 7 have no depth. They are large explosive men . Now you know why they look good for 1 1/2 quarters and then everyone runs around them

This is not the Xbox buddy ...its real life .
 
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#140
#140
BigOrangeTrain said:
Cannot compare them unil the talent levels become equal. Because using your logic Gus is a better coach than Saban. In 2006 Bama went 6-7 and Saban came in and only went 6-6 his first year. So is Gus a better coach than Saban?
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They had a terrible qb chew us all game on the ground. Special teams wasn't a talent issue either. We are just a terrible team that's not very well coached.
 
#141
#141
Bottom line is that Butch and his coaching staff have lost a lot of credibility, trust, and respect from the Vol fan base these past 2 weeks (especially against Auburn). We looked past his inarticulate communication and lack of X and O acumen (e.g. the zone read high school offense) in favor of what appeared to be football savvy, motivational skills, relationship building with the players, and forthrightness. Not sure now. Defense looks to be confused and effortless (Dooleyesque) and special team kickoff coverage shows no discipline, confidence, and diligence (Auburn set a record for God's sake). Butch will have to change some of his coaching staff to get back some credibility and right the ship. This is a new challenge for Butch that is not overcome by simply applying the same "system" and coaching staff as he has in the past. Improvise, adapt, overcome (a la the Marines on this Veteran's Day).
 
#142
#142
You have to coach to over come deficiencies such as lack of speed! When you have ample talent like Chavis has a these years you look like a good coach. Now, I'm not saying with better coaching we would have beaten Bama and the Ducks but scores would have been much better!
 
#143
#143
knoxvols11 said:
You have to coach to over come deficiencies such as lack of speed! When you have ample talent like Chavis has a these years you look like a good coach. Now, I'm not saying with better coaching we would have beaten Bama and the Ducks but scores would have been much better!
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No it would not have. Gus Malzhan played Oregon last year with Arkansas State, and got blasted. He had a veteran team. The score was 50-10 at the half. Oregon took their starters out at halftime.

Regardless of coaching, if the talent isn't there, it's just not there. That argument may work in basketball, but not football.
 
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#145
#145
knoxvols11 said:
You have to coach to over come deficiencies such as lack of speed! When you have ample talent like Chavis has a these years you look like a good coach. Now, I'm not saying with better coaching we would have beaten Bama and the Ducks but scores would have been much better!
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All of Chavis' teams were loaded compared to this one, esp on the DL. The one really down year by Chavis I recall was 2007, when we were really young in the defensive backfield.
 
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#146
#146
muvol said:
Bottom line is that Butch and his coaching staff have lost a lot of credibility, trust, and respect from the Vol fan base these past 2 weeks (especially against Auburn). We looked past his inarticulate communication and lack of X and O acumen (e.g. the zone read high school offense) in favor of what appeared to be football savvy, motivational skills, relationship building with the players, and forthrightness. Not sure now. Defense looks to be confused and effortless (Dooleyesque) and special team kickoff coverage shows no discipline, confidence, and diligence (Auburn set a record for God's sake). Butch will have to change some of his coaching staff to get back some credibility and right the ship. This is a new challenge for Butch that is not overcome by simply applying the same "system" and coaching staff as he has in the past. Improvise, adapt, overcome (a la the Marines on this Veteran's Day).
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It's true that our special teams looked much better in earlier games and that lack of effort played a large role in the lack of performance.

At the same time, it's only one game at the end of two very tough road games and the third consecutive game against top ten teams, including no. 1.

And these players learned bad tendencies under Dooley. When bammer lost to La-whoever at homecoming in 2007 I LMAO, but bammer fans blamed it on the old Shula players. They were right, unfortunately.

So what I am saying is that this game...OF COURSE....is completely unacceptable. But Butch has two games to make it right, and with the bye week I am confident he will.

Maybe he could make a staff change or two, but some are already calling for Jancek's head and that's ridiculous. The D is on it's third coordinator in 3 years....going for 4 in 4 would be insane.
 
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#148
#148
muvol said:
Bottom line is that Butch and his coaching staff have lost a lot of credibility, trust, and respect from the Vol fan base these past 2 weeks (especially against Auburn). We looked past his inarticulate communication and lack of X and O acumen (e.g. the zone read high school offense) in favor of what appeared to be football savvy, motivational skills, relationship building with the players, and forthrightness. Not sure now. Defense looks to be confused and effortless (Dooleyesque) and special team kickoff coverage shows no discipline, confidence, and diligence (Auburn set a record for God's sake). Butch will have to change some of his coaching staff to get back some credibility and right the ship. This is a new challenge for Butch that is not overcome by simply applying the same "system" and coaching staff as he has in the past. Improvise, adapt, overcome (a la the Marines on this Veteran's Day).
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He hasn't lost one bit of credibility, trust, or respect from me.
 
#150
#150
K-town Vol Fan said:
Me either. This team lacks talent and depth and have played a brutal schedule. I can't blame them for being beaten down and tired.
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lost credibility..love..respect..hope..

too damn emotional. We have the biggest win in 4 years a few games ago and Butch is winning an nc in 2 years. Get blownout like the talent says we should against faster and better teams and now we aren't sure he's going to make it.
The emotional roller coaster for some folk has to be brutally tiresome.
 
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