Recruiting Football Talk VII

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#1,559
#1,559
….. i think he is probably guilty and where he belongs…..
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I deleted the name because this is not about the speaker, but a bedrock principle in American law.

If one thinks, based on the evidence*, that a criminal defendant is "probably guilty," one has a sworn duty and obligation as juror to find the defendant "not guilty." Not adequately proven guilty. Which is not to make a claim about innocence.

This is because in a criminal case, the government is seeking to deprive a free citizen of his or her life and liberty. If there is one or more doubts, even when there may be many more reasons to be persuaded of guilt, the highest burden of proof has not been met.

The cause of confusion appears to be that in civil cases the standard is merely "a preponderance of evident." There's your "probably." "Most" of the evidence.

This is because civil cases are "only" about money, if I may put it bluntly. The government depriving free citizens of life and liberty (making them "slaves" of the state, in essence) by design calls for even more justification than disputes between free citizens about property, however large the sums.

There is more juror leeway in cases about damages or awards of money than in cases involving death or incarceration.

*As several people have noted, we don't have the evidence before us here.
 
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#1,560
#1,560
Orange. said:
I deleted the name because this is not about the speaker, but a bedrock principle in American law.

If one thinks, based on the evidence*, that a criminal defendant is "probably guilty," one has a sworn duty and obligation as juror to find the defendant "not guilty." Not adequately proven guilty. Which is not to make a claim about innocence.

This is because in a criminal case, the government is seeking to deprive a free citizen of his or her life and liberty. If there is one or more doubts, even when there may be many more reasons to be persuaded of guilt, the highest burden of proof has not been met.

The cause of confusion appears to be that in civil cases the standard is merely "a preponderance of evident." There's your "probably." "Most" of the evidence.

This is because civil cases are "only" about money, if I may put it bluntly. The government depriving free citizens of life and liberty (making them "slaves" of the state, in essence) by design calls for even more justification than disputes between free citizens about property, however large the sums.

There is more juror leeway in cases about damages or awards of money than in cases involving death or incarceration.

*As several people have noted, we don't have the evidence before us here.
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This is such a mindful and important observation

The American justice system is based upon a simple premise, that 10 guilty may go free lest one innocent get convicted

It often seems unfair, but Orange's point is a heavy one: criminal court requires "beyond a doubt" to deprive a citizen of life or liberty

I have served on a jury in a murder case. It is not a light burden to decide whether a man will be in jail for the rest of his living days

Academic point until you are the innocent in the orange jumpsuit paying a lawyer $450 per hour
 
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#1,561
#1,561
bignewt said:
I would like to think I'd have more pressing thoughts than this board.
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I would apologize, if I were you, Newt, and explain that you were making a joke about Weezer's attachment to the board (which seems true to me), but did not mean to impugn his care of and for his mother. It was basically a snark accidentally gone wrong. Weez seems to have some really close friends here from life outside the board. And if he did wish to be wished well by them and the board at large, nothing wrong with that. Not your roll, I know, but that's ok, too. You can continue to snark on. You don't have to be infallible.
 
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#1,570
#1,570
drvenner said:
I haven't drawn a conclusion. The fact is he was convicted and sentenced to 30 years. I choose not to question the verdict based upon one news article.
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Sure ..no one has ever been wrongfully convicted and sentenced to long jail terms in emotional cases.

Edit: I'm still not saying it's wrong...just seems weird. If he really did that, then I hope they stick him in the cell with Bubba the bull queer and he gets corn holed in perpetuity.
 
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#1,573
#1,573
SoilVol said:
Hurricane Lee jumped from a Tropical Storm to Cat 4 in about 30 hours 😬

We sweatin' it over here on the Chesapeake
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If you look at Ventusky, there is another storm brewing for the week after this one that appears it MAY be heading your way as well.

I hope both of them veer off to sea.
 
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