Recruiting Forum Football Talk VI

[Orangeburst]

Invol tee-shirt

 

[MoCo_Vol]

I mean, is it evidence though? Like I get it, the NFL is being sued and the NBA/MLB aren’t.. but that doesn’t mean the discrimination claims in the lawsuit are true. That’s for a jury to decide.

How else can you show evidence in this situation? The NFL has the lowest % of people of color in positions of power of the big 3 leagues mentioned, and it's the only one with an active class action lawsuit against it (to my knowledge) over the issue...

But it's my opinion based on the decades of its existence that the NFL stereotypes positions and most draft data has supported the two I pointed out in regards to the quarterback position (what sparked this discussion to begin with).

 

[Orangeburst]

It is National Grilled Cheese Day! Should be a Fed Holiday IMO.

 

[SweetasSoda]

The gimmick comments are such a cop out.

The system is designed to simply and exploit. Yes it only reads one side of the field on most plays. But that one side of the field is set up to be a complex scheme that creates a mismatch.

The players need to understand it. Leverage and matchups are key. The players need to see it. And they need to execute it.

It’s simple yet complex. And I love it.

Just think how simple yet complex hiding JH behind the line was. Defense was like…I don’t know who is doing what when or where!!! Nevermind, TD.

Not a gimmick. An exploitation.

 

[volbeast33]

How else can you show evidence in this situation? The NFL has the lowest % of people of color in positions of power of the big 3 leagues mentioned, and it's the only one with an active class action lawsuit against it (to my knowledge) over the issue...

But it's my opinion based on the decades of its existence that the NFL stereotypes positions and most draft data has supported the two I pointed out in regards to the quarterback position (what sparked this discussion to begin with).

The NFL has 4 black head coaches and 8 black gms….. MLB has 2 black head coaches 1 black gm and 1 black vice President operation…. NBA has 15 head coaches… 4 director of player personnel and 3 black gms….. in the NBA… the overwhelming majority of coaches are ex players( majority are black) but they still have less black upper management than the NFL.

 

[butchna]

WTF???

Did anyone see this??? Holy Smokes!

University of Indianapolis baseball star throws no-hitter, hits cycle

Has to be the RAREST of rare feats…trumping the unassisted triple play.

 

[volbeast33]

The gimmick comments are such a cop out.

The system is designed to simply and exploit. Yes it only reads one side of the field on most plays. But that one side of the field is set up to be a complex scheme that creates a mismatch.

The players need to understand it. Leverage and matchups are key. The players need to see it. And they need to execute it.

It’s simple yet complex. And I love it.

It is a gimmick offense but I don’t understand why we are so offended by it… it kicks azz which is the point…. We just need some guys to be successful NFL guys to show it’s not just the system.

 

[RikidyBones]

As a Dolphin fan, I was surprised by the firing of Flores at that moment, but honestly, it was the right move. He had no playoff appearances, had a consistent bottom 5 offense in the NFL where he had 3 different OC in 3 years, including one OC he had to bring out of retirement, alienated assistant coaches and players and he almost completely lost the locker room. Players hated playing for the guy by the end of his time there. Does it mean he’s a bad coach all around? No. He is a really, really good defensive mind. Doesn’t mean he didn’t deserve to be fired though. Comparing him to previous Dolphins coaches sans Don Dhula and Jimmy Johnson isn’t exactly an endorsement. We’ve had an embarrassing number of terrible coaches since Jimmy.

Also, do have to note that the Dolphins were taken out of the lawsuit by a Judge and instead sent to arbitration, while other parts of the lawsuit were granted permission to go on by a judge. Doesn’t absolve the Dolphins of any possible wrongdoing in their firing, but does point to the fact that Flores didn’t really have a good legal case for discrimination involved in the firing.

All that to be said, I’m not siding with the NFL here. I think there are legitimate claims in the lawsuit. Just stating the Dolphins had reasonings beyond discrimination to fire the guy, and a judge agreed.

Flores was in over his head on top of trying to argue against the ownership and gm about QB. They picked Tua over Flores is what essentially happened and he acted a fool with it.

 

[jave36]

It is a gimmick offense but I don’t understand why we are so offended by it… it kicks azz which is the point…. We just need some guys to be successful NFL guys to show it’s not just the system.

Gimmick implies it's not sustainable, it relies on trick plays. Exploiting weaknesses in the defense and coverages isn't gimmicky, that's literally the definition of good offense. It's not trickery like a statue of liberty play or a flea flicker, it's just well-executed exploitation of whatever deficiencies the defense has.

 

[MoCo_Vol]

My personal Rushmore of TN performances

Jalin Hyatt 6 catches 207 yards and 5 TDs vs Bama
Travis Stephens 19 carries 226 yards 2 TDs at Florida
Peyton Manning 373 yards 4 TDs in comeback SEC Championship Game vs Auburn
Chuck Webb 294 against Ole Miss OR 250 against Arkansas in Cotton Bowl

Honorable Mentions:
Josh Dobbs 68.2% 413 total yards 5 total TDs 0 INTs vs Missouri
Tyler Bray 82.9% 405 passing yards 5 total TDs 0 INTs vs Cincinnati

A few great games against Vandy as well by different players I left off, cause well...it was Vandy.

 

[RikidyBones]

How else can you show evidence in this situation? The NFL has the lowest % of people of color in positions of power of the big 3 leagues mentioned, and it's the only one with an active class action lawsuit against it (to my knowledge) over the issue...

But it's my opinion based on the decades of its existence that the NFL stereotypes positions and most draft data has supported the two I pointed out in regards to the quarterback position (what sparked this discussion to begin with).

It's ridiculous that there is even a conversation of a % requirement of black people in certain positions.

Unless there is direct evidence on that being a qualifier, it's a bad argument. Flores has so far damaged such a case by suing franchises that hired black/mixed coaches(Miami and Texans)

 

[MoCo_Vol]

The NFL has 4 black head coaches and 8 black gms….. MLB has 2 black head coaches 1 black gm and 1 black vice President operation…. NBA has 15 head coaches… 4 director of player personnel and 3 black gms….. in the NBA… the overwhelming majority of coaches are ex players( majority are black) but they still have less black upper management than the NFL.

I said people of color.

 

[MoCo_Vol]

It's ridiculous that there is even a conversation of a % requirement of black people in certain positions.

Unless there is direct evidence on that being a qualifier, it's a bad argument. Flores has so far damaged such a case by suing franchises that hired black/mixed coaches(Miami and Texans)

I agree with that.

It exists though, if anything you can argue the Rooney Rule isn't helping. It's almost like these owners/teams find unqualified minority candidates to meet the requirement but have no intention of hiring them.

I understand the complaints though. It is odd to see a league with 70%+ being made up of a minority and then the higher level positions don't reflect that. But there's also the very real point that not all players/workers make great coaches/managers.

 

[Rocky_Top_Vol13]

The gimmick comments are such a cop out.

The system is designed to simply and exploit. Yes it only reads one side of the field on most plays. But that one side of the field is set up to be a complex scheme that creates a mismatch.

The players need to understand it. Leverage and matchups are key. The players need to see it. And they need to execute it.

It’s simple yet complex. And I love it.

And to add to this point, its not like the offense gets extra points for knowing what all 11 guys on the defense are doing every play. If my offense is looking at the left side of the D and creates/sees a mismatch and exploits it, it doesn't matter what the guys on the right side of the D are doing. They can keep doing that as my guy is going into the endzone and putting of 6 on the scoreboard.

 

[volinexile17]

If other coaches are whining to get basic long-standing rules changed to stop our offense, it’s not a gimmick. If stopping our offense requires a true gimmick, like faking injury, it’s not a gimmick. It’s just effective.

 

[Big Orange#1]

The NFL has 4 black head coaches and 8 black gms….. MLB has 2 black head coaches 1 black gm and 1 black vice President operation…. NBA has 15 head coaches… 4 director of player personnel and 3 black gms….. in the NBA… the overwhelming majority of coaches are ex players( majority are black) but they still have less black upper management than the NFL.

12.1% of America is black. 4 out of 32 head coaches is right at 12.5%

 

[UTvol1fn]

My personal Rushmore of TN performances

Jalin Hyatt 6 catches 207 yards and 5 TDs vs Bama
Travis Stephens 19 carries 226 yards 2 TDs at Florida
Peyton Manning 373 yards 4 TDs in comeback SEC Championship Game vs Auburn
Chuck Webb 294 against Ole Miss OR 250 against Arkansas in Cotton Bowl

Honorable Mentions:
Josh Dobbs 68.2% 413 total yards 5 total TDs 0 INTs vs Missouri
Tyler Bray 82.9% 405 passing yards 5 total TDs 0 INTs vs Cincinnati

A few great games against Vandy as well by different players I left off, cause well...it was Vandy.

These are some good ones. I'll add one that comes to mind on this topic.

Tee Martin 23/24, 315 yards 4 TDs 0 INTs at South Carolina, also broke a 30 yard rush (37 total rush yards). Pulled after his last drive with 1:14 in the 3rd quarter remaining. A then NCAA record for consecutive completions (23 in a game or 24 total if you count his last completion against Alabama the week prior).

 

[overseasorange2]

12.1% of America is black. 4 out of 32 head coaches is right at 12.5%

18.9% of the U.S. Population is Hispanic/Latino. How many head coaches do we have of that ethnicity? 6?

 

[knoxvol52]

These are some good ones. I'll add one that comes to mind on this topic.

Tee Martin 23/24, 315 yards 4 TDs 0 INTs at South Carolina, also broke a 30 yard rush (37 total rush yards). Pulled after his last drive with 1:14 in the 3rd quarter remaining. A then NCAA record for consecutive completions (23 in a game or 24 total if you count his last completion against Alabama the week prior).

Peerless Price 4 catches for 199 and winning touchdown in 98 National Championship game or the clinching Touchdown either way it was a great performance

 

[InVOLuntary]

Any of you morans car folks? Looking for someone to sort some wiring issues with my mom's '85 El Camino.

My son's an electrical engineer and a car buff. What's going on?

 

[Shadowboxer]

My personal Rushmore of TN performances

Jalin Hyatt 6 catches 207 yards and 5 TDs vs Bama
Travis Stephens 19 carries 226 yards 2 TDs at Florida
Peyton Manning 373 yards 4 TDs in comeback SEC Championship Game vs Auburn
Chuck Webb 294 against Ole Miss OR 250 against Arkansas in Cotton Bowl

Honorable Mentions:
Josh Dobbs 68.2% 413 total yards 5 total TDs 0 INTs vs Missouri
Tyler Bray 82.9% 405 passing yards 5 total TDs 0 INTs vs Cincinnati

A few great games against Vandy as well by different players I left off, cause well...it was Vandy.

I'd add Casey Clausen 2003 versus Alabama in Tuscaloosa - 283 yards 4 TDS

 

[rjd970]

Honest question.............

Is this the greatest single game performance in sports history?
I mean, what else is even close?

It’s hard to beat for game performances.

For athletic exploits, Alex Honnold soloing El Capitan in under 4 hours is probably the greatest human athletic achievement ever.

 

[OrangeShade]

These are some good ones. I'll add one that comes to mind on this topic.

Tee Martin 23/24, 315 yards 4 TDs 0 INTs at South Carolina, also broke a 30 yard rush (37 total rush yards). Pulled after his last drive with 1:14 in the 3rd quarter remaining. A then NCAA record for consecutive completions (23 in a game or 24 total if you count his last completion against Alabama the week prior).

I'll add the Dobb-nail boot at Georgia!

 

[Nash_Vol97]

How else can you show evidence in this situation? The NFL has the lowest % of people of color in positions of power of the big 3 leagues mentioned, and it's the only one with an active class action lawsuit against it (to my knowledge) over the issue...

But it's my opinion based on the decades of its existence that the NFL stereotypes positions and most draft data has supported the two I pointed out in regards to the quarterback position (what sparked this discussion to begin with).

I don’t necessarily disagree about the overall thought of your point, and I do think Flores lawsuit has some validity in parts of it, I just would rather see that process play out before using it as evidence. JMO.

 

[peaygolf]

My personal Rushmore of TN performances

Jalin Hyatt 6 catches 207 yards and 5 TDs vs Bama
Travis Stephens 19 carries 226 yards 2 TDs at Florida
Peyton Manning 373 yards 4 TDs in comeback SEC Championship Game vs Auburn
Chuck Webb 294 against Ole Miss OR 250 against Arkansas in Cotton Bowl

Honorable Mentions:
Josh Dobbs 68.2% 413 total yards 5 total TDs 0 INTs vs Missouri
Tyler Bray 82.9% 405 passing yards 5 total TDs 0 INTs vs Cincinnati

A few great games against Vandy as well by different players I left off, cause well...it was Vandy.

Al Wilson posted 12 tackles and forced a school-record three fumbles in the Vols 20-17 overtime win vs UF in 1998..........