Russia Blocks Kerch Strait

#276
#276
Rasputin_Vol said:
NATO and the US knew what the "Russian sphere" was as early as 1990 and made a promise to not expand into the former Soviet states.

Newly Declassified Documents: Gorbachev Told NATO Wouldn't Move Past East German Border

Russia's got a point: The U.S. broke a NATO promise
Click to expand...
funny cause Russia also agreed to respect Ukraine's borders, which included Crimea. In a real deal, one of paper, and signed. If they can't respect an actual treaty why should we be expected to uphold a "gentlemen's" agreement.
 
#278
#278
LouderVol said:
yeah a coup by Russia.

The "coup" happens, several months later some Ukrainian miners in eastern Ukraine find some abandoned modern Russian (Not USSR) tech/equipment/weapons/soldiers in a mine and start winning. then several months after the once losing but now somehow winning easily Ukrainian miners also staged their coup in Crimea. Kicking out the elected officials in the middle of the night, occupying the government buildings, and then the next day holding a sham election while they "monitored" the polls armed to the teeth with those modern Russian guns they found in the mine.

and that's ignoring Russia's hands in the original coup. Where the official in charge after months and tons of public support for closer ties to the EU does a complete 180 in the middle of the night to side with Russia. Then after a protest goes wrong Russia moves in and secures that Ukrainian official before he can squelch. Russian then uses that sham deal that got the official kicked out to choke Ukraine's economy as much as possible, while leveeing huge penalties against Ukraine because they can't afford the crap deal, especially once those pesky Ukrainian miners somehow magically turn into Russian regulars creating a huge drain on Ukraine's stumbling economy.

Disrupting shipping is just the next step in Russia's book. They want to destabilize Ukraine so they can land grab again.
Click to expand...

Coup by Russia? C’mon man...

Yanukovych chose the RF financial package over the EU(IMF)...paid protesters were sent in to rebel....nazis and thugs...Yanukovych cowered...

Bottom line is the west wanted Sevastopol...it was denied. They got Kiev instead...along with a fractured country that is now in economic shambles...

Russia already has enough land....they’re stretched thin enough without taking on more...
 
#280
#280
Velo Vol said:
The Ukrainian people, through an independence referendum,, the Orange Revolution, and Euromaiden, have declared that actually they don't want to be in the "Russian sphere."
Click to expand...
No one wants to be in the Russian sphere of influence.
 
#281
#281
  • Like
Reactions: marcusluvsvols
#282
#282
05_never_again said:
What did Obama do after Russian-backed rebels in eastern Ukraine blasted that civilian airliner out of the sky and killed 298 people? Nuke Moscow?
Click to expand...


Just got to love the Trumpsters defending his being a Putin stoogie by complaining about Obama, who at the time they said was not tough enough on Russia.
 
#283
#283
lawgator1 said:
Just got to love the Trumpsters defending his being a Putin stoogie by complaining about Obama, who at the time they said was not tough enough on Russia.
Click to expand...
I never said that. Some people defending Trump today might have, but I didn't. I'm not a Trumpster - should be able to tell that from my posts here.

There is no move for the United States or NATO in any of this, no matter if Trump, Obama, or Jeremy Pruitt was President. I can't imagine what the reaction from the left would be today if Russia was involved in something like that again and Trump did nothing (precisely like Obama did). It'd be taken as grounds for impeachment hearings to begin immediately and something totally beyond the pale.
 
#284
#284
One thing to watch for is this weekend with the G20. Russia has moved while there are big international events going on (ex. the Georgian war in 2008 while the Olympics were going on). With all the major world leader in Argentina this weekend may give Putin the time to stir up even more tensions. Not sure what the strength levels are for Russian units sitting on the Ukrainian border but they could launch a three pronged invasions from the Russian border, Belarus, and Transnistria if they wanted too.
 
#285
#285
05_never_again said:
I never said that. Some people defending Trump today might have, but I didn't. I'm not a Trumpster - should be able to tell that from my posts here.

There is no move for the United States or NATO in any of this, no matter if Trump, Obama, or Jeremy Pruitt was President. I can't imagine what the reaction from the left would be today if Russia was involved in something like that again and Trump did nothing (precisely like Obama did). It'd be taken as grounds for impeachment hearings to begin immediately and something totally beyond the pale.
Click to expand...


I'm not even talking "move." Not about taking action.

Let's just start with the simple question of whether Russia acted wrongly. Just that assessment. Nikki Hailey said they did. Europe's spokespeople said they did.

But Trump? Nooooooooo. He has to say its on "both sides."

Dude, he is in the bag for Putin. Its patently obvious. The only question is why. The only benign explanation is that he just likes Putin, thinks highly of him. The more likely explanations are: a) he owes them money; b) they have dirt on him or someone close to him; or c) he is indebted to them for help in the election and he is afraid that if he turns on them they will let that be know.
 
#286
#286
Burhead said:
Did the Russians get this "agreement" in writing? If not who cares? History is written by the winners and the West/NATO won the Cold War.
Click to expand...

You’re right...history is written by the winners. It’s written in a manner to monopolize the narrative against the foe....truth be damned...
 
#287
#287
lawgator1 said:
I'm not even talking "move." Not about taking action.

Let's just start with the simple question of whether Russia acted wrongly. Just that assessment. Nikki Hailey said they did. Europe's spokespeople said they did.

But Trump? Nooooooooo. He has to say its on "both sides."

Dude, he is in the bag for Putin. Its patently obvious. The only question is why. The only benign explanation is that he just likes Putin, thinks highly of him. The more likely explanations are: a) he owes them money; b) they have dirt on him or someone close to him; or c) he is indebted to them for help in the election and he is afraid that if he turns on them they will let that be know.
Click to expand...
Why is he signing off on condemnation and tough talk from Nikki Haley then?

By the way, there are bad actions on both sides on this thing. If you think that NATO didn't play a role in Euromaidan, then you're pretty naive. Chocolate Man (Poroshenko) also has an election coming up. Donald talking about not getting involved in foreign entanglements has been his M.O. from day one. He's incessantly talked about pulling troops from South Korea and Japan or "making them pay." That's got nothing to do with Russia or Putin. It's what he does. He's never thought much of international alliances or deals, except the one that no President is allowed to criticize, the one with the Saudis.

NATO thinks Ukraine is in its sphere of influence, Russia thinks Ukraine is in its sphere of influence, and they are fighting over it. There are two sides. Simple as that. It's so funny how left-wingers become neocons when there's a narrative they can construct out of advocating an interventionist viewpoint.
 
#288
#288
Pacer92 said:
Russia already has enough land....they’re stretched thin enough without taking on more...
Click to expand...

You are right that the Russians don't need more land but they do need to eventually secure a land bridge in order to sustain their occupation of Crimea. From what I've researched Crimea has faced resupply issues in the past and the Kerch bridge can't sustain the load required in order to do that. I'm honestly surprised that they haven't tried to secure one in the past 4 years.



One thing that does worry me and I've seen others mention it since this latest round of tensions started is the lack of Russian social media posts showing troop movements and equipment. In the past we've seen all kinds of videos and pictures but it seems like all that has dried up and became silent in the past couple of weeks. Almost like troops on the border have been ordered by the general staff to be secret or else and for what reason???
 
  • Like
Reactions: NorthDallas40 and davethevol
#289
#289
Pacer92 said:
Coup by Russia? C’mon man...

Yanukovych chose the RF financial package over the EU(IMF)...paid protesters were sent in to rebel....nazis and thugs...Yanukovych cowered...

Bottom line is the west wanted Sevastopol...it was denied. They got Kiev instead...along with a fractured country that is now in economic shambles...

Russia already has enough land....they’re stretched thin enough without taking on more...
Click to expand...
the west doesn't need Sevastopol. we already have other ports on the black sea. Russia needed it.

it amazes me that you can look at the situation, see the only country that has come out ahead, Russia, and believe they are an innocent bystander.
 
#290
#290
Probably should've kept my mouth shut: Russia is conducting a large-scale readiness check of the entire Southern Military District. While these are normal it is a worrying sign given the crisis going on right now and the fact there is a complete blackout of troop movements on social media. Most experts saying these checks are often covers for mobilization of Russian military units. I thin we saw similar events leading up to Crimea and Georgia in 2008.
 
#291
#291
05_never_again said:
Why is he signing off on condemnation and tough talk from Nikki Haley then?

By the way, there are bad actions on both sides on this thing. If you think that NATO didn't play a role in Euromaidan, then you're pretty naive. Chocolate Man (Poroshenko) also has an election coming up. Donald talking about not getting involved in foreign entanglements has been his M.O. from day one. He's incessantly talked about pulling troops from South Korea and Japan or "making them pay." That's got nothing to do with Russia or Putin. It's what he does. He's never thought much of international alliances or deals, except the one that no President is allowed to criticize, the one with the Saudis.

NATO thinks Ukraine is in its sphere of influence, Russia thinks Ukraine is in its sphere of influence, and they are fighting over it. There are two sides. Simple as that. It's so funny how left-wingers become neocons when there's a narrative they can construct out of advocating an interventionist viewpoint.
Click to expand...


Oh, please. He did not "sign off" on what she said. That ship is rudderless, and you know it. Trump's WH is so dysfunctional he probably didn't even realize she is still around, much less oversee what her remarks would be.
 
#293
#293
lawgator1 said:
Oh, please. He did not "sign off" on what she said. That ship is rudderless, and you know it. Trump's WH is so dysfunctional he probably didn't even realize she is still around, much less oversee what her remarks would be.
Click to expand...
She wouldn't be there if he consistently said things that pissed him off, you know, like bash his boy Putin. She is leaving at the end of the year, and remember that was met with some surprise because Haley is supposedly one of the few non-family members around him who he likes.
 
#294
#294
Burhead said:
Probably should've kept my mouth shut: Russia is conducting a large-scale readiness check of the entire Southern Military District. While these are normal it is a worrying sign given the crisis going on right now and the fact there is a complete blackout of troop movements on social media. Most experts saying these checks are often covers for mobilization of Russian military units. I thin we saw similar events leading up to Crimea and Georgia in 2008.
Click to expand...

Winter seems an odd time to ramp up activity, if that's their intention.
 
#296
#296
LouderVol said:
the west doesn't need Sevastopol. we already have other ports on the black sea. Russia needed it.

it amazes me that you can look at the situation, see the only country that has come out ahead, Russia, and believe they are an innocent bystander.
Click to expand...
The West would indeed love to block Sevastopol from Russia as that would remove their primary warm water port that gives them 12 month naval support capability.

Russia couldn’t give two ***** about Crimea or the people of Crimea. Russia desperately cares about the naval facility at Sevastopol and will fight to insure its continued control over it. They will go to war over Sevastopol I believe.
 
  • Like
Reactions: marcusluvsvols and Pacer92
#297
#297
Velo Vol said:
Winter seems an odd time to ramp up activity, if that's their intention.
Click to expand...

Putin could be doing one of three things:

1. These are really just normal, yearly tasks but just fell at the wrong time.
2. Putin is causing a provocation by holding these exercises right after the Ukrainian President says he has reports saying an imminent invasion is coming and hoping Kiev makes a costly miscalculation.
3. Putin is really going to invade and using this as cover to hide the mobilization of Russian troops on the border.

Either way Putin is clearly antagonizing Ukraine with these.
 
#298
#298
I saw a tweet that Putin is at or near a low approval rating. I always wonder how accurate those Russian polls are.
 
#299
#299
Velo Vol said:
I saw a tweet that Putin is at or near a low approval rating. I always wonder how accurate those Russian polls are.
Click to expand...

Didn't do himself any favors with the pension reforms he tried earlier. Always good to stir up a faked foreign "threat" to drive up support.
 
#300
#300
NorthDallas40 said:
The West would indeed love to block Sevastopol from Russia as that would remove their primary warm water port that gives them 12 month naval support capability.

Russia couldn’t give two ***** about Crimea or the people of Crimea. Russia desperately cares about the naval facility at Sevastopol and will fight to insure its continued control over it. They will go to war over Sevastopol I believe.
Click to expand...
agreed. they were in no danger of losing it. either before or after their coup.
 
New posts
You must log in or register to reply here.

VN Store



Back
Top