Should criticism of islam be illegal in the USA?

#76
#76
I too dated a Muslim for a good while. Her family was cooler than mine.

Not hard to believe, especially the second part but then they are probably all cooler than you anyway, even you can't realize that.




Surely your experience isn't the norm......

Last evening I went Christmas shopping and when one clerk (a middle aged lady I thought may have come from Eastern Europe) greeted me I remarked that I detected an accent, where was she from?

She said 'Afghanistan' and I told her than my greatgrandmother was a ________ (the most well known place name in the Afghanistan/Pakistan region) and she inquired about the family and I said I knew little of any of their history since when she married my greatgrandad her family disowned her and never had any more contact with her. (she lived to the ripe old age of 97 and none of her birth family ever had anything at all to do with her as far as I know.)

The lady terminated the conversation at that point and though there were no other shoppers within sight (I thought the crowd of Christmas shoppers was very sparse [so much for obamanomics] for this time of year, a week before Christmas, when normally it's hard to find elbow room, one young clerk [a nice looking young African American who hopes to be on one of those modeling TV shows soon) said she felt lonely, even though everything in her small shop was marked 1/2 price I think we were the only ones who even came in for at least the thirty minutes we were in that area.

Anyway I wished the lady from Afghanistan a "Merry Christmas" at which point she put her boots into high gear in seach of some other shopper.

An elaboration on my Greatgrandmother, one time a long while ago, my uncle was driving a team of mules up the long steep hill to Union Hill and stopped to let the mules blow and get their wind again. Coming down was one of the my greatgrandmother's brothers with his son, a cousin of my uncle and they stopped and chatted for a while.

After each continued their journey my uncle's cousin said to his dad; " you know who that was don't you, that was your sister's son," at which point my greatgrandmother's brother proceeded to curse my family name at the top of his lungs for the next ten miles until they reached their destination, White's Creek.

My greatgrandad's family originally came from the Black Forest of Germany and was a horse breeder who kept four stallions, a draft stud, a carriage stud, a saddle horse stud and a utility stud. 'Utility' was for those poorer people who had what was called a 'one horse farm', having one horse that would serve to pull a buggy to church and so forth, pull the hay wagon or such and serve as a riding horse and plow horse as well.

My ancestor's farm was located at the highest point in Davidsion County, the tallest broadcast tower (WLAC) just north of Nashville is located on his old farm.

He died at a young age, my grandfather was only eight at the time and became the man of the family and sent his younger brother through college. I've always wondered if my greatgrandfather was a victim of an honor killing or did he really die in an accident, at any rate, in over a hundred years, no other member of his church has ever had a longer mourning time.






Curious......who is this General that was relieved due to his remarks about Islam?

Some more elaboration on Boykin who was deputy under-secretary of defence for intelligence.

His greatest violation was probably speaking well of Christianity.

When the first public assault on Boykin began, led by the BBC, NY Slimes, WAPO aka Pravda on the Potomac and other media outlets, at the urging of various islamic special interest groups, General Richard Myers, chair of the US Joint Chiefs of Staff, said it did not look as if Lt Gen Boykin had broken any rules.

(Other than the rule that one must at all times observe the rules of political correctness.)









Your sarcasm is well founded. Today's Muslim terrorists are nowhere near as bad as the crusaders.


I have no idea why some people keep making such irrevelent, inaccurate and silly comments like yours, but they do.





Who was that commander you are talking about? Chuck Swannack was at the 82nd and he didn't get canned until they went to Iraq and he got in a tiff with Rummy. He dealt with Bosnian Muslims during our deployment together in Bosnia and by everything I saw he had few criticisms for anyone but the mugs, thugs and wackos. Dan McNeil was the 18th Abn Corps Cdr and he got his 4th star and moved up to Command Forces Command. Lloyd Austin was commanding the 10th Mountain and he just closed out the mission in Iraq. Dick Cody ended up as the Vice Chief of Staff of the Army. Stanley McChriystal, the JSOC commander got fired when his staff made fun of Uncle Joe to a Rolling Stone reporter. Anyway, those were the major commanders at the time so if you could find the link that would be helpful.

Gen. Boykin, I may have misrepresented his postion, my appologies.


Speaking of Bosnia:

Canadian General Lewis MacKenzie:
"We bombed the wrong side."
Kosovo - We bombed the wrong side

Let's not forget Fuller.

CNN as well as every other media outlet, reported the following in early November:

General John R. Allen, commander of the International Security Assistance Force, said Major Gen. Peter Fuller was relieved of duty, effective immediately, for making "inappropriate public comments."

Fuller, who was helping train and equip Afghan security forces, made less-than-diplomatic comments about the Afghan government and its leaders to a Politico reporter, including claims that some Afghan leaders are "isolated from reality."

Politico quoted Fuller as criticizing Afghan President Hamid Karzai for saying Afghanistan would side with Pakistan against America in war.

"Why don't you just poke me in the eye with a needle?" Fuller said. "You've got to be kidding me. I'm sorry, we just gave you $11.6 billion, and now you're telling me, 'I don't really care'?"

U.S. (politically correct) officials have said Karzai's remarks were misunderstood.
-----------------------------------------

He (Fuller) told Politico he recently told the Afghans: "I said, 'You guys are isolated from reality.' The reality is, the world economy is having some significant hiccups. The U.S. is in this (too). If you're in a very poor country like Afghanistan, you think that America has roads paved in gold; everybody lives in Hollywood. They don't understand the sacrifices that America is making to provide for their security. And I think that's part of my job, to educate 'em."




Regarding churches, there are plenty of churches in the country, many are Russian Orthodox but new ones have been built in recent years. True you won't find too many in the southern part of the country, but you will find some. Yes, there have been instances of Talibs burning down churches and schools, but those are mostly local power struggles rather than major political statements at this point.

Since we helped the islamists take over Kosovo (the heartland of Christian Serbia, over 200 churches (some 700+ years old) and monasteries have been destroyed, even Christian cemeteries had been desecrated with headstones broken or carried off and the moslems going so far as to dig up graves and scatter the bones.

This isn't an uncommon event, as a matter of fact everywhere islam has become predominant they have tried to eradicate any memory of any Christian heritage and unfortunately have been all too successful.

An example in Saudi Arabia:

4th Century Assyrian Church in Saudi Arabia

acesaudi3.jpg


Do you think the government of Afghanistan will protect the rights of Christians in that country or will it be more like Kosovo after we pull out.

Bear in mind what is happeneing to the Christians of Iraq which is rarely if ever reported upon in the American media.




I'll take your suggestion and read the book.

Neato. :)

Be aware that this book became practically inaccessable for nearly 35 years, in the late seventies one researcher looked into the library card catalogs of over 200 american universities and found it listed in only one, the univ of Texas and even then the copy of the book was missing, Quigley said himself that if he had known publishing such information would cause such a flap, he wouldn't have written the book and he was voted by the student body of the prestigious Columbia univ, "most influential professor on campus" for 28 consecutive years.

If you have access to an intelligence library let me recommend reading the top secret codeword documents 'history of WWI from an intelligence perspective and 'history of WWII from an intelligence perspective.' (might not be the exact titles, this from personal memory of a half century ago.)



I generally don't call anyone names.

No point in it unless you are just having fun.

That was directed to the many namecallers on this board, not you in particular.

BTW, thanks for your first hand accounts of what it is like in Afghanistan, I greatly appreciate your input, compared to what some ignoramouses post, your posts are priceless.
 
#77
#77
Surely your experience isn't the norm......

Understatement.

Curious......who is this General that was relieved due to his remarks about Islam?

He has also appeared with Sarah Palin at some tea party rallies.

Who do you think it was who set fire to Palin's home church and why?


Your sarcasm is well founded. Today's Muslim terrorists are nowhere near as bad as the crusaders.

ROFLMAO.gif


I'm laughing because you are actually serious.


You just can't lop all Muslims into the same boat

You can't get them all on the same truck either, no matter how hard you try.

overloaded-truck1.jpg


One can point out though what the teachings of islam are.



Umm what?

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#79
#79
GS, I enjoy your views even if I don't share them to the degree you seem to, however, your posts suffer when they are factually inaccurate.

I see you corrected yourself so I'll just provide a few more details. Boykin was the Joint Staff J2, Deputy Director for Intelligence, while I was the CJ2 of CJTF-76 in Afghanistan. He was involved to a degree with our efforts, but since his responsibilities were to keep the Joint Staff informed of the situation across the globe, we were often a lower priority. This was especially true as they focused heavily on Iraq as it started to go down hill and we were relatively in control of the situation in 2004. Boykin is a strong believer and for that I hold him in high respect. He was also a very capable special forces officer who did a lot of good for this country, most of which will never be declassified. However, he was forced to retire when he wore his uniform and roundly criticized the administration and made public comments that were very political. From day 1 as a new officer we all know you can't do that and he did it fully knowing it would cost him his career. Yes, some of his remarks were anti-Islamic, but I'd heard worse behind closed doors. It was the public nature of the event and the wearing of the uniform that was the problem.
 
#80
#80
I have lived in a Muslim country (Morocco) and have experienced the call to prayer at sunlight. I am a Christian and I can attest that it really was one of the more awe inspiring moments in my life the first time it happened. I lived within an ear shot and it was pretty. Try again.

Been to Iraq twice and felt not one awe inspiring moment when hearing the muslim call to prayer ... guess all the head/hand lopping and such just didn't allow me to feel it. This so called peaceful religion is decieving millions and millions of people worldwide. The best awe inspiring moment I've experienced was when I ask God to forgive me of my sins and He did just that and made me one of His. I have eternal life in heaven since Jesus came into my heart. :good!:
 
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#81
#81
Funny that someone who says they used to be in the Army does not understand the rank structure...

Funny that the same someone likes to pass himself off as intelligent but thinks that today's religious terrorists can hold a candle to the death and destruction brought on by those who killed in the name of god in the past
 
#82
#82
Been to Iraq twice and felt not one awe inspiring moment when hearing the muslim call to prayer ... guess all the head/hand lopping and such just didn't allow me to feel it. This so called peaceful religion is decieving millions and millions of people worldwide. The best awe inspiring moment I've experienced was when I ask God to forgive me of my sins and He did just that and made me one of His. I have eternal life in heaven since Jesus came into my heart. :good!:

It' is a very subjective matter. Was not claiming that everyone has this experience and bare no issue with you that had a different one. The reason I made that post was to show GS that I have been within an earshot, enjoyed the experience and was not threatened or killed. Crazy right? I am happy that you have Jesus in your heart, but I am not sure of the relevancy.
 
#83
#83
It' is a very subjective matter. Was not claiming that everyone has this experience and bare no issue with you that had a different one. The reason I made that post was to show GS that I have been within an earshot, enjoyed the experience and was not threatened or killed. Crazy right? I am happy that you have Jesus in your heart, but I am not sure of the relevancy.

Just throwing it in there free of charge. Something we Christians should be proud of and eager to tell.:good!:
 
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#84
#84
Not hard to believe, especially the second part but then they are probably all cooler than you anyway, even you can't realize that.

Where's that "Attack the post and not the poster" quote you always pull out of your bum? Oh wait, it doesn't suit your purpose right now. Dumbass.

Just so you know, "cool" doesn't have anything to do with wearing tinfoil hats. Go back in your hole, clown.
 
#87
#87
It' is a very subjective matter. Was not claiming that everyone has this experience and bare no issue with you that had a different one. The reason I made that post was to show GS that I have been within an earshot, enjoyed the experience and was not threatened or killed. Crazy right? I am happy that you have Jesus in your heart, but I am not sure of the relevancy.

You were a member of a trained, armed unit were you not?

What about the unarmed civilians who bear the brunt of islamic agression, for instance the chruch in Baghdad that had 50 persons slaughtered during services, do you not think the sound would be a bit different for them and the Copts of Egypt for instance?

You are exactly right it is subjective.




Funny that the same someone likes to pass himself off as intelligent but thinks that today's religious terrorists can hold a candle to the death and destruction brought on by those who killed in the name of god in the past

Just of what exactly do you speak?






Been to Iraq twice and felt not one awe inspiring moment when hearing the muslim call to prayer ... guess all the head/hand lopping and such just didn't allow me to feel it. This so called peaceful religion is decieving millions and millions of people worldwide. The best awe inspiring moment I've experienced was when I ask God to forgive me of my sins and He did just that and made me one of His. I have eternal life in heaven since Jesus came into my heart. :good!:

And we shouldn't allow our fellow citizens to be deceived about islam either, in spite of what is considered to be the politically correct attitude.






GS, I enjoy your views even if I don't share them to the degree you seem to, however, your posts suffer when they are factually inaccurate.

I see you corrected yourself so I'll just provide a few more details. Boykin was the Joint Staff J2, Deputy Director for Intelligence, while I was the CJ2 of CJTF-76 in Afghanistan. He was involved to a degree with our efforts, but since his responsibilities were to keep the Joint Staff informed of the situation across the globe, we were often a lower priority. This was especially true as they focused heavily on Iraq as it started to go down hill and we were relatively in control of the situation in 2004. Boykin is a strong believer and for that I hold him in high respect. He was also a very capable special forces officer who did a lot of good for this country, most of which will never be declassified. However, he was forced to retire when he wore his uniform and roundly criticized the administration and made public comments that were very political. From day 1 as a new officer we all know you can't do that and he did it fully knowing it would cost him his career. Yes, some of his remarks were anti-Islamic, but I'd heard worse behind closed doors. It was the public nature of the event and the wearing of the uniform that was the problem.

Well I'm sorry I misrepresented Boykin's position.

(I did that from memory rather than doing the research, my bad)

My point is still valid though, criticize islam publicly and you are going to be sacked.

We need more men Like Boykin, imo.

I wish more of them would run for political office.




Funny that someone who says they used to be in the Army does not understand the rank structure...

I'll tell you this one last time, maybe this time you will remember, I have never ever said I was in the Army, I am a veteran of the USAF, the Security Service Command to be exact, remember Able Danger?
 
#88
#88
I'll tell you this one last time, maybe this time you will remember, I have never ever said I was in the Army, I am a veteran of the USAF, the Security Service Command to be exact, remember Able Danger?

My bad...but, the USAF Officer Rank structure is exactly the same as the Army; so, you still do not know the rank structure.
 
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#89
#89
My bad...but, the USAF Officer Rank structure is exactly the same as the Army; so, you still do not know the rank structure.

I mustered out in '66, pardon me if I don't remember all that, (which changes occasionally at the top levels, if you havn't noticed yet) and I didn't care all that much about that aspect anyway, after training aspects were over, everywhere I served, the inmates ran the asylum.

I consistently performed three pay grades above my pay level, statistically my AFSC left the military at a rate of 97%. My superiors in rank knew I was one of the best and I didn't take a lot of crap, some got pissed, some would have gone through hell for me but either way or in between screw a bunch of bombastic BS.

When you have a commander in chief such as we have now, it's all just a joke.
 
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#90
#90
I mustered out in '66, pardon me if I don't remember all that, (which changes occasionally at the top levels, if you havn't noticed yet) and I didn't care all that much about that aspect anyway

Can you provide any source which shows that USAF Flag Officer Ranks have changed since the USAF's inception in 1947?
 
#92
#92
Can you provide any source which shows that USAF Flag Officer Ranks have changed since the USAF's inception in 1947?

You silly nitpick, you are the epitome of the 'strain at a gnat, swallow a camel' mentality.

Are they tasked differently by their civilian superiors?

The point is that 'keep your mouth shut about islam,' is now one of those tasks, obviously.
 
#93
#93
You silly nitpick, you are the epitome of the 'strain at a gnat, swallow a camel' mentality.

Are they tasked differently by their civilian superiors?

The point is that 'keep your mouth shut about islam,' is now one of those tasks, obviously.

No. The point is that while in uniform one does not publicly spout off their personal opinions.

One of my Battalion Commanders was LTC Kauzlarich, affectionately referred to as 'Colonel K', had his career derailed when he made statements regarding Pat Tillman's lack of faith. At the time, Kauzlarich was the S3 of the 75th Ranger Regiment. He was an outstanding Soldier and Commander for the Batallion I was in; however, he will never hold another command in the 75th and most likely will never be given a Brigade. The reason is not that the Army is full of atheists; their are a great many Christians in the Army and in the Infantry. The reason is that everyone understands that you cannot represent the Army and make crass statements like that.

Hell, the Joint Chiefs are not even allowed to applaud during the State of the Union Address. They sit composed; they do this because they understand that their role in our government is to serve as instruments for those making policy. They are not to put their own personal opinions regarding any aspect of said policy out to the public. When they do so, they are usually reprimanded.

This might be a reason why Boykin was never promoted from Lieutenant General to General (not demoted to Major General, you buffoon). Of course, he may have never been given a fourth star anyway: there are only eleven four-star Generals currently in the Army and, of those eleven, only three were not products of USMA (Boykin graduated from Va. Tech.)

He had plenty of hurdles that he would have needed to get over: notably, his consistent outbursts against policies and politicians; his role in our actions in Somalia; and, his role in the actions taken by the Federal Government against the Branch-Davidians.

Boykin is far from a martyr for your cause, GS.
 
#94
#94
He had plenty of hurdles that he would have needed to get over: notably, his consistent outbursts against policies and politicians; his role in our actions in Somalia; and, his role in the actions taken by the Federal Government against the Branch-Davidians.

Boykin is far from a martyr for your cause, GS.

"their are a great many Christians in the Army?"

As for Somalia and Waco, Clinton's decisions were dispicable and unworthy of respect.

What you are saying is that politically correct speech trumps the truth and what I am saying is that such thinking is both ignorant and stupid.

Silencing America - The Infidel Task Force

Islamists will not have to fire a shot. They will control our right of free speech by having us censor ourselves. This page will publish every example we can find on the Islamic goal of Silencing Americans Through Fear.
------------------------------------

Why has this come to the forefront now? We have had years and years of anti-Semitic and anti-Christian insults displayed blatantly all over the world. Including the United States. So why is this happening now? Because the OIC and the Islamic world feels it is strong enough to flex its muscles and stretch its arm into the free world. Islam will not tolerate our combined voices alerting the world to their evil and blood thirsty ideology. We can scream insults about Christianity and Judaism all the time, just don't open our mouths against Islam.

Freedom of Speech is guaranteed to American citizens via the US Constitution. Our liberal leaders will join forces with the Islamic machine to curb that freedom all in the name of religious tolerance. Christians and other minorities will continue to be slaughtered in the muslim world, churches will be destroyed, women will be raped and we will be unable to say a word against it.

Take your freedom of speech seriously folks. The US is the only country in the world that has it. And we are on the fringe of losing it!

todaysoutrage.jpg
 
#95
#95
The United States is not even close to being the ONLY country with freedom of speech. Take your blind patriotism and shove it.
 
#96
#96
The United States is not even close to being the ONLY country with freedom of speech. Take your blind patriotism and shove it.

So can you name the countries that have freedom of speech?

Using the Holmes' method of deduction we can start by deducting the 57 OIC states, defaming islam or insulting muhammad can be a capitol offense.

Then we can start deducting the the socialist states.

If you want to get technical you might argue that socialist states do have freedom of speech, after all Lenin said; "You are free to say whatever you wish, you are also free to be executed."

We can eliminate all the countries of the EU because what is called hate speech is outlawed and anything that annoys a muslim is considered hate speech.

So would you care to list all these free speech states you brag about?

The Koran and the Kafir : Islam and the Infidel [the entire book]

DEDICATED
TO THE THREE MILLION UNARMED AND INNOCENT KAFIR MEN, WOMEN AND CHILDREN WHO WERE BRUTALLY MURDERED BY THE MOSLEM ARMY OF PAKISTAN, A DASTARDLY DEED THAT WAS EQUALLED BY A BETRAYAL EPITOMIZED IN THE FREEING OF THE 90,000 RUFFIANS WHO COMMITTED UNLIMITED AND HEINOUS CRIMES AGAINST HUMANITY, AND

TO ALL THOSE WHO HAVE COMMITTED THEMSELVES NEVER TO FORGET.

You wouldn't know the truth if someone shoved it up your butt and gave it a swift kick.

Besides your point is beside the point, it matters not so much if other countries have or have not freedom of speech, it does matter that we should be vigilant to protect our own hard won and not so easy to keep freedom of speech ourselves and should be ever alert and active in protecting that right just like other rights that some would take away through subterfuge or outright deceipt.
 
#97
#97
Criticism of Islam Could Soon be a Crime in America ???

A muslim army officer shouting yalley yakbar murdered 14 people at Ft. Hood and the govt has classified this as workplace violence.
 
#98
#98
You gotta watch out for them there Muslims. They are gonna take over the world!!! AHHHHH!!!!!
 
#99
#99
So can you name the countries that have freedom of speech?

Using the Holmes' method of deduction we can start by deducting the 57 OIC states, defaming islam or insulting muhammad can be a capitol offense.

Then we can start deducting the the socialist states.

If you want to get technical you might argue that socialist states do have freedom of speech, after all Lenin said; "You are free to say whatever you wish, you are also free to be executed."

We can eliminate all the countries of the EU because what is called hate speech is outlawed and anything that annoys a muslim is considered hate speech.

So would you care to list all these free speech states you brag about?

The Koran and the Kafir : Islam and the Infidel [the entire book]



You wouldn't know the truth if someone shoved it up your butt and gave it a swift kick.

Besides your point is beside the point, it matters not so much if other countries have or have not freedom of speech, it does matter that we should be vigilant to protect our own hard won and not so easy to keep freedom of speech ourselves and should be ever alert and active in protecting that right just like other rights that some would take away through subterfuge or outright deceipt.

I'd just like to point out that because Muslims in a country cry when someone defames Islam doesn't mean that that country does not have free speech.
 

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