So, what are you doing on May 21?

[therealUT]

In Mark 13, or Rom. 8 the infected fig tree become symbols of famine caused by the work of satan. Jews believed the Messiah would relieve them of Satans grasp on nature. I believe, and what was explained to me, when you interpret Jesus cursing the fig tree, it's proclaiming He is the one to destroy the devils work and restore creation. Some believe the fig tree represented Israel, who had not bear any fruits. And the death of the tree was a visible prophecy for the fate of Jerusalem for denying the Messiah.

There are a few ways to interpret it, but to say he lost his temper and cursed something... well if that's how you would like to interpret, so be it. Just thought I'd give you something else to think about. Not preaching brother... but I do find it odd that out of all the miracles Jesus performed in the Bible you pick the one that, on the surface, feels like a negative one. So you DO beleive that Jesus cursed a tree, but do you not believe he healed the sick and died on the cross for us?

Maybe you should read those verses again. You have terribly misinterpreted it. It even states in Mark that it was not fig season. A paragraph later Jesus says that everyone should forgive the transgressions of others. Funny, Jesus did not forgive the fig tree...

Another contradiction in a book full of them.
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[MUR73]

Your argument is very common among Christians, and I'll give you the same response I've given anyone else presenting this argument:

Does it matter whether or not we, as atheists, have faith in nothing? Nature is not a deity, and natural laws are not commandments.

I mean, what is the point of arguing an atheist's faith? It seems like a "nana nana boo boo... gotcha" gimmick. I just don't see the significance of an atheist's faith, or lack thereof.

Its a relevant question because it is how one determines ones moral compass. In politics it seems it is fair game to questions ones religious convictions,especially conservative christians, and how that might apply to setting policy. But few seem to highlight Non Conservative Christians influences, See Brack Obama and Black Liberation Theology.
Everyone wants to know where you get your value set from. Is it from the works of man, and if so what man. I ,personally, have little faith in mans righteousness. If you can just brush off the question of your faith/beliefs/influences or lack there of than how do i know what you believe to be wrong and right. You do not get off that easy my friend. You See whether your a Christian , Jew, Muslim or Agnostic you have faith in some thing(s) or idea(s).
So who guides your moral/ethical code. Is it Jesus or Saul Alinksy or ole Mother Nature herself(lol)?

 

[therealUT]

Its a relevant question because it is how one determines ones moral compass. In politics it seems it is fair game to questions ones religious convictions,especially conservative christians, and how that might apply to setting policy. But few seem to highlight Non Conservative Christians influences, See Brack Obama and Black Liberation Theology.
Everyone wants to know where you get your value set from. Is it from the works of man, and if so what man. I ,personally, have little faith in mans righteousness. If you can just brush off the question of your faith/beliefs/influences or lack there of than how do i know what you believe to be wrong and right. You do not get off that easy my friend. You See whether your a Christian , Jew, Muslim or Agnostic you have faith in some thing(s) or idea(s).
So who guides your moral/ethical code. Is it Jesus or Saul Alinksy or ole Mother Nature herself(lol)?

You do know that Christian Moral Philosophy is almost a mirror-image of Platonic Moral Philosophy, yes? Maybe you are aware of other moralists who did not feel the need to rely upon religious doctrines and dogmas in expressing their moral codes: Buddha, Kant, Aquinas (his moral philosophy is basically: always listen to your conscience, even if it errs).

Also, you laugh at the "Ole Mother Nature" moral code. You must have missed any and all philosophical discussions regarding natural law. Feel free to look into it and then feel free to read anything by Stephen Jay Gould regarding higher moral principles in the universe.
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[lawgator1]

Its a relevant question because it is how one determines ones moral compass. In politics it seems it is fair game to questions ones religious convictions,especially conservative christians, and how that might apply to setting policy. But few seem to highlight Non Conservative Christians influences, See Brack Obama and Black Liberation Theology.
Everyone wants to know where you get your value set from. Is it from the works of man, and if so what man. I ,personally, have little faith in mans righteousness. If you can just brush off the question of your faith/beliefs/influences or lack there of than how do i know what you believe to be wrong and right. You do not get off that easy my friend. You See whether your a Christian , Jew, Muslim or Agnostic you have faith in some thing(s) or idea(s).
So who guides your moral/ethical code. Is it Jesus or Saul Alinksy or ole Mother Nature herself(lol)?

I love how conservatives want to portray Obama as either a Muslim or now as part of "Black Liberation Theology," playing the Reverend Wright card, yet again.

 

[VOLatile]

Its a relevant question because it is how one determines ones moral compass. In politics it seems it is fair game to questions ones religious convictions,especially conservative christians, and how that might apply to setting policy. But few seem to highlight Non Conservative Christians influences, See Brack Obama and Black Liberation Theology.
Everyone wants to know where you get your value set from. Is it from the works of man, and if so what man. I ,personally, have little faith in mans righteousness. If you can just brush off the question of your faith/beliefs/influences or lack there of than how do i know what you believe to be wrong and right. You do not get off that easy my friend. You See whether your a Christian , Jew, Muslim or Agnostic you have faith in some thing(s) or idea(s).
So who guides your moral/ethical code. Is it Jesus or Saul Alinksy or ole Mother Nature herself(lol)?

‎"As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice."

 

[therealUT]

‎"As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice."

Is this included in Jesus' "turn the other cheek" statement or in his "if you are not accepted in a town, leave and wipe the dust from your feet" statement?

There is nothing in Jesus' ministry that justifies fighting anything other than tables and fig trees.
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[VOLatile]

Is this included in Jesus' "turn the other cheek" statement or in his "if you are not accepted in a town, leave and wipe the dust from your feet" statement?

There is nothing in Jesus' ministry that justifies fighting anything other than tables and fig trees.
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Google the quote and you should make the connection between Christians and morality. I support your previous statements.

 

[therealUT]

Google the quote and you should make the connection between Christians and morality. I support your previous statements.

Is it from Jesus Camp? That would not surprise me. F'ed up people, great documentary.

Just looked it up: good job, Hitler...
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[VOLatile]

Is it from Jesus Camp? That would not surprise me. F'ed up people, great documentary.

Just looked it up: good job, Hitler...
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That documentary made me cry. Seriously. It was a low point in my life. Especially when that woman was home-schooling her son and asked something along the lines of "what has science ever proven?" I wanted to smash my laptop.

On another note, a friend of mine made up a drinking game for it and I was trashed in 10 minutes the second time I watched it.
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[IPorange]

Intense thread.

 

[sjt18]

I love how conservatives want to portray Obama as either a Muslim or now as part of "Black Liberation Theology," playing the Reverend Wright card, yet again.

Wright unapologetically preaches black liberation theology. Obama sat under his teaching and preaching even calling him an important mentor... until he caught amnesia due to politcal pressure.

I've answered this before.... but the UCC probably wouldn't have a problem with Obama being both due to their extreme ecumenical approach. Muslims would have more of a problem with it than the UCC.

The UCC actually has atheist pastors. Just search "ucc atheist pastor".