stock market was up today...

[1972 Grad]

Yes, cities grow along interstates, and yes, I-40 happens to go to Nashville. But the two are not linked.

I live in West Knoxville and it has nothing to do with being closer to Nashville. I've not been to Nashville in years.

It has nothing to do with you going to Nashville.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Why would it be round? There aren't big cities in every direction.

He's saying the closest city is Knoxville. Nashville is 3+ hours away, so that really isn't "close". Chattanooga really isn't a big city, but it's 90 minutes away nevertheless.

Therefore, growth around Knoxville, all things considered, would be equally spread out in all directions. Obviously, there is a reason why Knoxville grew more in the west than the east. Your argument is that it is in the same direction as the nearest big city. The other side pointed out the geography played a role in the development.

 

[1972 Grad]

He's saying the closest city is Knoxville. Nashville is 3+ hours away, so that really isn't "close". Chattanooga really isn't a big city, but it's 90 minutes away nevertheless.

Therefore, growth around Knoxville, all things considered, would be equally spread out in all directions. Obviously, there is a reason why Knoxville grew more in the west than the east. Your argument is that it is in the same direction as the nearest big city. The other side pointed out the geography played a role in the development.

You are not understanding what I said. I will repeat. Cities and towns primarily develop toward the nearest bigger city That means Knoxville would develop out I-40 west because you go that way toward both Nashville and Chattanooga
A town like Jefferson City or Morristown would develop west toward Knoxville. A town like Greeneville will develop northeast toward Johnson City. A town like Lebanon would develop west toward Nashville. A town like Lenoir City would develop northeast toward Knoxville. Maryville to the north toward Knoxville.

Edit: Check with people that speculate in land.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

You are not understanding what I said. I will repeat. Cities and towns primarily develop toward the nearest bigger city That means Knoxville would develop out I-40 west because you go that way toward both Nashville and Chattanooga
A town like Jefferson City or Morristown would develop west toward Knoxville. A town like Greeneville will develop northeast toward Johnson City. A town like Lebanon would develop west toward Nashville. A town like Lenoir City would develop northeast toward Knoxville. Maryville to the north toward Knoxville.

Edit: Check with people that speculate in land.

I understand what you are saying. I think what is being said is that Nashville is too far away to really influence Knoxville's development west. There may be other reasons for it.

 

[1972 Grad]

I understand what you are saying. I think what is being said is that Nashville is too far away to really influence Knoxville's development west. There may be other reasons for it.

I'm just saying if you look at the history of development of most cities and towns, you will find that this holds true. Sometimes, geographical restraints may preclude it, like a mountain, etc. U.T. used to be west Knoxville when I was there. There was nothing out Kingston Pike past West Town Mall.

 

[Thunder Good-Oil]

Why would it be round? There aren't big cities in every direction.

To be closer to Knoxville.

Why aren't the gravitational pulls of Lexington, Cincinnati, Charlotte, Chattanooga, and Atlanta overpowering Nashville's and making Knoxville rounder?

 

[1972 Grad]

To be closer to Knoxville.

Why aren't the gravitational pulls of Lexington, Cincinnati, Charlotte, Chattanooga, and Atlanta overpowering Nashville's and making Knoxville rounder?

There can only be one nearest bigger city.


"To be closer to Knoxville" is why Morristown and Jefferson City, etc. are headed Knoxville's way.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

There can only be one nearest bigger city.


"To be closer to Knoxville" is why Morristown and Jefferson City, etc. are headed Knoxville's way.

Well, Morristown and Jeff City are short commutes to Knoxville, so it would make sense for them to gravitate towards Knoxville. But Knoxville is so far from Nashville or any other major city that it may not have been as bg of an influence as it would have been for other cities.

I'm not arguing that it doesn't play a role, I just think you may overestimating the impact or influence of Nashville on the Knoxville's growth pattern.

 

[1972 Grad]

Well, Morristown and Jeff City are short commutes to Knoxville, so it would make sense for them to gravitate towards Knoxville. But Knoxville is so far from Nashville or any other major city that it may not have been as bg of an influence as it would have been for other cities.

I'm not arguing that it doesn't play a role, I just think you may overestimating the impact or influence of Nashville on the Knoxville's growth pattern.

I said Nashville/Chattanooga, since they are both out the same direction for a few miles on I-40. Knoxville wasn't going to develop in a major way out toward Corryton or Oneida. Part of it has to do with movement of goods to other markets. Believe what you wish. Fine by me.

 

[Velo Vol]

You are not understanding what I said. I will repeat. Cities and towns primarily develop toward the nearest bigger city That means Knoxville would develop out I-40 west because you go that way toward both Nashville and Chattanooga
A town like Jefferson City or Morristown would develop west toward Knoxville. A town like Greeneville will develop northeast toward Johnson City. A town like Lebanon would develop west toward Nashville. A town like Lenoir City would develop northeast toward Knoxville. Maryville to the north toward Knoxville.

Edit: Check with people that speculate in land.

This is true for places within commuting distance. Hardly anyone is commuting to Nashville.

People live near I-40 use the highway to get around Knoxville. If, in 1950, someone had built a fancy freeway that went to Maynardville, today we'd have a lot more development going in that direction. It has very little to do with a distant destination.

 

[1972 Grad]

This is true for places within commuting distance. Hardly anyone is commuting to Nashville.

People live near I-40 to use the highway to get around Knoxville. If, in 1950, someone had built a fancy freeway that went to Maynardville, today we'd have a lot more development going in that direction. It has very little to do with a distant destination.

Maynardville would have developed toward Knoxville on your proposed road to nowhere. The development along your fancy freeway to Maynardville would probably look like that burgeoning metropolis up I-75 toward Caryville and Rocky Top.

 

[Velo Vol]

Maynardville would have developed toward Knoxville on your proposed road to nowhere. The development along your fancy freeway to Maynardville would probably look like that burgeoning metropolis up I-75 toward Caryville and Rocky Top.

One more: which city does Chattanooga sprawl towards?

 

[Velo Vol]

 

[1972 Grad]

One more: which city does Chattanooga sprawl towards?

That is a tough one, and I think Chatt is about the same distance to Knox, Nash, Atlanta, and maybe Birmingham, but Birm may be a bit further. Complicating things are the Tennessee River that runs through town, the railroad lines (with CSX and Norfolk Southern hauling freight out of there), and the mountains. Chattanooga is between the Appalachian range and Walden's Ridge, which is part of the Cumberland Plateau. I lived on Signal Mountain for a short time, which is part of Walden's Ridge, from what I remember. Missionary Ridge and East Ridge are toward the east side, I think, and Lookout to the south and Signal to the north. I honestly don't know the answer, but without geographical boundaries, I would go with Atlanta.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

That is a tough one, and I think Chatt is about the same distance to Knox, Nash, Atlanta, and maybe Birmingham, but Birm may be a bit further. Complicating things are the Tennessee River that runs through town, the railroad lines (with CSX and Norfolk Southern hauling freight out of there), and the mountains. Chattanooga is between the Appalachian range and Walden's Ridge, which is part of the Cumberland Plateau. I lived on Signal Mountain for a short time, which is part of Walden's Ridge, from what I remember. Missionary Ridge and East Ridge are toward the east side, I think, and Lookout to the south and Signal to the north. I honestly don't know the answer, but without geographical boundaries, I would go with Atlanta.

So geography plays a role?

Also, Chattanooga growth seems to be moving north on Highway 58 and northeast to Ooltewah/Bradley County the last 2 decades. A few people sprinkled in are moving to Georgia, but the income tax may be what limits that.

 

[1972 Grad]

So geography plays a role?

Also, Chattanooga growth seems to be moving north on Highway 58 and northeast to Ooltewah/Bradley County the last 2 decades. A few people sprinkled in are moving to Georgia, but the income tax may be what limits that.

Geography does play a role at times. It could be too big of an obstacle to overcome, depending upon the point in history. I mean you aren't going to find a lot of business or industry locating on top of Lookout or Signal, ever. I would absolutely think that Cleveland and Ooltewah would move toward Chattanooga.

Edit: Also, I haven't been in Chatt other than passing through on the interstate in about 35 years, so north may be all that's left, given the river and mountains and railroads.

 

[Velo Vol]

Geography does play a role at times. It could be too big of an obstacle to overcome, depending upon the point in history. I mean you aren't going to find a lot of business or industry locating on top of Lookout or Signal, ever..

Yes, the river/mountains are a big barrier south of downtown. But if your theory were correct I contend there would be a lot more development along I-75 south of the border.

 

[1972 Grad]

Yes, the river/mountains are a big barrier south of downtown. But if your theory were correct I contend there would be a lot more development along I-75 south of the border.

You have a state line to cross with a different tax structure, too. That affects business location, along with housing.

 

[Velo Vol]

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

You have a state line to cross with a different tax structure, too. That affects business location, along with housing.

Again, you've mentioned another factor that I had brought up that can be a driver to how cities grow. Again, not saying that proximity to larger cities is not a factor in Knoxville's growth, but I don't think it was the leading factor (or maybe even the second leading factor) in Knoxville's particular case.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Boeing-Embraer Deal Collapses

The deal, which was born out of the weakening prospects for smaller plane makers amid the increasing dominance of Boeing and Airbus and the U.S. planemaker’s desire to add engineering resources, was undercut by the sudden collapse of the aerospace industry amid the coronavirus pandemic. Boeing is under pressure to raise cash and slash production, with demand for new planes disappearing, and the agreed-upon price of $4.2 billion was looking increasingly rich with Embraer’s market value tumbling roughly 75% to $1.1 billion.

“$4 billion means much more to Boeing than it did back then,” said Richard Aboulafia, an aerospace analyst with Teal Group.

Boeing will need at least $30 billion in external funding in 2020, according to Moody’s, double the ratings agency’s pre-coronavirus expectations. Boeing already funded about half of that need with a $13.8 billion term-loan draw in February and is weighing whether to apply for aid from the federal government.

Boeing had envisioned putting Embraer engineers to work on its long-planned new middle-market airplane, but new CEO David Calhoun put the project on the back burner after taking over in January with the company in crisis over the prolonged grounding of its bestselling plane, the 737 MAX, following two deadly crashes.

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

Boeing-Embraer Deal Collapses

The deal, which was born out of the weakening prospects for smaller plane makers amid the increasing dominance of Boeing and Airbus and the U.S. planemaker’s desire to add engineering resources, was undercut by the sudden collapse of the aerospace industry amid the coronavirus pandemic. Boeing is under pressure to raise cash and slash production, with demand for new planes disappearing, and the agreed-upon price of $4.2 billion was looking increasingly rich with Embraer’s market value tumbling roughly 75% to $1.1 billion.

“$4 billion means much more to Boeing than it did back then,” said Richard Aboulafia, an aerospace analyst with Teal Group.

Boeing will need at least $30 billion in external funding in 2020, according to Moody’s, double the ratings agency’s pre-coronavirus expectations. Boeing already funded about half of that need with a $13.8 billion term-loan draw in February and is weighing whether to apply for aid from the federal government.

Boeing had envisioned putting Embraer engineers to work on its long-planned new middle-market airplane, but new CEO David Calhoun put the project on the back burner after taking over in January with the company in crisis over the prolonged grounding of its bestselling plane, the 737 MAX, following two deadly crashes.

BA should spin off the commercial aircraft division and file chapter 11. That part of the company is a sh!t show. They can't even buy a good airplane anymore much less build one.

 

[NorthDallas40]

BA should spin off the commercial aircraft division and file chapter 11. That part of the company is a sh!t show. They can't even buy a good airplane anymore much less build one.

I think they’re gonna be forced to do just that at some point. Their commercial aircraft idiocy is hindering their defense business.

 

[Vol737]

I think they’re gonna be forced to do just that at some point. Their commercial aircraft idiocy is hindering their defense business.

Didn't hear a lot about it till after it happened, but Raytheon and United Technologies got together in a merger in the middle of all this market volatility and Covid 19. UTX shed their Carrier and Otis divisions and brought their aerospace and defense to Raytheon, now RTX ticker symbol. New share price was waaay below what both companies had been trading at a few months ago. I decided to take a bite of that apple at around $60. So far, so good. Just surprised it didn't command a higher price between those two companies.

 

[Vol737]

Pays to be a cool customer and follow tried and true approaches to investing:

Vanguard and Fidelity investors didn't flinch as the market tanked