Successful SEC Coaches in their 1st seasons...

[oregonvol]

How about no comparisons are adequate for discussion, since Butch Jones has only been here for 3 games and the results are dependent on such wildly varying circumstances from one case to another that they are basically irrelevant?

Where did I make any conclusions based on the first three games? I haven't offered any conclusions. I merely offered a context by which to evaluate Butch Jones throughout his first season. The only people offering conclusions are the sycophants who have already determined that this year is a throw away year.

 

[oregonvol]

It's been done in this thread and you've dismissed the comments.

Strength of Schedule - not only teams/rankings, but how they finished the season
Roster - both star rankings, as well as how players have developed/contributed
Game Stats - how was the game won?
Attrition - good call, LWS

These are a couple that have been mentioned of many.



This is the type of comment that typifies your "rationale" throughout this thread. The point, which you continue to miss, is not that nobody wants to consider W/L record, but that there are many other factors which must be considered.



You're insulting your own intelligence. You need no help from me. No need to go back to 1910. Just make it a real analysis.

The ridiculous thing about this entire charade is that I (and many others in this thread) agree with your premise that Jones needs to get his $#!% together and prove it on the field.

Do we have the delusional portion of the fanbase who will blindly support a coach? Yes. Is Jones going to get three years here regardless? I'd be shocked if he didn't.

I'll assess, realistically, based on what I see on the field. I genuinely believe that a truly elite coach should be able to pull an upset or two against teams who outmatch his. But I'm not going to look at a W/L record at the outset of a season and make some proclamation that if he doesn't match X coach's record he's a failure. That's incredibly short-sighted, in my opinion.

Where did I make any "proclamation that if he doesn't match X coach's record he's a failure?"

Hmmm...yeah, I don't see it.

I guess your argument would have made sense if I had simply posted the coach's win/loss records in their 1st year and then said "let's evaluate Butch based on that."

But I didn't do that. So either you failed to read my original post or you are being willfully ignorant.

I posted the record of the team they inheirted, as well as significant wins and losses. I didn't even comment on the records, but on the particular wins and losses, so why you have such an issue with me posting the records and why you have decided to construct some straw man argument regarding it, I don't understand.

No one has offered any other tangible stats to compare Butch Jones with coaches who have been successful in the SEC this century. All that has been offered is "you didn't factor this", "you didn't factor that"...we can do that forever. I'm not going to go through and put together a complex algorithm of every factor in the success of each coach just to pacify the naysayers. If you have something concrete that we can use to link Butch Jones to other successful SEC coaches in recent history, then post it, or start your own thread.

If all you can do is object and say that records are invalid and Butch Jones can't be compared to any of these coaches, etc. etc....fine, but it seems to me that when you say that Butch Jones can't be compared to any recent coach that has succeeded in the SEC, what you are ultimately saying is that Butch Jones probably won't succeed in the SEC.

 

[tm3]

oregonvol it is an interesting set of data. thanks for putting it together and posting it.

 

[UTProf]

Ok, then let's be blunt about what is on the roster.

No qb
No rb, at least not of high quality
Children at wr

No d-line
No speed at linebacker
No skills of any kind in the secondary except one guy.

No depth
A loser's mentality
Tradition. How is this a problem? Because people still get ready to play Tennessee. People sleep walk against vandy, miss state or other programs that may be struggling. Tennessee doesn't have that luxury. Tennessee may not get an oppponent's best, but the opponent isn't disinterested

This is particularly true. When Bama wasn't worth 2 pennies I don't think a single opponent said 'meh' and the same goes for just about any school that has a brand name. Opposing fans pretend it's over but come game day both players and fans want to stomp any team that has a tradition comparable to ours and they don't care one bit whether you're at your lowest point.

Like right now, I don't care how bad Driskel or Florida's offense is playing. I want to beat Florida and I doubt honest UF fans care how bad UT's offense is right now. Players and fans want to win against established teams whether they're up or down.

 

[VolenteerSpirit]

Here is a stat for you.
CBJ is 66.6 % win coach at the moment.
But I submit, you are correct... we should fire him now..
...Not the right guy... Gruuuuden ..
...pay 5 mill and the buyout, and get a real coach...
1st loss to any team gets you unemployment @ UT.
That's a nice moto.We should be able to get any coaach we want...that's looking to retire.

Did couch Jones bang your mom or something. Why you mad bro.
UT was never going to beat O.
I cannot stand a "fan" that is so willing to throw their team under the bus.
Given our last half decade history, one would think Vol fans would be more careful to not throw the baby out with the bathwater.
Don't like that one, how aabout let's not cut our nose off to spite our face.
Grow the heck up and get over yourself.
Snap and Clear son, get back on that line, and you hold it.
You give up before the fight is over you always lose.
Is that what you want... to hang on to a losing mentality.
GBO

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

Where in this entire thread did I suggest comparing Butch Jones with coaches in other conferences? In fact, that's exactly what I have argued against. SEC COACHES. THIS CENTURY.

Please actually read my posts before you hurl your 3rd grader insults. Thank you.

The fact is you said "every team plays a tough schedule." Sorry man but that just sunk you.

 

[zidanefan]

Where did I make any "proclamation that if he doesn't match X coach's record he's a failure?"

Hmmm...yeah, I don't see it.

I guess your argument would have made sense if I had simply posted the coach's win/loss records in their 1st year and then said "let's evaluate Butch based on that."

But I didn't do that. So either you failed to read my original post or you are being willfully ignorant.

I posted the record of the team they inheirted, as well as significant wins and losses. I didn't even comment on the records, but on the particular wins and losses, so why you have such an issue with me posting the records and why you have decided to construct some straw man argument regarding it, I don't understand.

No one has offered any other tangible stats to compare Butch Jones with coaches who have been successful in the SEC this century. All that has been offered is "you didn't factor this", "you didn't factor that"...we can do that forever. I'm not going to go through and put together a complex algorithm of every factor in the success of each coach just to pacify the naysayers. If you have something concrete that we can use to link Butch Jones to other successful SEC coaches in recent history, then post it, or start your own thread.

If all you can do is object and say that records are invalid and Butch Jones can't be compared to any of these coaches, etc. etc....fine, but it seems to me that when you say that Butch Jones can't be compared to any recent coach that has succeeded in the SEC, what you are ultimately saying is that Butch Jones probably won't succeed in the SEC.

Stopped reading at "straw man." Enjoy your thread.

 

[oregonvol]

Sorry man

apology accepted


(*see, I can ignore context too)

 

[bamawriter]

meaningless.

Were any hired as the 4th head coach in that program in 6 years? If not, the comparison is meaningless.

Saban was.

 

[knoxvols1]

We are recieving our KARMA for what Fulmer did to Bama causing them probation and all!!

 

[bamawriter]

We are recieving our KARMA for what Fulmer did to Bama causing them probation and all!!

I wouldn't say that. Karma is supposed to return to you what you inflicted on others. Our sanctions didn't hurt us nearly as much as UT's been hurt by self-inflicted derpage.