Sweeping Sexual Assault Suit Filed Against UT

[I40flyer]

First, you are assuming that the police failed to secure the apartment for hours after they notified Jones and made the arrests. That is something that none of us knows, but it's hard to imagine that the police would fail to secure a crime scene until they could get a search warrant to properly investigate. I'd be betting that teammates knew of the arrests before Jones ever got the call, and that the cops realized that teammates would consider cleaning things up given a chance. In fact, failure to secure would be potential grounds for dismissing a case - too much question regarding possibly removed, contaminated, or planted evidence; they don't want that kind of doubt cluttering up a case. Otherwise, why even bother with little niceties like chain of custody. And they aren't dumb enough to think that in this day and age that notifying a coach at any point in the process would go unnoticed - and the motive considered and hashed and rehashed - again and again - and then reviewed and reconsidered - again and again.

Second, you can pretty much bet that the local police will notify military or university or any other similar institution when they make an arrest. I made one of those typical student blunders a long time ago during my years at UT, and I can assure you that by the time I got back to campus there was a message from the Dean of Students waiting for me. I wasn't an athlete, but I can very definitely tell you that I did not have to inform him of my screw up so that he could place me on disciplinary probation. And for the record considering all the Title IX legal representation flap, he sent also sent me to discuss my situation with a lawyer in the College of Law.

IF you are correct when you assert, " I'd be betting that teammates knew of the arrests before Jones ever got the call, and that the cops realized that teammates would consider cleaning things up given a chance"
A few things are wrong, one, if teammates knew of the arrests, they should have called the coach, two, There shouldn't have been a thing to "Clean up". I hope, IF a rape took place, teammates wouldn't have involved themselves in a felony, after the fact, as a favor to their teammates. I hope you don't really believe our team is made up of guys, that given a chance would cover-up a rape, or help a rapist to escape justice, we're better than that.

 

[Kristy*]

I don't get it.

The media files an FOIA for phone records. That happens everyday, everywhere.

The get the records and report what are in the records.

They put together a timeline based on the records.

If it's news worthy which this obviously is, aren't they just doing their job?

I guess I could see had it been editorialized in some way, but it's just a bunch of facts otherwise.

For instance, we had known that Bowles said CBJ called him twice. The records show he called Bowles twice. That's it. No one knows what was said, we may never know.

Because it was editorialized. The Tennessean's article said something to the effect of, "the phone call records seem to support Drae Bowles' story." They are a crap newspaper.

 

[Iam4utalways]

I don't think KPD is trying to let athletes go free. Some of the activities that players have been cited for could have easily been over looked.

 

[vol66]

Because it was editorialized. The Tennessean's article said something to the effect of, "the phone call records seem to support Drae Bowles' story." They are a crap newspaper.

The phone records corroborate a timeline outlined by former UT player Drae Bowles in a sworn declaration submitted as part of a sweeping federal lawsuit brought against UT by eight unnamed women over the university's handling of sexual assaults by athletes, especially football players.

I don't find any fault with that. Bowles said CBJ called once and said what he said and then called later to apologize...so as far as the timeline of events, it does corroborate what Bowles said in terms of the calls.

Butch Jones phone records show calls with Drae Bowles

 

[Iam4utalways]

I don't find any fault with that. Bowles said CBJ called once and said what he said and then called later to apologize...so as far as the timeline of events, it does corroborate what Bowles said in terms of the calls.

Butch Jones phone records show calls with Drae Bowles

Is that from the boycott paper?

 

[CWGvol]

I'm not being defensive, I simply don't give a crap if people have differences with the procedures of the KPD. Seems responsible and aboveboard to me. People that b!tch about it were going to find something anyway.

Exactly.... If it had been the opposite and Butch had called no one after being notified, not Bowles, not the players, etc. Then they would say that THAT is evidence of how he/the school just don't care about these things and create an environment of assault. "He didn't even call anyone even after the police contacted him!" Lol... The tennessean has a clear agenda.

 

[vol66]

Is that from the boycott paper?

Obviously, as that was what Kristy's post was about...'cept instead of "something like" it's the actual quote from the paper...which you know...doesn't say what is inferred.

 

[CWGvol]

The part of this that has the appearance of preferential treatment for us not wearing orange colored classes is would any other case involving a non athlete see the police contact someone connected to the accused before their residence was searched?

IMO the answer is no

A non-athlete isn't high profile so it's different and you know it. The coach has to deal with high profile situations, Title IX, media, etc. This the way it is handled everywhere, as it should be. It's best that the coach hear the actual facts of what's happening right now, rather than being blind sided and having to say they don't know for sure what's happening or go on what they heard from so and so.... Has nothing to do with orange glasses. It's called big time sports. I know you're probably just looking for a new horse to beat to death but if you think the way we handled it and the way Florida State did, then I don't know what to tell you. I do know there is no way you believe half the drivel you post.

 

[CWGvol]

I don't get it.

The media files an FOIA for phone records. That happens everyday, everywhere.

The get the records and report what are in the records.

They put together a timeline based on the records.

If it's news worthy which this obviously is, aren't they just doing their job?

I guess I could see had it been editorialized in some way, but it's just a bunch of facts otherwise.

For instance, we had known that Bowles said CBJ called him twice. The records show he called Bowles twice. That's it. No one knows what was said, we may never know.

It was "editorialized in some way"... Did you see how the tennessean reported it compared to others like KNS? They just reported what was released. While the tennessean added accusation and insinuation after accusation and insinuation. Just like they have with the other evidence, they paint the picture that they want to. They have said nothing of the plantiffs not cooperating with evidence, phones, social media, still hanging out with the players, etc. Anything that might suggest innocence or doubt is left out. While taking everything and assuming the worst about every move by the players, Butch, KPD, and the university. Didn't think there was anybody who would be defending them.

 

[CWGvol]

This is not true with the proper nondisclosure provisions and incentives. You can make lawsuits go away without the public knowing much. I'm not saying that is what UT should have or shouldn't have done. I'm just saying Clymer is wrong as usual.

What is he wrong about? You don't know what relationship he is talking about? The plantiffs attorneys know exactly who to contact to get this stuff out and slanted against UT, and that's exactly what has been happening. No coincidence that the tennessean is first break all this "news".

 

[vol66]

It was "editorialized in some way"... Did you see how the tennessean reported it compared to others like KNS? They just reported what was released. While the tennessean added accusation and insinuation after accusation and insinuation. Just like they have with the other evidence, they paint the picture that they want to. They have said nothing of the plantiffs not cooperating with evidence, phones, social media, still hanging out with the players, etc. Anything that might suggest innocence or doubt is left out. While taking everything and assuming the worst about every move by the players, Butch, KPD, and the university. Didn't think there was anybody who would be defending them.

I just read it. I don't see it, if you'd like to quote some parts you think are editorialized and discuss it, but I've apparently gone over my free reads and no longer have access.

Fans of UNC basketball felt like the local paper was attacking them...FSU...Syracuse basketball...I will give the Southern Miss fans credit, they wished they'd never hired Tyndall.

 

[Kristy*]

Obviously, as that was what Kristy's post was about...'cept instead of "something like" it's the actual quote from the paper...which you know...doesn't say what is inferred.

No need to be snarky. I don't read the Tennessean. I read other articles that referred back to them. I didn't know their exact quote. This was the quote I read, "One thing the records do, per the Tennesseean, is line up with the timeline given by former player Drae Bowles, who said Jones called him a traitor and later said he was beaten up by fellow players for helping the woman." Which seems to imply that it supports all of Bowles' claims. The article could have simply given the timeline. It's not like Jones said he didn't talk to Bowles.

 

[vol66]

No need to be snarky. I don't read the Tennessean. I read other articles that referred back to them. I didn't know their exact quote. This was the quote I read, "One thing the records do, per the Tennesseean, is line up with the timeline given by former player Drae Bowles, who said Jones called him a traitor and later said he was beaten up by fellow players for helping the woman." Which seems to imply that it supports all of Bowles' claims. The article could have simply given the timeline. It's not like Jones said he didn't talk to Bowles.

I don't do snarky. Sorry if it came across that way.

I don't know where your getting your quote, but the traitor part is not from the Tennessean and I don't even have a problem with that because that's what BOWLES said...they, whoever it may be, are reporting what we all know he said.

 

[Iam4utalways]

I don't do snarky. Sorry if it came across that way.

I don't know where your getting your quote, but the traitor part is not from the Tennessean and I don't even have a problem with that because that's what BOWLES said...they, whoever it may be, are reporting what we all know he said.

How do we even know he really said that?

 

[vol66]

How do we even know he really said that?

He made a sworn declaration that is part of the lawsuit...this was contrary to all the rumors that he'd actually testified to a grand jury...

Bowles confirmed in an email to The Tennessean that he did not testify.

So, in that instance the Tennessean actually dismisses a rumor via e-mail to Bowles.

 

[volfan102455]

I don't do snarky. Sorry if it came across that way.

I don't know where your getting your quote, but the traitor part is not from the Tennessean and I don't even have a problem with that because that's what BOWLES said...they, whoever it may be, are reporting what we all know he said.

The entire intent of the article that the Tennessean wrote was to align the the statements by Bowles to the phone log and reiterate those statements. If you can't see that, then you must have blinders on.

 

[vol66]

The entire intent of the article that the Tennessean wrote was to align the the statements by Bowles to the phone log and reiterate those statements. If you can't see that, then you must have blinders on.

The KNS did exactly the same thing, so did ESPN...I actually thought ESPN obtained the phone records first but I admit I'm not sure...yet.

 

[Iam4utalways]

He made a sworn declaration that is part of the lawsuit...this was contrary to all the rumors that he'd actually testified to a grand jury...



So, in that instance the Tennessean actually dismisses a rumor via e-mail to Bowles.

They probably coerced him to sign. Or it's a forgery.

 

[vol66]

They probably coerced him to sign. Or it's a forgery.

OK...but hey...a whole lotta barking up the wrong tree anyway.

The only way CBJ gets in any trouble at all is if they can prove he said what Bowles said he said or that he tried to interfere with the SCHOOL's investigation...which no one thinks he did.

That's really not what this lawsuit is about.

At all.

 

[Iam4utalways]

OK...but hey...a whole lotta barking up the wrong tree anyway.

The only way CBJ gets in any trouble at all is if they can prove he said what Bowles said he said or that he tried to interfere with the SCHOOL's investigation...which no one thinks he did.

That's really not what this lawsuit is about.

At all.

Calling a person a traitor for helping a rape victim, creates a rape culture.

Calling a person a traitor for lying to the police, is a whole different story.

 

[vol66]

Calling a person a traitor for helping a rape victim, creates a rape culture.

Calling a person a traitor for lying to the police, is a whole different story.

As I said, if Butch said that, he has a problem. If he didn't he doesn't.

The school still has lots and lots of problems.

 

[Iam4utalways]

As I said, if Butch said that, he has a problem. If he didn't he doesn't.

The school still has lots and lots of problems.

As most other schools. Creating a rape culture to benefit the athletic dept. is a ridiculous allegation.

I have no idea who did what to whom. But I'm sure that UT, The City of Knoxville, Knox County, or any Law Enforcement Agency servicing that community is creating a rape culture.

I do think this is going to be long and drawn out affair.

I hope they all get what they deserve.

 

[vol66]

As most other schools. Creating a rape culture to benefit the athletic dept. is a ridiculous allegation.

I have no idea who did what to whom. But I'm sure that UT, The City of Knoxville, Knox County, or any Law Enforcement Agency servicing that community is creating a rape culture.

I do think this is going to be long and drawn out affair.

I hope they all get what they deserve.

Interesting. The lawsuit doesn't make any claims against the City of Knoxville, the County or Law Enforcement.

The only defendant in this case is UT and the Director of The Office of Student Conduct and Community Standards.

I think that last part has been amended...but I think it means Vincent Carilli, though I could be wrong about that.

 

[Iam4utalways]

Interesting. The lawsuit doesn't make any claims against the City of Knoxville, the County or Law Enforcement.

The only defendant in this case is UT and the Director of The Office of Student Conduct and Community Standards.

I think that last part has been amended...but I think it means Vincent Carilli, though I could be wrong about that.

If Law Enforcement Officials are calling the HC at UT to cover up a rape, the are part of the corrupt system in place.

Since no Law Enforcement Official called Butch Jones to initiate a cover up, no allegations can be proven since the allegations being made are ridiculous. Mistakes were made, by whom, is still to be revealed.

 

[vol66]

If Law Enforcement Officials are calling the HC at UT to cover up a rape, the are part of the corrupt system in place.

Since no Law Enforcement Official called Butch Jones to initiate a cover up, no allegations can be proven since the allegations being made are ridiculous. Mistakes were made, by whom, is still to be revealed.

No one involved in the lawsuit is alleging someone from law enforcement called Jones to give him a heads up for the purpose of a cover up...at least not yet.


This lawsuit has literally nothing to do with whether Jones suspended a football player from the team as people here keep suggesting.

This lawsuit, and all the ones around the country, are about how the alleged victims are treated based on the policies in place.

These are policies put in place by The University of Tennessee to protect alleged victims, should they come forward, in compliance with Title IX.

Did they follow their own policy?

For instance...The NCAA requires a school to have a drug testing policy and follow the policy. Syracuse did not follow their policy and they suffered a penalty...not much of one because they are in the Final Four...but we're dealing with a federal court, not the NCAA here.