Tebow defends Meyer in Miami game

[chavisut]

I saw one comment by hat on this, agreeing with those of us that think it is silly. I haven't seen him around in this thread ot comment on it.

um, ok?

 

[jakez4ut]

FYP. I know that's what you meant. No big.

haha.....thanks......but no.:hi:

I agree. Unfortunately that's not how it works but I know you know that.

that being the case, why worry about what someone that knows nothing about football thinks? that opinion is useless in this debate.

winning is what makes the machine go. if Holtz had failed there, like he didi with the Jets, he's likely to never had been heard from again.

likewise, had Spurrier lost at FL, who would care.

they both won. but the difference is Spurrier changed the game. Holtz just held serve at a place that had all the resourcess necessary.

so, BPV, to your point, you are exaclty right. to the non fan that knows nothing, holtz is the legend cause at least they've seen him on ESPN.

to everyone else that's watched more than one college football game......which is who i'd care about in regards to this discussion.........it's Spurrier, and it's, again, not that close.

 

[jakez4ut]

Oh but for Jake he is!

no, not really. Spurrier to me will be the standard bearer for my generation of SEC football. he dominated the conf. in the 90's. so much so, that i don't know that anyone will ever repeat the 6 in 10.

Meyer is simply a continuation. he got to FL in a lot better shape than Spurrier did, Spurrier built it. Meyer gets to drive it.

 

[lawgator1]

Tradition's all you need when your history is as rich as Notre Dame's. No program in the country has more legendary coaches, players, heisman trophy winners, championship team, etc. It's still the biggest job in college football.

Sure, the apple's lost a bit of its shine...but Meyer could have them in the top 10 in no time.

now, that i agree with. he could make the difference there. his track record speaks for itself and would do well in luring kids to South Bend.

but let's be clear, while i agree that Meyer could probably turn ND back in to a contender, it's the notion that he'd leave FL and consider it a step up that i think is wrong. FL is a top dog right now. for all intents and purposes, ND would still be a bit of a project for him.

and that's the reason it's not a step up. he's got FL right where he wants 'em. and it would take him longer at ND than it did at FL.

I am not so sure about that in part because it would seem that ND's academic and frankly behavioral standards for incoming players is a bit loftier than UF's. I'm not saying they don't look the other way when it suits them, but we Florida fans have had to swallow our sense of decorum more than a few times in the last three years at some of what Meyer has allowed.

 

[VOLinthaNATI]

haha.....thanks......but no.:hi:
that being the case, why worry about what someone that knows nothing about football thinks? that opinion is useless in this debate.

winning is what makes the machine go. if Holtz had failed there, like he didi with the Jets, he's likely to never had been heard from again.

likewise, had Spurrier lost at FL, who would care.

they both won. but the difference is Spurrier changed the game. Holtz just held serve at a place that had all the resourcess necessary.

so, BPV, to your point, you are exaclty right. to the non fan that knows nothing, holtz is the legend cause at least they've seen him on ESPN.

to everyone else that's watched more than one college football game......which is who i'd care about in regards to this discussion.........it's Spurrier, and it's, again, not that close.

I do not disagree with anything you wrote. I still believe as a program Notre Dame would be a step up. Can Florida get there? Absolutely. But will Meyer be around long enough to get credit for it? That remains to be seen.

 

[VOLinthaNATI]

no, not really. Spurrier to me will be the standard bearer for my generation of SEC football. he dominated the conf. in the 90's. so much so, that i don't know that anyone will ever repeat the 6 in 10.

Meyer is simply a continuation. he got to FL in a lot better shape than Spurrier did, Spurrier built it. Meyer gets to drive it.

I was joking eace2:

 

[jakez4ut]

i know......i just can't help myself. it's a flaw.

 

[Vercingetorix]

now, that i agree with. he could make the difference there. his track record speaks for itself and would do well in luring kids to South Bend.

but let's be clear, while i agree that Meyer could probably turn ND back in to a contender, it's the notion that he'd leave FL and consider it a step up that i think is wrong. FL is a top dog right now. for all intents and purposes, ND would still be a bit of a project for him.

and that's the reason it's not a step up. he's got FL right where he wants 'em. and it would take him longer at ND than it did at FL.

Coaches leave great situations to take over rebuilding projects all the time, typically at their alma maters. Meyer didn't actually go to school at Notre Dame, but the identification that midwestern Catholics have with Notre Dame may be even stronger than that. It's sort of nauseating, really. (I have several Catholic friends from Ohio and Indiana, so I have to listen to it on a fairly regular basis.)

I wouldn't do it either. No way. But I can see why Urban Meyer might.

 

[Vercingetorix]

And as far as Meyer vs Spurrier goes, clearly Meyer will never come close to winning six SEC titles in ten years. But as Tennessee fans know, the SEC is a different place now. Spurrier benefited from having Pat Dye and Ray Goff around as much as Fulmer did.

 

[jakez4ut]

oh, i understand it too. the tradition etc....is what it is.

i just don't agree with it. it's not as premier a job as FL right now. it could be again. but it's not right now.

 

[VOLinthaNATI]

oh, i understand it too. the tradition etc....is what it is.

i just don't agree with it. it's not as premier a job as FL right now. it could be again. but it's not right now.

I am still not sold on your point of view. For a team that went 3-8 last year they recieved tons of coverage. No other 3-8 team even got 5% of what they did.

 

[Vercingetorix]

oh, i understand it too. the tradition etc....is what it is.

i just don't agree with it. it's not as premier a job as FL right now. it could be again. but it's not right now.

Of course not. No freaking way I'd leave there to go to Indiana either. But surely you can see why a midwestern Catholic guy might see the allure of being the savior who sweeps in and restores it to being that premier kind of job again?

Right now Meyer is driving Steve Spurrier's limousine. He's driving it expertly, of course, but it's still a program that somebody else built. Coaches have a way of getting kinda bored, looking for the next challenge, etc. If Meyer wins another national title at UF and the Domers still suck in a few years, it wouldn't shock me to see it happen.

 

[jakez4ut]

I am still not sold on your point of view. For a team that went 3-8 last year they recieved tons of coverage. No other 3-8 team even got 5% of what they did.

well, to your point, they are Notre Dame. them going 3-9 is as news worthy as them going 11-1.

and that stems from the fact that all the things you have said are true.....they are tradition rich and hav ea big following and national TV contract etc......

none of that is what i'm debating.

i'm saying that a team, with the kind of recurits Weiss has hauled, that goes 3-9 is not in as good a shape as a program that went 9-4, just off a national title and has a heisman trophy winning qb coming back wiht a boatload of talent and is currently ranked in the top 5.

i don't think that should be in debate right now either. looking at the two situations, there's just no way you can tell me that heading to ND, RIGHT NOW, is a step up from Florida.

it's just not.

 

[BigPapaVol]

Of course not. No freaking way I'd leave there to go to Indiana either. But surely you can see why a midwestern Catholic guy might see the allure of being the savior who sweeps in and restores it to being that premier kind of job again?

Right now Meyer is driving Steve Spurrier's limousine. He's driving it expertly, of course, but it's still a program that somebody else built. Coaches have a way of getting kinda bored, looking for the next challenge, etc. If Meyer wins another national title at UF and the Domers still suck in a few years, it wouldn't shock me to see it happen.

Meyer's a good coach, but aside from the NC season where he needed more luck and some politicking to get to the title game, he hasn't been fantastic on the field.

His crowd lost 4 ballgames last season with better talent than everyone that beat them, save LSU.

 

[jakez4ut]

Of course not. No freaking way I'd leave there to go to Indiana either. But surely you can see why a midwestern Catholic guy might see the allure of being the savior who sweeps in and restores it to being that premier kind of job again?

Right now Meyer is driving Steve Spurrier's limousine. He's driving it expertly, of course, but it's still a program that somebody else built. Coaches have a way of getting kinda bored, looking for the next challenge, etc. If Meyer wins another national title at UF and the Domers still suck in a few years, it wouldn't shock me to see it happen.

it's not really being debated whether or not he could or couldn't resurect ND. he could. and if that, persoanlly, is what he aspires to do, then good for him. but that's what it would be, a personal choice, not because it's a better career move. that's all i'm saying.

 

[buckeyevol23]

I am still not sold on your point of view. For a team that went 3-8 last year they recieved tons of coverage. No other 3-8 team even got 5% of what they did.

True. They also have the NBC contract and make BCS bowls over teams with equal or better records. The big advantage that Florida had when Meyer was hired was the talent already in place and easier recruiting grounds. Weis has been upgrading the talent though he's yet to do anything with it.

 

[jakez4ut]

Meyer's a good coach, but aside from the NC season where he needed more luck and some politicking to get to the title game, he hasn't been fantastic on the field.

His crowd lost 4 ballgames last season with better talent than everyone that beat them, save LSU.

i'll say this much....it's still early, granted, but as time goes on, you can't keep recruiting like he is and go 9-4 on a regular basis.

i'm not ready to throw the book at him yet, cause the SEC has been ridiculous the last few years.....but i know 9-4 is below expectations with the talent he's got down there.

 

[VOLinthaNATI]

i'll say this much....it's still early, granted, but as time goes on, you can't keep recruiting like he is and go 9-4 on a regular basis.

i'm not ready to throw the book at him yet, cause the SEC has been ridiculous the last few years.....but i know 9-4 is below expectations with the talent he's got down there.

Yes you can. You can do worse. Look at Charlie Weis.

 

[BigPapaVol]

i'll say this much....it's still early, granted, but as time goes on, you can't keep recruiting like he is and go 9-4 on a regular basis.

i'm not ready to throw the book at him yet, cause the SEC has been ridiculous the last few years.....but i know 9-4 is below expectations with the talent he's got down there.

I think the jury's still out a bit. He can clearly coach, but I don't think he's the next Spurrier. In fact, if he doesn't get something done pretty quickly with that talent, Saban's gonna start dropping the hammer on him regularly.

 

[jakez4ut]

True. They also have the NBC contract and make BCS bowls over teams with equal or better records. The big advantage that Florida had when Meyer was hired was the talent already in place and easier recruiting grounds. Weis has been upgrading the talent though he's yet to do anything with it.

The NBC deal is nice and all, but it's only for home games.

make no mistake, the deal the SEC signed with ESPN is a big deal. and Florida as one of , if not the, premier team in the SEC will get more exposure on ABC/ESPN than even ND will on NBC.

thnk about it.....ND on NBC is a but a cog in the machine. ESPN and ABC on the other hand has every show devoted to promoting it's air time.

the TV deal is at best a wash, from an exposrue standpoint.

 

[jakez4ut]

Yes you can. You can do worse. Look at Charlie Weis.

toche......

 

[jakez4ut]

I think the jury's still out a bit. He can clearly coach, but I don't think he's the next Spurrier. In fact, if he doesn't get something done pretty quickly with that talent, Saban's gonna start dropping the hammer on him regularly.

Me neither, contrary to popular belief apparently......

 

[VOLinthaNATI]

I thought the NBC contract was exclusive and was for all Notre Dame regular season games?

EDIT - I was misinformed. Only home games as Jake said.

 

[jakez4ut]

just home games. away games will fall under whatever contract obligations of the home team....ie when they played TN in 04 in Knoxville, that game was on CBS....when they play Michigan in Ann Arbor, it's on ABC etc.....

 

[VOLinthaNATI]

Beat ya with an edit by a minute