Tennis Vols back in NCAAs

#204
#204
It's too bad that we have better information flowing out of Pakistan than we do coming from the NCAA tennis tournament in California.

Took me forever to find the score of the Johnson/Shabaz match yesterday. Even the websites of USC and UVA had no mention of the score/result.

Finally found it on zootennis.com in a tweet posting.

And didn't learn the full magnitude of what Shabaz had done until I just followed your link above.

Sounds like Shabaz was getting ripped on line calls and just walked off. Johnson sort of acknowledged the same by saying the calls were close. If the King of the Douches conceded that much, you know Shabaz was probably getting ripped. Shabaz will forever regret walking off from that match.
 
#213
#213
Props to Rhyne on a great year and great tournament. In the first set it looked like Johnson had simply run into a superior player. But then I think Rhyne was a little gassed from the previous match and it started to become readily apparent.
 
#214
#214
kidbourbon said:
Props to Rhyne on a great year and great tournament. In the first set it looked like Johnson had simply run into a superior player. But then I think Rhyne was a little gassed from the previous match and it started to become readily apparent.
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yeah, his serves were plain awful in the final 2 sets, although hard to make excuses for a 20 year old, esp when Johnson went straight from team championships to individual tourney.... Rhyne is the best player in NCAA in my opinion, stinks that he couldn't pull it out. Not sure if it makes sense for him to return for another season though.
 
#215
#215
VolsDeep said:
yeah, his serves were plain awful in the final 2 sets, although hard to make excuses for a 20 year old, esp when Johnson went straight from team championships to individual tourney.... Rhyne is the best player in NCAA in my opinion, stinks that he couldn't pull it out. Not sure if it makes sense for him to return for another season though.
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I'm not sure it makes sense for him to come back either. If fitness is his biggest obstacle at this point -- and that appears to be the case -- then he should go pro.

The only thing I've seen from Rhyne was by way of the live video streams of the matches from this tournament. Obviously not the best quality, but enough to make general observations. And here is what I gathered about Rhyne:
Generally: He is a bit of a streak player. This isn't what you want, but the stuff he shows when he is on his game is pro material stuff.
1) His forehand is an absolute thing of beauty. It reminds of Marcelo Rios'* forehand b/c of the whiplash nature of it. The result is different than with Rios, though, because Williams is a much bigger guy. What I"m saying is that while Rios' forehand was merely pretty, Williams' forehand is a damn cannon.
2) His backhand is fine. He runs around it more than he should, and sometimes he gets burned. He needs to trust his backhand a bit more, because it is a solid stroke. Not an absolute weapon like his forehand, but it wouldn't be a liability on the tour.
3) His first serve percentage is way too low right now. But when he increases it, he'll rarely get broken, even at the pro level.

The one aspect of his game that could use some work is his net game.** I believe he is aware of this, and is, as a result, very reluctant to come into the net and finish points when he's put his opponent in a really bad position. This is true of a lot of young players, though, and he'll just need to work on moving forward and closing points. Nadal improved in this regard with time,*** and so it can definitely be done.


*One of my favorite players of all time, btw.
**Sandgren, on the other hand, has an impressive net game.
***A guy like Gael Monfils, on the other hand, apparently never worked on this aspect of the game and undermines his excellent groundstrokes by rarely if ever coming and and getting easy putaways. I'm a baseliner myself, so I understand the reluctance, but a pro player should have this in their bag of tricks.
 
#217
#217
karmazone said:
So, if Rhyne leaves does Tennys leave as well?
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No, I don't think they're a package deal. And I don't think Tennys is ready. He had a great tournament, but he also got a really lucky draw. I'm not knocking his abilities, but if you just look at the numbers historically (more recent history...the college landscape has changed since back when Johnny Mac won it all as a freshmen at stanford), there might be three maybe four college guys in any given year that end up having even respectable pro careers.

And I don't think Tennys is quite there yet. He's close and he's improving, but not quite there yet. I think Tennys definitely stays.
 
#218
#218
kidbourbon said:
No, I don't think they're a package deal. And I don't think Tennys is ready. He had a great tournament, but he also got a really lucky draw. I'm not knocking his abilities, but if you just look at the numbers historically (more recent history...the college landscape has changed since back when Johnny Mac won it all as a freshmen at stanford), there might be three maybe four college guys in any given year that end up having even respectable pro careers.

And I don't think Tennys is quite there yet. He's close and he's improving, but not quite there yet. I think Tennys definitely stays.
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Some friends and myself were discussing past NCAA champs in the pros. I went and looked and the only one that made a dent would have to be Mikael Pernfors in the early 80s. Seems kind of odd, but I guess the top guys have no need for the college game.
 
#219
#219
beergood said:
Some friends and myself were discussing past NCAA champs in the pros. I went and looked and the only one that made a dent would have to be Mikael Pernfors in the early 80s. Seems kind of odd, but I guess the top guys have no need for the college game.
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Give Chris Woodruff a little credit. He won a couple events on tour and was ranked in the top ten at one point. And he had a lot of very solid wins against great players.

Benjamin Becker retired Andre Agassi. I think he won an ATP event as well.

Isner, who was runner-up, has acquited himself nicely.

Jeff Morrison made a splash at wimbledon one year, making it to the quarters, I think...but then never sustained it.

So, mostly you're right :)
 
#220
#220
Also, James Blake was runner up to Jeff Morrison. I personally think James Blake is an absolute scrub, but he was ranked as high at #4 in the world at one point*, so he deserves mention.

*During the soft post-sampras years before Federer came on the scene. This was a horrid horrid 2-3 year era where Lleyton Hewitt was one of the best in the game, and where Andy Roddick actually won a major.
 
#221
#221
kidbourbon said:
Give Chris Woodruff a little credit. He won a couple events on tour and was ranked in the top ten at one point. And he had a lot of very solid wins against great players.

Benjamin Becker retired Andre Agassi. I think he won an ATP event as well.

Isner, who was runner-up, has acquited himself nicely.

Jeff Morrison made a splash at wimbledon one year, making it to the quarters, I think...but then never sustained it.

So, mostly you're right :)
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Woodruff, while a great player, was never ranked in the top 10. The ATP says his career high was 29.

Becker's highest ranking was 38. He retired Agassi, but to be realistic, Agassi wasn't going to make the quarters of that US Open, regardless of who he was going to play. He was too busted up.

Blake has had a great career. Never made a serious run at a major, but won several high level tournaments and a boat load of cash.

Isner and Querry? I'll get back to you if they crack the top 10.

Roddick and Fish? No college. They were good enough to go get paid at age 17 or 18.

So yeah, I am mostly right.:)
 
#222
#222
beergood said:
Woodruff, while a great player, was never ranked in the top 10. The ATP says his career high was 29.

Becker's highest ranking was 38. He retired Agassi, but to be realistic, Agassi wasn't going to make the quarters of that US Open, regardless of who he was going to play. He was too busted up.

Blake has had a great career. Never made a serious run at a major, but won several high level tournaments and a boat load of cash.

Isner and Querry? I'll get back to you if they crack the top 10.

Roddick and Fish? No college. They were good enough to go get paid at age 17 or 18.

So yeah, I am mostly right.:)
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eh, I think you need to broaden your scope in defining a "great career." I would say anything in the top 50 qualifies. Querrey will be solid, and Isner has probably 4-5 more years where he could make a run. Also, I'm pretty sure Querrey never went to college either.

Also, you must have forgotten the US Open semifinals between Blake and Agassi. I say making the semis of the US Open and going 5 sets qualifies as making a serious run.

Finally, KidBourbon, I think you defined Rhyne's game perfectly. The one thing that seems to have followed him throughout his career is mental toughness. I think this was a big issue when he was in juniors, but he seems to be working through this (although, at times he seemed to go away from his backhand and rely on the slice too much).... I also doubt Tennys goes pro. He will benefit greatly having another year of college and getting to play #1 or #2. He got lucky in not having to play Alex Domijian in the 2nd round of the tourney, for sure.
 
#223
#223
VolsDeep said:
eh, I think you need to broaden your scope in defining a "great career." I would say anything in the top 50 qualifies. Querrey will be solid, and Isner has probably 4-5 more years where he could make a run. Also, I'm pretty sure Querrey never went to college either.

Also, you must have forgotten the US Open semifinals between Blake and Agassi. I say making the semis of the US Open and going 5 sets qualifies as making a serious run.
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I would agree that top 50 is most certainly "solid". Not ground breaking by any stretch, but certainly nothing to scoff at. I was merely wondering out loud why NCAA champs generally dont make the top 10 or make the finals of a Grand Slam tourney like Pernfors did. I mean, its only been 20 years. Surely there is some legitimate top 5 talent coming through college. Right?

Also, I'm positive Blake never played in a semifinal at any Slam. Quarters is a good run though.
 
#224
#224
beergood said:
I would agree that top 50 is most certainly "solid". Not ground breaking by any stretch, but certainly nothing to scoff at. I was merely wondering out loud why NCAA champs generally dont make the top 10 or make the finals of a Grand Slam tourney like Pernfors did. I mean, its only been 20 years. Surely there is some legitimate top 5 talent coming through college. Right?

Also, I'm positive Blake never played in a semifinal at any Slam. Quarters is a good run though.
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ah, you're right, it was a QF match. Did Agassi play Ginepri or someone in the Semis that year? I swear I remember Agassi saying something like, "well, at least we know an american will be playing in the Finals of the US Open." I thought it was before his match with Blake, but clearly not.

Anyways, I hear what you're saying. And certainly, the best of the best skip college altogether, but the Bryan Brothers have won plenty of grand slams and both of them played college (Bob Bryan won the singles championship, doubles championship, and team championship in 98 I believe)... Also, the # of players that EVER win a grandslam is pretty small, esp the past decade with Federer and Nadal dominating. The early 2000s was really the only window, prior to when Federer began his run.

Looking forward, I don't see any current college players having the chance to win a grand slam, at least not in singles. I'm still convinced that JP Smith has a chance to have a good career in doubles, and while Rhyne has a chance to be a top US player and maybe make the Davis Cup team, he is already behind players like Denis Kudla, Jack Sock, and Donald Young (although I think he possesses as much potential).
 
#225
#225
VolsDeep said:
ah, you're right, it was a QF match. Did Agassi play Ginepri or someone in the Semis that year? I swear I remember Agassi saying something like, "well, at least we know an american will be playing in the Finals of the US Open." I thought it was before his match with Blake, but clearly not.

Anyways, I hear what you're saying. And certainly, the best of the best skip college altogether, but the Bryan Brothers have won plenty of grand slams and both of them played college (Bob Bryan won the singles championship, doubles championship, and team championship in 98 I believe)... Also, the # of players that EVER win a grandslam is pretty small, esp the past decade with Federer and Nadal dominating. The early 2000s was really the only window, prior to when Federer began his run.

Looking forward, I don't see any current college players having the chance to win a grand slam, at least not in singles. I'm still convinced that JP Smith has a chance to have a good career in doubles, and while Rhyne has a chance to be a top US player and maybe make the Davis Cup team, he is already behind players like Denis Kudla, Jack Sock, and Donald Young (although I think he possesses as much potential).
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I think the name Donald Young should be left out of every conversation such as this. Dude is obviously not going to make it. I would bet money on Rhyne over him in a 7 game series any old day of the week.
 
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