The (many) indictments of Donald Trump

[BowlBrother85]

The main point of the recording is likely to show his state of mind related to the documents they can prove he did possess.

We'll see, but I disagree with that. Jack Smith seems to have emphasized this aspect of the case too much, for it not to eventually lead to its own charge.

 

[RockyTop85]

We'll see, but I disagree with that. Jack Smith seems to have emphasized this aspect of the case too much, for it not to eventually lead to its own charge.

He emphasized it because it’s great evidence of an element of 32 of the offenses he has charged (willfulness). They haven’t located the document which they would need for a conviction, seemingly haven’t convened a grand jury in Jersey where this charge would have to be litigated, and haven’t even searched Bedminster; there’s nothing at this point to suggest that they’re even pursuing that particular episode to charge it.

One of the reasons they didn’t charge Hillary Clinton with something similar is because she said “I didn’t know you couldn’t do this, former secretaries of state told me you could/should” and she made sure everything was consistent with that. So any culpability element was going to be difficult or impossible to prove. This is the polar opposite.

 

[Gandalf]

He emphasized it because it’s great evidence of an element of 32 of the offenses he has charged (willfulness). They haven’t located the document which they would need for a conviction, seemingly haven’t convened a grand jury in Jersey where this charge would have to be litigated, and haven’t even searched Bedminster; there’s nothing at this point to suggest that they’re even pursuing that particular episode to charge it.

One of the reasons they didn’t charge Hillary Clinton with something similar is because she said “I didn’t know you couldn’t do this, former secretaries of state told me you could/should” and she made sure everything was consistent with that. So any culpability element was going to be difficult or impossible to prove. This is the polar opposite.

Exactly, Hillary KNEW she was doing something shady so she made sure every comment sounded pure as snow so it was hard to charge her even though they had plenty of evidence. Trump's statements are atrocious not just about this but about most things, so how do you really know what he was describing? And yet, they don't have the physical evidence. Complete opposite situation.

The other major difference though, is that Trump was President, Hillary was not. Trump could decide any document is personal, no matter what the classification and that's that. The fact that he had them in hand and transferred before he was out of office, pretty much says he thought they were personal - and it really doesnt matter what anyone else thinks or even if the proper papers reflecting that were filled out in triplicate.

Typically, ex-presidents go through them all and decide later to send a few back to the archives that they figure they dont want to keep. Most eventually make it into their Presidential library. Trump was in such a rush because he didnt think he was leaving so I doubt he sorted much before he left.

Point is Presidents can do that - NOBODY else can, including Vice Presidents (or Secretaries of State)

 

[RockyTop85]

Exactly, Hillary KNEW she was doing something shady so she made sure every comment sounded pure as snow so it was hard to charge her even though they had plenty of evidence. Trump's statements are atrocious not just about this but about most things, so how do you really know what he was describing? And yet, they don't have the physical evidence. Complete opposite situation.

The other major difference though, is that Trump was President, Hillary was not. Trump could decide any document is personal, no matter what the classification and that's that. The fact that he had them in hand and transferred before he was out of office, pretty much says he thought they were personal - and it really doesnt matter what anyone else thinks or even if the proper papers reflecting that were filled out in triplicate.

Typically, ex-presidents go through them all and decide later to send a few back to the archives that they figure they dont want to keep. Most eventually make it into their Presidential library. Trump was in such a rush because he didnt think he was leaving so I doubt he sorted much before he left.

Point is Presidents can do that - NOBODY else can, including Vice Presidents (or Secretaries of State)

Good luck with all that. Hope it gets litigated.

 

[Septic]

Oh, my God ...

The proof is in how closely page 6 of the memoir and the audio recording align with each other. During the audio recording from July of 2021, Trump was speaking to a room of people who were working on the Meadows memoir. The content of what he said on the recording ends up being published almost verbatim in the memoir. Both the book and the memoir state that Trump was given those documents by the Department of Defense.

... and Trump says himself that those documents have not been declassified. All of his publicly stated defenses are contradicted by reading the memoir and then listening to the recording in conjunction with each other.

So ... you are dead wrong. I have had to repeat this like 10 times now.

The cognitive dissonance is dizzying. Ask them to "prove" hunter is a crackhead, it could have been tobacco in that pipe.

Trump says it's secret, say's it's war plans from Dumb Milley, say's he could have declassed it, but can't now and they still argue it wasn't secret, it wasn't war plans and he can do whatever he likes. Imagine if the shoe were on the other foot? They'd be frothing.

 

[Septic]

Point is Presidents can do that - NOBODY else can, including Vice Presidents (or Secretaries of State)

It's unfortunate that he didn't declass war plans, indeed. He could have done it, too bad he didn't - all this could have been avoided.

 

[whodeycin85]

The cognitive dissonance is dizzying. Ask them to "prove" hunter is a crackhead, it could have been tobacco in that pipe.

Trump says it's secret, say's it's war plans from Dumb Milley, say's he could have declassed it, but can't now and they still argue it wasn't secret, it wasn't war plans and he can do whatever he likes. Imagine if the shoe were on the other foot? They'd be frothing.

Didnt Trump say he was referencing the article??? When you consider with his ego and love of bravado.. And the fact the document in question wasn't in the the stuff siezed or the charges. Add all that up and this was just an attempt to sway public opinion of a potential juror.

 

[Septic]

Didnt Trump say he was referencing the article??? When you consider with his ego and love of bravado.. And the fact the document in question wasn't in the the stuff siezed or the charges. Add all that up and this was just an attempt to sway public opinion of a potential juror.

No.

"Well, with Milley — uh, let me see that, I'll show you an example. He said that I wanted to attack Iran. Isn't that amazing?” the transcript said. “I have a big pile of papers, this thing just came up. Look. This was him. They presented me this — this is off the record, but — they presented me this. This was him. This was the Defense Department and him.

“We looked at some. This was him. This wasn't done by me, this was him. All sorts of stuff — pages long, look. Wait a minute, let’s see here. I just found, isn’t that amazing? This totally wins my case, you know. Except it is, like, highly confidential. Secret. This is secret information. Look, look at this. This was done by the military and given to me.”

How you can listen to Dumb Donny say this out loud and whistle past the graveyard is simply willful ignorance. Just own it dude, the malignant narcissist real estate agent who grifted his way into the presidency and has lied through his veneers from the outset - got caught with size 48 pants around his ankles.

Acceptance is the first step to recovery.

 

[lostsheep]

No.

"Well, with Milley — uh, let me see that, I'll show you an example. He said that I wanted to attack Iran. Isn't that amazing?” the transcript said. “I have a big pile of papers, this thing just came up. Look. This was him. They presented me this — this is off the record, but — they presented me this. This was him. This was the Defense Department and him.

“We looked at some. This was him. This wasn't done by me, this was him. All sorts of stuff — pages long, look. Wait a minute, let’s see here. I just found, isn’t that amazing? This totally wins my case, you know. Except it is, like, highly confidential. Secret. This is secret information. Look, look at this. This was done by the military and given to me.”

How you can listen to Dumb Donny say this out loud and whistle past the graveyard is simply willful ignorance. Just own it dude, the malignant narcissist real estate agent who grifted his way into the presidency and has lied through his veneers from the outset - got caught with size 48 pants around his ankles.

Acceptance is the first step to recovery.

A lot of these morons would have supported Hitler as he "made Germany great again!!" The concentration camps were "fake news" and the resistance from other German citizens was related to their "wokeness."

 

[RockyTop85]

No.

"Well, with Milley — uh, let me see that, I'll show you an example. He said that I wanted to attack Iran. Isn't that amazing?” the transcript said. “I have a big pile of papers, this thing just came up. Look. This was him. They presented me this — this is off the record, but — they presented me this. This was him. This was the Defense Department and him.

“We looked at some. This was him. This wasn't done by me, this was him. All sorts of stuff — pages long, look. Wait a minute, let’s see here. I just found, isn’t that amazing? This totally wins my case, you know. Except it is, like, highly confidential. Secret. This is secret information. Look, look at this. This was done by the military and given to me.”

How you can listen to Dumb Donny say this out loud and whistle past the graveyard is simply willful ignorance. Just own it dude, the malignant narcissist real estate agent who grifted his way into the presidency and has lied through his veneers from the outset - got caught with size 48 pants around his ankles.

Acceptance is the first step to recovery.

Now prove the military didn’t write a magazine or plan for a new golf course.

 

[whodeycin85]

No.

"Well, with Milley — uh, let me see that, I'll show you an example. He said that I wanted to attack Iran. Isn't that amazing?” the transcript said. “I have a big pile of papers, this thing just came up. Look. This was him. They presented me this — this is off the record, but — they presented me this. This was him. This was the Defense Department and him.

“We looked at some. This was him. This wasn't done by me, this was him. All sorts of stuff — pages long, look. Wait a minute, let’s see here. I just found, isn’t that amazing? This totally wins my case, you know. Except it is, like, highly confidential. Secret. This is secret information. Look, look at this. This was done by the military and given to me.”

How you can listen to Dumb Donny say this out loud and whistle past the graveyard is simply willful ignorance. Just own it dude, the malignant narcissist real estate agent who grifted his way into the presidency and has lied through his veneers from the outset - got caught with size 48 pants around his ankles.

Acceptance is the first step to recovery.

Trump is all those things..a complete POS.. But after 6 years of fake dossiers, hit pieces, full out attack with nothing proven... I'll given him the benefit of the doubt.. Oh yeah. Where's the document again??
From cbs

Trump lawyers told DOJ they couldn't find classified doc discussed in audio
One person said it was not clear if the document exists, or if Trump was misidentifying something to the group assembled during the recording.

 

[whodeycin85]

Now prove the military didn’t write a magazine or plan for a new golf course.

Now prove he was holding that document... Even the people who recorded it can't verify it.

 

[RockyTop85]

Now prove he was holding that document... Even the people who recorded it can't verify it.

Good luck with that. Hope it gets litigated.

 

[Septic]

Trump is all those things..a complete POS.. But after 6 years of fake dossiers, hit pieces, full out attack with nothing proven... I'll given him the benefit of the doubt.. Oh yeah. Where's the document again??
From cbs

Trump lawyers told DOJ they couldn't find classified doc discussed in audio
One person said it was not clear if the document exists, or if Trump was misidentifying something to the group assembled during the recording.

Non sequitur.

I think it's a great question, WHERE is it? He admitted to having it and stated three times "Look at this" "this is secret, highly confidential"

Donny had it - but it still hasn't been turned over?

I don't think this is the flex you seem to think it is.

You're denying reality. Donny admitted it and you still won't accept it.

I get it though, nothing anyone says (including donny) will change your mind. But still, it's amusing to watch you dance around the absolute reality of it.

 

[whodeycin85]

Non sequitur.

I think it's a great question, WHERE is it? He admitted to having it and stated three times "Look at this" "this is secret, highly confidential"

Donny had it - but it still hasn't been turned over?

I don't think this is the flex you seem to think it is.

You're denying reality. Donny admitted it and you still won't accept it.

I get it though, nothing anyone says (including donny) will change your mind. But still, it's amusing to watch you dance around the absolute reality of it.

I love the way your type pick and choose when Trump is lying to appease you obsession of getting him..lol. So basically the most grifting lieing POS in history of presidents is now telling the truth leaked audio tape with no proof of the document, and the fact the the person recordng can't even verify it...the hoops y'all jump thru.
.if Trump is found guilty (I'll accept it). If he found innocent (you won't accept it). And I'm the one not accepting things. Lol

 

[ClearwaterVol]

Exactly, Hillary KNEW she was doing something shady so she made sure every comment sounded pure as snow so it was hard to charge her even though they had plenty of evidence. Trump's statements are atrocious not just about this but about most things, so how do you really know what he was describing? And yet, they don't have the physical evidence. Complete opposite situation.

The other major difference though, is that Trump was President, Hillary was not. Trump could decide any document is personal, no matter what the classification and that's that. The fact that he had them in hand and transferred before he was out of office, pretty much says he thought they were personal - and it really doesnt matter what anyone else thinks or even if the proper papers reflecting that were filled out in triplicate.

Typically, ex-presidents go through them all and decide later to send a few back to the archives that they figure they dont want to keep. Most eventually make it into their Presidential library. Trump was in such a rush because he didnt think he was leaving so I doubt he sorted much before he left.

Point is Presidents can do that - NOBODY else can, including Vice Presidents (or Secretaries of State)

You don't get any information outside of what the Trump propaganda machine gives you.

 

[whodeycin85]

Good luck with that. Hope it gets litigated.

This point won't get litigated so far..so the whole point of the leak is to sway the jury pool

 

[RockyTop85]

This point won't get litigated so far..so the whole point of the leak is to sway the jury pool

Disagree.

A. Jury will almost certainly hear that audio in trial if it comes to trial. His attorney is going to have to come up with something to mitigate the damage that does to him.

B. How does it sway the jury pool if it doesn’t prove anything?

 

[Septic]

I love the way your type pick and choose when Trump is lying to appease you obsession of getting him..lol. So basically the most grifting lieing POS in history of presidents is now telling the truth leaked audio tape with no proof of the document, and the fact the the person recordng can't even verify it...the hoops y'all jump thru.
.if Trump is found guilty (I'll accept it). If he found innocent (you won't accept it). And I'm the one not accepting things. Lol

Yor denial is noted.

 

[whodeycin85]

Disagree.

A. Jury will almost certainly hear that audio in trial if it comes to trial. His attorney is going to have to come up with something to mitigate the damage that does to him.

B. How does it sway the jury pool if it doesn’t prove anything?

A. I think it'll get tossed at trial due to referencing a document that isn't involved..imo
B. Because if it gets tossed the leaked audio. In combo with MSM push will make it look bad...and it sounds bad but without collaborating proof in reality mean nothing....kinda like a murder without a weapon or body

 

[Septic]

This point won't get litigated so far..so the whole point of the leak is to sway the jury pool

The transcript was literally in the indictment.

While you guys desperately try to convince yourself that Trump had the "right" to declass war plans after he was no longer POTUS. You haven't stopped to think about the fact that he was showing war plans to a reporter with no clearance.

Trump is a giant POS and doesn't have the temperament to sit on a HOA board let alone have unfettered access to nuclear codes.

 

[hog88]

Disagree.

A. Jury will almost certainly hear that audio in trial if it comes to trial. His attorney is going to have to come up with something to mitigate the damage that does to him.

B. How does it sway the jury pool if it doesn’t prove anything?

Would that recording be admissible without the document in question in evidence or him being charged with being in possession of the document?

 

[Septic]

A. I think it'll get tossed at trial due to referencing a document that isn't involved..imo
B. Because if it gets tossed the leaked audio. In combo with MSM push will make it look bad...and it sounds bad but without collaborating proof in reality mean nothing....kinda like a murder without a weapon or body

If you're right, only 36 more criminal indictments to get tossed.

 

[whodeycin85]

The transcript was literally in the indictment.

While you guys desperately try to convince yourself that Trump had the "right" to declass war plans after he was no longer POTUS. You haven't stopped to think about the fact that he was showing war plans to a reporter with no clearance.

Trump is a giant POS and doesn't have the temperament to sit on a HOA board let alone have unfettered access to nuclear codes.

They can't put whatever in the indictment doesn't mean it'll hold in court... the phrase you can indict a ham sandwich should tell you all the proof that's needed...again if he is exonerated are you gonna walk back all the BS your spewing or you still gonna believe every damning piece that comes out about him??

 

[Septic]

Would that recording be admissible without the document in question in evidence or him being charged with being in possession of the document?

Again, that begs a much bigger question. Where is it?

Everybody in the room saw it. trump admitted to what it was.

Given Donny's propensity to obfuscate, scheme, hide and lie about the possession of classified documents - it's plausible to believe the war plan document he admitted to having is still being hidden.

Hell, if I were him - i definitely wouldn't want that seeing the light of day.